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Spouse Schengen visa denied

Immigration to European countries, don't post UK or Ireland related topics!

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charmender
Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:33 am
Ireland

Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by charmender » Tue Apr 05, 2016 12:08 pm

Hi all,

Unfortunately my husbands schengen visa was denied by Malta. They marked one box on the reasons for refusal but this one reason has many parts to it and I have no idea how to go about appealing this. It is so frustrating.
Just to give the details, I am an Irish citizen and I want to go to Malta with my husband who is a non EU spouse. He was rejected a visa by Ireland a few months ago and I am pretty sure this is the reason Malta is rejecting him. They embassy called last week and one of the questions they asked is why he was refused a visa to Ireland so this is why I have this suspicion. Anyway I called the embassy and received the most rudest comments. All I wanted to know was if there are more details on the reason that I can find somewhere and the woman kept shouting that the embassy is not obliged to give any information. So I came here to see if any of you could help for the appeal since it just seems impossible at times to get any help.

The reason is:

You have not provided proof of sufficient means of subsistence, for the duration of the intended stay or for the return to the country of origin or residence, or for the transit to a third country, or is not in a position to acquire such means lawfully.

As I said I am pretty sure this all because of Ireland since financial things are irrelevant when applying as the spouse of an EU citizen. Where do we go from here?

noajthan
Moderator
Posts: 14911
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 11:31 am
Location: UK

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by noajthan » Tue Apr 05, 2016 12:45 pm

charmender wrote:Hi all,

Unfortunately my husbands schengen visa was denied by Malta. They marked one box on the reasons for refusal but this one reason has many parts to it and I have no idea how to go about appealing this. It is so frustrating.
Just to give the details, I am an Irish citizen and I want to go to Malta with my husband who is a non EU spouse. He was rejected a visa by Ireland a few months ago and I am pretty sure this is the reason Malta is rejecting him. They embassy called last week and one of the questions they asked is why he was refused a visa to Ireland so this is why I have this suspicion. Anyway I called the embassy and received the most rudest comments. All I wanted to know was if there are more details on the reason that I can find somewhere and the woman kept shouting that the embassy is not obliged to give any information. So I came here to see if any of you could help for the appeal since it just seems impossible at times to get any help.

The reason is:

You have not provided proof of sufficient means of subsistence, for the duration of the intended stay or for the return to the country of origin or residence, or for the transit to a third country, or is not in a position to acquire such means lawfully.

As I said I am pretty sure this all because of Ireland since financial things are irrelevant when applying as the spouse of an EU citizen. Where do we go from here?
Puzzling.

Did you apply for a visitor visa or on basis of treaty rights?
You seem to have received a refusal on the basis of being a visitor.

If refused for security or policy reasons (which, as per my understanding, would be quite an extreme step) you would surely have to be notified in writing about those grounds.
contact the European Commission’s free Solvit service if you have any problems or are required to provide these things. If they can not help, you can easily make a complaint directly to the European Commission.

In the unlikely event visa application is rejected, there must be a detailed explanation given about the reasons for the rejection, and there is an clear appeal process that you will be told about. The only four grounds for rejecting a visa application are:

public health (i.e. a serious contagious disease)
national security
(big) public policy
the marriage was done solely for getting the visa

They can not reject an application because you did not provide, e.g., a bank statement or hotel reservations.
See https://eumovement.wordpress.com/2007/0 ... u-citizen/
All that is gold does not glitter; Not all those who wander are lost. E&OE.

charmender
Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:33 am
Ireland

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by charmender » Tue Apr 05, 2016 3:46 pm

Hi,

He applied for a schengen visa using the normal schengen application form which they told us to use. For the type of visa he ticked other and we wrote beside it (spouse of EU citizen).

We submitted our passports, marriage cert and health insurance. We also had to pay a service fee since it was done through VFS global (the consulate wouldn't deal with it directly). Anyway VFS global were helpful and made it clear what I needed and were aware that he did not need to provide financial details etc.

And yes as you said about being refused for security or policy reasons that is also listed on the the form but it is not ticked. They show all the possible reasons for refusal but the one I mentioned was the only one ticked. And as far as I know from my reading and the link you posted they can only refuse for 4 reasons (none of which they included in this denial).

