Is my solicitor useless?

jimmurray · Post by **jimmurray** » Fri Feb 10, 2012 3:21 pm

he claims that I need to send the original passport, and claims using a copy reduces success rate

I smelt a little bs on this....is there any truth in it?

Also what exactly is my solicitor doing when he says 'making representation'...I thought it involved a lot of work but from what I gather I appear to be spending a grand on him organising the evidence I painstakingly gathered myself and then attaching a little note to it...

Can anyone testify to the usefulness of solicitors?

Post by **Greenie** » Fri Feb 10, 2012 3:27 pm

what application are you making?

jimmurray · Post by **jimmurray** » Fri Feb 10, 2012 3:34 pm

Greenie wrote:what application are you making?

spouse visa, me a British national, wife of Ghanian origins

I just get the feeling what they do doesn't really justify the huge costs, does using a lawyer make things 'more official'? I have heard of success stories here through direct applications

SoHopeful · Post by **SoHopeful** » Fri Feb 10, 2012 3:48 pm

Certified copy of anything you can't provide as an original is fine. Who is risking sending a passport abroad? And not everyone has the finances and availability to be present with their spouse at submission.

As for 'professional' assistance in general, If its a straightforward case, i would get on with the application myself. If you have any specific worries you could consult the forum or have a consultation with a professional. As you said, you are still having to get the documents together yourself anyway.

Post by **Greenie** » Fri Feb 10, 2012 3:50 pm

you need to submit an original passport for the applicant with an FLR(M) application and indeed, generally speaking, any other application where there is a prescribed form and unless the original is not available.

you should ask for a breakdown of your costs if you are unsure what you are paying for.

Some cases are complex and require a solicitor, some are not. Some solicitors add a lot of value to a case, particularly if it is complex, some make things worse.

jimmurray · Post by **jimmurray** » Fri Feb 10, 2012 3:54 pm

Greenie wrote:you need to submit an original passport for the applicant with an FLR(M) application and indeed, generally speaking, any other application where there is a prescribed form and unless the original is not available.

you should ask for a breakdown of your costs if you are unsure what you are paying for.

Some cases are complex and require a solicitor, some are not. Some solicitors add a lot of value to a case, particularly if it is complex, some make things worse.

I see..the thing is when I told him to make a certified copy he seemed adamant this was not possible, which then made me doubt if he seemed to know anything about anything....

again I ask what is 'making representation'? What physical evidence does he add to the package? or does he just say 'hey this guy is cool and has my recommendation'

Post by **Greenie** » Fri Feb 10, 2012 3:58 pm

if the original passpor for the applicant is not sent the application will be sent back as invalid.

Ask the solicitor what he is proposing to do. Representations are generally a covering letter outlining how the application meets the requirements, referring to the relevent case law, making legal argument etc. Solicitors do not 'make recommendations'.

Post by **batleykhan** » Fri Feb 10, 2012 4:01 pm

Any application you make in this country, you have to send original passport, but if your wife is applying from abroad for spouse visa, then you as the sponsor must send certified copies of your passport. You do not send the original one abroad

jimmurray · Post by **jimmurray** » Fri Feb 10, 2012 4:55 pm

batleykhan wrote:Any application you make in this country, you have to send original passport, but if your wife is applying from abroad for spouse visa, then you as the sponsor must send certified copies of your passport. You do not send the original one abroad

yes exactly this was my understanding too...the fact that he doesn't know this, makes me fear what else does this guy not know? do you reckon I should cancel and apply direct?

jimmurray · Post by **jimmurray** » Fri Feb 10, 2012 4:56 pm

Greenie wrote:Representations are generally a covering letter outlining how the application meets the requirements, referring to the relevent case law, making legal argument etc. Solicitors do not 'make recommendations'.

err...so nothing then...all this information can be obtained online, pointing it out again has what effect exactly?

pennylessinindia · Post by **pennylessinindia** » Fri Feb 10, 2012 5:06 pm

Greenie wrote:if the original passpor for the applicant is not sent the application will be sent back as invalid.

Ask the solicitor what he is proposing to do. Representations are generally a covering letter outlining how the application meets the requirements, referring to the relevent case law, making legal argument etc. Solicitors do not 'make recommendations'.

but this is the sponsors the solicitor wants so why?