What do you think I should do now? I have contacted solvit but sure it could take them a few days to reply. Is it best when dealing with the appeal to clearly outline our rights under the directive? They called him last week and asked him why he wanted to go and he explained he would travel with me as I wanted to go there to work so surely they are just making this difficult and awkward for us.

noajthan
Moderator
Posts: 14911
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2014 11:31 am
Location: UK

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by noajthan » Tue Apr 05, 2016 4:05 pm

charmender wrote:Hi,

He applied for a schengen visa using the normal schengen application form which they told us to use. For the type of visa he ticked other and we wrote beside it (spouse of EU citizen).

...

And yes as you said about being refused for security or policy reasons that is also listed on the the form but it is not ticked. They show all the possible reasons for refusal but the one I mentioned was the only one ticked. And as far as I know from my reading and the link you posted they can only refuse for 4 reasons (none of which they included in this denial).

What do you think I should do now? I have contacted solvit but sure it could take them a few days to reply. Is it best when dealing with the appeal to clearly outline our rights under the directive? They called him last week and asked him why he wanted to go and he explained he would travel with me as I wanted to go there to work so surely they are just making this difficult and awkward for us.
That may be a valid reason to refuse a visitor, but (in my understanding) not valid to refuse in relation to EU directive & free movement-related application.

Not sure where you go from here.
Is there a Malta embassy anywhere nearby? You could try a direct application (I understand embassies have to entertain this).

Otherwise, as you've approached Solvit it's possibly a case of wait and see.
All that is gold does not glitter; Not all those who wander are lost. E&OE.

charmender
Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:33 am
Ireland

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by charmender » Tue Apr 05, 2016 4:33 pm

Yes well the embassy was not willing to even answer any of my questions so I don't intend on calling them again. They told us to take a look at the appeal process on the letter. Basically the appeal will be dealt with by the Immigration Office in Malta. But my understanding is the same as yours maybe I just have to make it clearer noting the articles in the directive which state he is not required to show financial documents.

mgb
Senior Member
Posts: 649
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:28 pm

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by mgb » Tue Apr 05, 2016 7:07 pm

Do a appeal and refer to the visa handbook C-2010-1620 part III.
http://ec.europa.eu/dgs/home-affairs/po ... 620_en.pdf

khanmzk
Member
Posts: 149
Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2015 11:00 am

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by khanmzk » Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:56 am

@charmender what country your husband applied for the visa from? i have been refused by German embassy
this february the first reason was.relation with the host country is not strong.and i did not full fill the financial requirements etc.Most of the EU countries do not consider any application which is solely based on EU free movement Directive because they believe that direct relatives of EU citizens like spouse want to jump the family reunification procedure to get into EU to apply for PR.However it is EU citizens right to accompany there direct family members without any financial requirements for a entry visa.on this forum there are several stories of the couples who only applied as a tourist visa and on there day of interview at the embassy they have clearly explained that they have booked hotel,have medical insurance and they have a job in there host country and they also show there bank statements as proof of sufficient funds to cover there trip.so once they arrive in the EU country they fallow the procedures and exercise there treaty rights to get PR for there family members eg spouse.its a genuine mistake that people make while submitting documents pointing out the directive 2004/38/ec and there freedom of movement rights.the EU countries are regularly abusing the law and destroying peoples life and pushing them into self exile.and also SOLVEIT never helps in case of visa denial they only help when there is a B2B problem by any EU authority.i am not saying this is the only remedy to get into EU but if somebody who want to get entrance visa into EU by using the freedom of movement rights has very slim chances of acceptance.
You May see me struggling but you will never see me quitting

member
Member of Standing
Posts: 297
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 6:23 am

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by member » Wed Apr 06, 2016 10:27 am

charmender wrote:Hi all,

Unfortunately my husbands schengen visa was denied by Malta. They marked one box on the reasons for refusal but this one reason has many parts to it and I have no idea how to go about appealing this. It is so frustrating.
Just to give the details, I am an Irish citizen and I want to go to Malta with my husband who is a non EU spouse. He was rejected a visa by Ireland a few months ago and I am pretty sure this is the reason Malta is rejecting him. They embassy called last week and one of the questions they asked is why he was refused a visa to Ireland so this is why I have this suspicion. Anyway I called the embassy and received the most rudest comments. All I wanted to know was if there are more details on the reason that I can find somewhere and the woman kept shouting that the embassy is not obliged to give any information. So I came here to see if any of you could help for the appeal since it just seems impossible at times to get any help.