Post by **Greenie** » Fri Feb 10, 2012 7:32 pm

jimmurray wrote:
Greenie wrote:Representations are generally a covering letter outlining how the application meets the requirements, referring to the relevent case law, making legal argument etc. Solicitors do not 'make recommendations'.
err...so nothing then...all this information can be obtained online, pointing it out again has what effect exactly?

sorry but I don't quite understand why you are trying to argue with me. It's you who has chosen to pay the solicitor - surely you asked him what work he would do. As I said, it depends on the case. If the case is straightforward, or indeed if it is complex and you think you can find out the relevent legal arguments and case law on the internet, then go ahead and do it yourself. A good solicitor will advise you on the requirements, on the documents you need to provide, and on the strengths and weakeness of your application, as well as drafting representations if required. If you think you can do that yourself (which plenty of people do), then go ahead.

Post by **Greenie** » Fri Feb 10, 2012 7:35 pm

pennylessinindia wrote:
Greenie wrote:if the original passpor for the applicant is not sent the application will be sent back as invalid.

Ask the solicitor what he is proposing to do. Representations are generally a covering letter outlining how the application meets the requirements, referring to the relevent case law, making legal argument etc. Solicitors do not 'make recommendations'.
but this is the sponsors the solicitor wants so why?

It wasn't clear from the OP's post that it was the sponsor's original passport he was asking for.

jimmurray · Post by **jimmurray** » Sat Feb 11, 2012 8:20 pm

Greenie wrote:
jimmurray wrote:
Greenie wrote:Representations are generally a covering letter outlining how the application meets the requirements, referring to the relevent case law, making legal argument etc. Solicitors do not 'make recommendations'.
err...so nothing then...all this information can be obtained online, pointing it out again has what effect exactly?
Im not arguing, I'm just a little pissed off

I had the impression that a lawyer would do a hell of a lot more than just add a cover note..a grand for that? christ

There is nothing you can really do, besides provide all the evidence you have...If you don't have enough income, then it does not matter how much sweet talk a lawyer delivers, the application won't work

Yes I think I do believe I know the law enough to make this application myself, and I think I will fire him Monday (before paying the other 50%)

As the success story in the sticky thread points out, they found lawyers a complete waste of time too...All the guy talks about is when are you giving me money, and doesn't give a sht about my life it seems..christ they can be at least more subtle with it

Post by **vinny** » Sun Feb 12, 2012 12:32 am

jimmurray wrote:he claims that I need to send the original passport, and claims using a copy reduces success rate

The applicant's passport must be sent for endorsement.

However, if the sponsor and the sponsor's passport are in different countries, then the British Embassy may cancel the sponsor's British passport; therefore, sending the sponsor's certified passport copy is more appropriate.

jimmurray · Post by **jimmurray** » Sun Feb 12, 2012 11:58 pm

vinny wrote:
jimmurray wrote:he claims that I need to send the original passport, and claims using a copy reduces success rate
The applicant's passport must be sent for endorsement.

However, if the sponsor and the sponsor's passport are in different countries, then the British Embassy may cancel the sponsor's British passport; therefore, sending the sponsor's certified passport copy is more appropriate.

yes I think so too..so not only is this jackass giving me bad advice, he is also about to ruin my application..and I'm paying through the nose for the pleasure

I had a feeling it was very strange..if your passport is in another country, I'm pretty sure it will be cancelled..so tomorrow I will visit him and demand an explanation

flyguy · Post by **flyguy** » Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:55 pm

A certified copy of passport is fine. As a sponser you should not need to send/giev your original passport, and i think one is not supposed to send a passport in the post either outside the UK

jimmurray · Post by **jimmurray** » Tue Feb 14, 2012 10:52 pm

flyguy wrote:A certified copy of passport is fine. As a sponser you should not need to send/giev your original passport, and i think one is not supposed to send a passport in the post either outside the UK

ok, so if I solicitor advised you to send your passport abroad, thereby risking cancellation and rejection of the application, what would you, personally do??? would you want to listen to more 'advice' from this guy?