The reason is:

You have not provided proof of sufficient means of subsistence, for the duration of the intended stay or for the return to the country of origin or residence, or for the transit to a third country, or is not in a position to acquire such means lawfully.

As I said I am pretty sure this all because of Ireland since financial things are irrelevant when applying as the spouse of an EU citizen. Where do we go from here?
What is your husband's immigration status in the UK?

charmender
Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:33 am
Ireland

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by charmender » Wed Apr 06, 2016 5:44 pm

Thanks mgb the Handbook is very useful indeed.

@member
My husband nor myself have any link with the UK.

@khanmzk
We both currently live in Turkey so we have applied from here.
I didn't really understand what you were trying to say about applying as a tourist. Yes I have also read other stories on the forum but then there are those people who do get their visa immediately without problem so its obviously not something that you can predict.

I am more outraged by the reason they gave since it clearly says on the schengen application form that the questions marked with an * are not required to be filled out by family members of EU citizens yet the reason they give is about finances. It just seems bizarre that of all reasons they could choose they chose this one. They have told me that he can reapply but they couldn't deal with his application properly in the first place, why should we have hope a second time. The appeal is going to take God knows how long. I have in the meantime sent several complaints to any institution I think can help. I think this is exactly why they deny people because the appeal process is so unclear and people lose hope to apply a second time. Its very frustrating.

khanmzk
Member
Posts: 149
Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2015 11:00 am

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by khanmzk » Wed Apr 06, 2016 6:32 pm

As you can see on this forum loads of people getting refusals applying EU/EEA joining or accompany visa.
Let me elaborate what i learned from my previous refusals.every EU country has its own immigration act
on the basis of which they process the applications.all they want to see is why you going to a EU country with a non-eu spouse reasons why dont your own country? why other EU country?because they know you want to exercise your freedom of movement rights and your partner will get the EU PR and then you can easily bring your spouse into your own country whose laws tell you to go through family reunification process which normally take more then 06 months know days its taking more then a year eg ireland is blocking more then 7000 passports and blocking certain nationalities.well this is what they think but the law shows a complete different picture.yes i do agree
with you that schengen visa form itself says you dont have to show financial proof if your accompanying EU citizen but they do not count it at all.one of the guy on this form showed his 30k uk bank statement and booked a holiday for his 2 childrens celebrating there birthday in Disney land paris where his wife is non-eu citizen will join them.they easily got visa.keep in mind his wife got rejection on UK spouse visa just before they applied.your intention to visit EU country with NON-EU spouse should be clear.i can understand your
fustration as me and my wife living in pakistan for last 1 year tried twice once for ireland other for germany both refused.i know how gutted you are becuase i went through all this as other people who have fought there way to the end to beat this system made for rich its called european bearucarcy where they tell you that they care about humans they care blah blah blah all Bullshit.they are running a system which only and only support the rich where they try to crush every single poor they get there hands on. i wish UK
leave EU on 23rd june ..and SCOTLAND GO FREE.....

LOADS OF MATERIAL AVAILABLE ON INTERNET... SEE A EXTRACT FROM MY APPEAL TO GERMANS..LOL ENJOY READING..I AM SURE THE CLERK WHO DEALT WITH MY CASE ENJOYED 2 :P

Dear Visa Section German embassy,
I have recently applied for a short term German visa and was refused because of the following :
Remarks:
An adequate family and economic ties with the country of origin has
not been established in your case. They gave during the application
A process that they wanted to permanently move to Germany and called
Himself as a husband of Irish national as your right of free movement
After the Freizüg G / EU. (Law on general freedom of movement of EU
Citizens)

You have not submitted a legalized marriage certificate and apply for a
Temporary resident visa. Your wife thinks your claims to visit, in
Pakistan, and was not working. You are free to submit an application
To join your wife, on the basis of the right to the free movement EU,
After a successful take up residence by your wife in Germany and the
Submission of a legalized marriage certificate as proof of marriage
I strongly believe to review my application again because it seems like the case worker Who dealt with my case completely misunderstood the purpose of my trip to the Federal republic of Germany As well as did not processed my application according to the visa code of EU directive 2004/38/ECAnd visa handbook C(2010) 1620 PART 111.
Important note (visa officer at counter No 1 on the day of my interview clearly misunderstood the nationality of my wife as she is born in Scotland (Aberdeen) and holds a British passport. And the fact that she is British, was clearly answered while the visa officer asked the question about her nationality)

Article 3(2) of the Treaty on European Union (TEU); Article 21 of the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union (TFEU); Titles IV and V TFEU
Therefore, I completely disagree with the decision made by the case worker who dealt with my case and Because of this I strongly Express my concerns to argue and appose the decision made.
You have indicated in your refusal letter that I don’t have any economic ties with the country land and wanting to permanently settlein the Federal Republic of Germany. I strongly appose this point because I Reserve the right under Article 6 of EU directive to reside in any member state for up to three months without any conditions.(keeping this in mind this is in itself,an exercise of free movement rights under the directive)
Moreover it is clearly explained within the Article 6 that accompaniying EU citizen on journey to a member state OR Joining EU citizen in the member state 4.5 in relation to point 4.1(iv),it is important to note that an application cannot be refused on the basis that EU citizen is not excersing free movement rights in the member state if (a) it is shown that the EU citizen will be accompanying on their journey to the state ,(b) the EU citizen has been less than three months in the state or (c) it is shown that the EU citizen although,not in the member state at the time of the visa application will be lawfully in the state at the time of the applicants arrival in the member this is because the EU citizen and their family members have a right of residence under Article 6.

(4) EU citizens do not require a visa in order to enter the Federal territory or a residence title in order to stay in the Federal territory. Dependents who are not EU citizens shall require a visa in order to enter the Federal territory according to the provisions for foreigners for whom the Residence Act applies. Holders of a valid residence card of another Member State of the European Union pursuant to Article 5 (2) of directive 2004/38/EC of the European Parliament and of the Council of 29 April 2004 on the right of citizens of the Union and their family members to move and reside freely within the territory of the Member States, amending regulation (EEC) no. 1612/68 and repealing directives 64/221/EC, 68/360/EEC, 73/148/EEC, 75/34/EEC, 75/35/EEC, 90/364/EEC, 90/365/EEC and 93/96/EEC (Official EU Journal no. L 229, p. 35) shall be exempted from the visa obligation

Above extract is taken from Act on the General freedom of movement for EU citizens (Freedom of movement Act/EU of 30 July 2004(Federal Law Gazette I,1950,1986)
Last amended by Art 2 of the Act to implement Residence –and Asylum –Related directives of the European union of 19 August 2007(Fedral Law Gazette l, P. 1970,1991)

4.6 As set out at 2. it is not appropriate to require evidence of the circumstances of
the EU citizen’s residence in the State other than in the context of requiring the
applicant to prove that the EU citizen is exercising their free movement rights (or will
be exercising them at the time of the applicant’s arrival in the State.). However, if
evidence is available showing that the EU Citizen has resided in the State for more
Then three months, but is not fulfilling the requirements of the Directive under Article
7 i.e.
(a) Is working or self-employed,
(b) Has sufficient resources to support themselves and their family members
Without recourse to public funds,
(c) Ison a full-time course of study with sufficient resources to support
Themselves and their family members without recourse to public funds, or
(d) Falls within the circumstances, set out in Article 7 (3) of the Directive
Where the status of worker or self-employed is retained,
Then the application can be refused on the ground that the applicant does not qualify
Under the Directive. Where such grounds are invoked, there should be a clear
Evidence-based finding set out in the decision and the notification letter.