Post by **Greenie** » Tue Feb 14, 2012 11:04 pm

jimmurray wrote:
flyguy wrote:A certified copy of passport is fine. As a sponser you should not need to send/giev your original passport, and i think one is not supposed to send a passport in the post either outside the UK
ok, so if I solicitor advised you to send your passport abroad, thereby risking cancellation and rejection of the application, what would you, personally do??? would you want to listen to more 'advice' from this guy?

If you want to sack your solicitor, sack him-i don't understand why you appear to be attacking those who respond to you. I thought you were going to ditch him yesterday?

Post by **vinny** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:49 am

jimmurray wrote:Today I fired my solicitor after what I consider serious incompetence. I was advised to send in my original passport, to the Ghana VFS office.

This sounded suspicious so I double checked with another solicitor, and he confirmed this was the most moronic advice ever and that the passport would most likely be cancelled and the application refused, causing it to fail before it even began.

I left a deposit of 500, the deal was 1000 in total. Is there any way I can retrieve some of the original deposit? From what I gather he only sent one letter and could not have done more than 1 hours work total on the whole application. This would mean, according to his cost list only £215 was accrued.

Who can I complain to and what evidence should I provide. I probably won't bother as he will just lie, and I really need to focus on the application right now anyway.

Post by **vinny** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:50 am

pennylessinindia wrote:Why not search on google and look for their regulatory body.

I am sorry to say this but if you are going to sort this visa out you should perhaps start looking at things on a positive note. It is hard enough to do the whole procedure, but by being so negative all the time it will not help.

If you look at postings here and on UKBA site that the sponsors original passport is not needed. Perhaps spend some time searching on this site and see the way people have approached the application procedure. It is a little complex but not impossible if you do in a methodical way

Post by **vinny** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:55 am

jimmurray wrote:Today I fired my solicitor after what I consider serious incompetence. I was advised to send in my original passport, to the Ghana VFS office.

This sounded suspicious so I double checked with another solicitor, and he confirmed this was the most moronic advice ever and that the passport would most likely be cancelled and the application refused, causing it to fail before it even began.

Submitting the sponsor's original passport, although perhaps inappropriate, is not a reason for refusal.

jimmurray · Post by **jimmurray** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 12:31 pm

pennylessinindia wrote:
Greenie wrote:if the original passpor for the applicant is not sent the application will be sent back as invalid.

Ask the solicitor what he is proposing to do. Representations are generally a covering letter outlining how the application meets the requirements, referring to the relevent case law, making legal argument etc. Solicitors do not 'make recommendations'.
but this is the sponsors the solicitor wants so why?

@pennylessinindia, I understand I need to remain positive, but how can one remain positive when they are receiving such horrifically incompetent advice from an 'immigration specialist solicitor'

I mean that's 500 down the drain right there, money I really could have used. These people did not have my best interests in their minds, especially distressing since it is a family matter where emotions run high.

I am being positive and trying to learn as much as I can before I submit within 2 weeks. On the documentation side I have everything covered, and just need some more info about the actual process, this is the area I am least informed in

jimmurray · Post by **jimmurray** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 12:32 pm

vinny wrote:
jimmurray wrote:Today I fired my solicitor after what I consider serious incompetence. I was advised to send in my original passport, to the Ghana VFS office.

This sounded suspicious so I double checked with another solicitor, and he confirmed this was the most moronic advice ever and that the passport would most likely be cancelled and the application refused, causing it to fail before it even began.
Submitting the sponsor's original passport, although perhaps inappropriate, is not a reason for refusal.

Maybe not refusal of the application, but it would result in the cancellation of the passport. Either way the risks should have been made perfectly clear...

jimmurray · Post by **jimmurray** » Wed Feb 15, 2012 12:53 pm

vinny wrote:
jimmurray wrote:he claims that I need to send the original passport, and claims using a copy reduces success rate
The applicant's passport must be sent for endorsement.

However, if the sponsor and the sponsor's passport are in different countries, then the British Embassy may cancel the sponsor's British passport; therefore, sending the sponsor's certified passport copy is more appropriate.

sorry what is endorsment? never heard of this..how does it differ to sending a certified copy?

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Is my solicitor useless?

Is my solicitor useless?