‘Core’ family members have an automatic right of entry and residence, irrespective of their Nationality. Their right of entry is derived from the Directive and the national transpositionMeasuresmay not restrict these rights or the scope of ‘core’ family members.The following persons are defined in Article 2(2) of the Directive as ‘core’ family members:•Such as spouse;
Article 3(1) of the Directive stipulates that the Directive applies only to those familiesMembers, as defined above, who accompany or join the EU citizens who move to or reside ina Member State other than that of which they are a national. See Commission CommunicationCOM (2009) 313 final25.
Cases C-482/01 and C-493/01 Orfanopoulos and Oliveri (paras 97-98) and C-127/08 Metock (para 79) 6 Cases 139/85 Kempf (para 13) and C-33/07 Jipa (para 23) 7
As the right to be issued with an entry visa is derived from the family link with the EUCitizen, Member States may require only the presentation of a valid passport and evidenceOn the family link, eg Marriage certificate. And place of the marriage solemnized cannot be challenged.
The ECJ ruled in the case metlock C-127/08

Article 3(1) of Directive 2004/38 must be interpreted as meaning that a national of a non-member country who is the spouse of a Union citizen residing in a Member State whose nationality he does not possess and who accompanies or joins that Union citizen benefits from the provisions of that directive, irrespective of when and where their marriage took place and of how the national of a non-member country entered the host Member State.
No additional documents, such as a proof of accommodation, sufficientresources ,economic ties And an invitation letter or return ticket, can be required.18 Case C-503/03 Commission v Spain (para 42) 19 COM(2006) 403 final/2. 20 Articles 8(5) and 10(2) An email confirming the auntentecity of the EU law findings by myself where I Reserve all the rights.this confirmation was sent to me on the inquiry for the eligibility of free movement as EU spouse and as a core family memberand wasacknowledged by federal republic of germany immigration and asylum office replied in the same passion respecting the following law defined.with refrences
Info_Buerger <Info.Buerger@bamf.bund.de>
11/4/15


to me


Dear Mr Khan,

your wife as a British national has the freedom of movement.

As an EU national your wife does not need a visa to enter Germany. Generally, she only needs a valid passport or identity card. Like everybody else in Germany, she has to register directly after entering at the Registration Office (Einwohnermeldeamt) at her new place of residence in Germany.
Entry of spouses
You as a spouse have the right to enter Germany together with her or subsequently. As you are not an EU national, you generally require a national visa in order to enter Germany (section 2 para. 4 sentence 2 Freedom of Movement Act/EU).
The application for the visa has to be handed in to the German mission in the country, in which you are residing.

Important hint:
If you already had a residence card EU issued by another EU Member State (section 2 para. 4 sentence 3 Freedom of Movement Act/EU), you can enter Germany visa-free.

The German mission abroad can provide you with further information.

In Germany you will get a residence card at the Foreigners Office (Ausländerbehörde) in your local area (sec. 5 Freedom of Movement Act/EU). You can find the corresponding Foreigners Office here.

Please find all information here: http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/index_en.htm

If you have problems with the Embassy, you might contact the Federal Foreigner Office for further assistance: http://www.auswaertiges-amt.de/EN/Startseite_node.html

Best regards,

On behalf of the Federal Office for Migration and Refugees
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
_________________________________________
Information Service Migration
Frankenstr. 210 | 90461 Nuremberg | Germany
Phone: 0911-943 6390
Fax: 0911/ 943- 7000
Email:info.buerger@bamf.bund.de
Internet:www.bamf.de
http://www.wir-sind-bund.de
Where your findings clearly negate the fact and force an EU national to reside in Germany without accompanying the Core family member and to apply in a different category of visa.such as a family reunification visa.by doing this the concern department who is dealing with my application in my opinion,violatesand opposesthe practice of private life which is clearly described in Article 8 of human rights of EHCR.Which should be respected outside the immigration rules.
1. Private life, family life, home and correspondence.
2. The concept of private life in EU law is based on the classic civil liberties
and that the state should not intrude into the private sphere without
Strict justification.
3.a The positive obligation to take steps to ensure effective respect for private
And family life, home and correspondence, between the state and the
Individually, the individual and private bodies, and between private
Individuals through law enforcement, legal and regulatory frameworks and
The provision of resources
And also key elements defined in Article 2 of freedom of movement clearly explains that every individual has the right to leave any country at any time without any restrictions .Defines as fallows
ARTICLE 2

Freedom of movement
1. Everyone lawfully within the territory of a State shall, within
That territory, have the right to liberty of movement and freedom to
To choose his residence.
2. Everyone shall be free to leave any country, including his
Own.
3. No restrictions shall be placed on the exercise of these rights
Other than such as are in accordance with law and are necessary
In a democratic society in the interests of national security or public
Safety, for the maintenance of order public, for the prevention of
Crime, for the protection of health or morals, or for the protection
Of the rights and freedoms of others.
4. The rights set forth in paragraph 1 may also be subject, in
Particular areas, to restrictions imposed in accordance with law
And justified by the public interest in a democratic society
And also I secure the right of effective remedy under Article 13
ARTICLE 13
Right to an effective remedy
Everyone whose rights and freedoms as set forth in this Convention
Are violated shall have an effective remedy before a national
Authority notwithstanding that the violation has been committed
By persons acting in an official capacity
Of others. This Article shall not prevent the imposition of lawful
Restrictions on the exercise of these rights by members of the
Armed forces, of the police or of the administration of the State.

As the free movement allows the EU citizen and their direct family member to move freely within the EEA area for 90 Days I have produced a flight itinerary confirming return from EEA after the period of 90 days along with my Spouse .I have fulfilled this requirement according to the visa code under the applied category. Therefore, I understand the requirement of permanent residence that depends on whether my wife is exercising her treaty rights after 90 days of legal stay in the Federal republic of Germany .It was clearly mentioned in the application form that intented stay in the Fedral republic of Germany is no more then 90 Days hence no extra requirement or obligation should be impposed on me or my wife.The fact that if we want to stay togather in Fedral Republic of Germany for more then 90 days then my wife has to prove that she is excersing her free movment rights under directive 2004/38/EC as decirbed in detail above.while answering the same question on the day of my interview I have clearly explained that we will stay if my wife manage to secure a job and circumstances are good for us.You have Denied the authenticity of my Marriage certificate on such basis the marriage certificate I have submitted has a hauge apostille and is a UK legalized document.
Last edited by noajthan on Wed Apr 06, 2016 6:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Removed personal info (names)
You May see me struggling but you will never see me quitting

mgb
Senior Member
Posts: 649
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:28 pm

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by mgb » Thu Apr 07, 2016 5:37 am

charmender wrote:
The appeal is going to take God knows how long.
You could ask the Central Visa Unit in Malta what to do. Maybe they accept a direct complaint. There is a email address at this side.
https://identitymalta.com/visas/

That Zimbo Lad
Newbie
Posts: 31
Joined: Fri Feb 12, 2016 11:22 am

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by That Zimbo Lad » Thu Apr 07, 2016 6:30 am

@Khanmzk you are absolutely spot on. Quoting the directive
for an accompany visa is one of the worst things you could do
because your almost certain to be waiting a long time just to get
a decision. Applying as a tourist is the way to go- imo because
once you get to Europe they cannot deport you under EU law
and whatever delays you face, at least you will be fighting from
within.

Our story is similar- applied under the directive to go to Ireland
with my British wife and we waited over 4 months with no
decision. Eventually I pulled out my docs and applied for a
Schengen- this time as a tourist with Itenaries booked with a
return to my country (usedhttp://www.dreameurotrip.com) and
we only paid €25 to get confirmed return tickets without paying
the full ticket price. Embassies want confirmed returns- well there you go.

Other stuff included was obviously health insurance (we used Evasan), Bank
Purchase forms for Euros, marriage certificate and again free bookings on Expedia for hotels (Boom now pay later) and that was that. Needless to say my Schengen was issued within 3 working days by the French embassy in Harare.

As for you saying you hope the UK leaves the EU- I am not in agreement. If that
happens it would be very uncertain what the future holds for Singhers even with the
proposed status quo continuing for 2 years while the UK negotiates it's exit. I also
have very little doubt that the Home Office will start flouting EU rules further because they will know that they can just stall until the exit package is sealed and throw out applications just like that. So for people with UK links don't think that would be good. For those without it will make little difference unless a Brexit spreads contagion and other EU states follow suit.

But anyway that again would be my advice to prospective Ss'ers- apply as a genuine tourist and get to Europe. Otherwise it will be a long road ahead of waiting, probably refusals and trying to appeal.

charmender
Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:33 am
Ireland

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by charmender » Thu Apr 07, 2016 9:09 pm

Thanks mgb they are one of the institution I have sent emails to.

You know I get what you are all saying about the tourist visa thing but now that we have applied this way it doesn't seem like that would work because they would just think we are lying now. To be honest though as a matter of principal I want to go through the appeal just because I want my rights recognised. I know that its not easy but I have read stories of people who do it and it takes forever but they get their rights recognised. If we all just give up then everyone who applies will face similar issues. Its so annoying really that just because I married someone from a different nationality my life decisions are limited.

And a question about what you are saying about the tourist option - would you have to show your bank account details?

khanmzk
Member
Posts: 149
Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2015 11:00 am

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by khanmzk » Fri Apr 08, 2016 3:22 pm

this is the recent response from swedish imigration office.they replied to my question which i emailed them earlier this week regarding the tourist visa as a spouse of EU citizen i never mentioned that as couple we have intentions of exercising our treaty rights. i simply asked them what docs we need and they replied like this.

Dear



Thank you for your e-mail.



If your family are non-EU citizens and you intend to stay in Sweden for more than three months, the family members should apply for residence cards at the Swedish Migration Agency. The residence card allows your family to live and work in Sweden as long as you have right of residence by working, studying, being self-employed or living on your pension or other sufficient means for supporting your family.



More information can be found trough the following link http://www.migrationsverket.se/English/ ... izens.html.



If you want to visit Sweden you can apply for a Schengen visa.



Best regards,
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

---------------------------------
Swedish Migration Agency
The Customer Service Unit
Telephone +46 (0)771 235 235

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Last edited by noajthan on Fri Apr 08, 2016 3:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Removed personal info (names)
You May see me struggling but you will never see me quitting

khanmzk
Member
Posts: 149
Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2015 11:00 am

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by khanmzk » Fri Apr 08, 2016 3:36 pm

@charmender bank statements are not a prerequisite for your husband to attach along with your application.
but like i explained in my previous posts as far as you convince them that you are going as a tourisit.they will issue the visa within few days.now the question is how you will be able to do that.let me give you few tips.
that might help you in your fresh visa application if you have any plans to submit a new application.
1.book a confirm flight with a travel agents (confirm means do not pay full just ask them to print a itinerary for you)
2.buy medical insurance.
3.show a plan that you are not going to one EU country.for example 2 weeks in Paris,1 week in Belgium
1 week in Rome and 2 weeks in Berlin.
4.hotel booking vouchers really important. just to show embassy that you have tentative bookings for those
hotels.

all these bookings easy for me to do becuase i am a travel agent and i have access to all airlines systems.
i hope you will find some travel agent who can help you through all the process.to book the hotels and flights provisionally for few weeks until the embassy checks it.
You May see me struggling but you will never see me quitting

charmender
Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:33 am
Ireland

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by charmender » Wed May 11, 2016 12:04 pm

Hi all again,

Unfortunately there has been no move on our appeal but today we were told that the appeals place in Malta want our passports translated (well mine is in English anyway) and authenticated. They want our marriage cert apostilled. We did give our original documents to the consulate when we first applied for the visa and they never made an issue with the documents and so I am surprised the appeals place are requesting this. My question is, do they have a right to ask for this? Its just amazing how after several weeks they ask for this. Its a very drawn out process.

mgb
Senior Member
Posts: 649
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:28 pm

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by mgb » Thu May 12, 2016 4:33 am

Asking for translated passports is a bad joke.
Did you get any response from Solvit?

charmender
Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:33 am
Ireland

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by charmender » Thu May 12, 2016 8:57 am

It really is like a bad joke because its 5 weeks after we sent the appeal that they tell us this. Clearly they didn't even look at it until now.

Solvit are honestly unhelpful in my opinion. I have been contacting the people who they contact for me but on much regular basis. I just keep emailing them every week asking them for an update. I think I can do more without the help of solvit. They basically just told me to go along with what the appeals board want.

But the point is we will have to spend money on translation services, getting documents authenticated and then postal services and in the end they might not change the original decision. But the other thing that is bothering me is that the Consulate saw all our original documents and they had no problem with the authenticity of our documents. So I don't understand what is the issue the appeal office has with them. I am sure they have a computer system where all our details are anyway and they could easily contact the consulate.

I don't want my husband to have this rejection on his passport but at the same time I just want to give up. Maybe we should just think about going to another country but then the same thing could happen again.

mgb
Senior Member
Posts: 649
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:28 pm

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by mgb » Thu May 12, 2016 9:27 pm

You could ask the appeal board if Malta is recognizing EU-directive 2004/38 and the visa handbook C(2010) 1620 part III.
If yes they should point to clause which dictate translated passports and a apostille for the marriage certificate.

charmender
Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:33 am
Ireland

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by charmender » Fri May 13, 2016 11:31 am

To be honest they don't care about the directive. its clear that they look for any small issue just to make it difficult for people. They told me today that even if I pay the money for translation and certifying documents this doesn't mean the decision will be changed.

When you apply originally you don't have to pay fees or translate documents but if they reject you and you have to go through the appeal thats where everything changes. Because from my research there is no common eu law on the appeals process. Every country has their own right to deal with the appeals procedure in their own way. There is no time limit on when they have to give a decision either. So if you get rejected at the first point you really are unlucky that is what I have learnt from this experience.

I was positive about the appeals procedure in the beginning but I have now realised the whole thing is a joke. I don't understand the purpose of the law anymore. We have rights which we cannot use. Not sure what to do anymore. Just because you marry someone from another country outside the EU your whole life is affected.

mgb
Senior Member
Posts: 649
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:28 pm

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by mgb » Sat May 14, 2016 12:57 am

You have to fight step by step. Force them to confirm in writing that they piss on the directive.

charmender
Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:33 am
Ireland

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by charmender » Tue May 24, 2016 10:25 am

Well the latest is that the the visa policy unit of the European Commission has contacted me saying that they believe Malta was wrong in its actions and they have told me they will contact the Maltese authorities for us.

Not sure how it will go or how long that will take but hopefully it will give some good news. At least if they complain and get Malta to admit they were wrong we could have a chance to reapply and this time they probably wouldn't mess up.

Also as a fyi, the Malta Appeals Board meets only once a week. No wonder its been taking so long. Its an unbelievable slow system. I think a big flaw in all of this is that the EU has no common approach on the appeals system.

charmender
Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:33 am
Ireland

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by charmender » Tue Jun 14, 2016 1:15 pm

Update: The EC is investigating my case however the Maltese authorities are given 10 weeks to reply to the EC. The EC then has another 10 weeks to decide what to do after that. It is ridiculously long and they know it. They told me that I should consider national forms of redress to get my rights recognised more quickly. They also told me that this would be the only way to seek compensation for any loss or damages.

Who do I contact for this? Should I contact a lawyer in Malta or Turkey? I am also going to contact the Ombudsman in Malta.

mgb
Senior Member
Posts: 649
Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:28 pm

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by mgb » Tue Jun 14, 2016 11:24 pm

A lawyer in Turkey makes no sense.
If you want compensation you should try to find a lawyer in Malta who has some experience in EU law.

charmender
Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:33 am
Ireland

Re: Spouse Schengen visa denied

Post by charmender » Wed Jun 15, 2016 10:43 am

Yes that is what I was thinking to. I have contacted some lawyers so I will see what they say.

Anyone have any knowledge on the other institutions. There is also the ECHR ad ECJ and I am wondering if I can use them too since the EU general court has also has at least one judge from each member state.

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