deception ILR refused

Thank you everyone .. please update 4s6s after you speak HRMC.
thank you

It also depends on the tax code used , Was this a second income or main income. If second income generally tax is cut at 20% as your personal allowances are used by the main employer. What HMRC does is then clubs both income and cuts remaining 20% tax in the next tax years.

Check your P800. You should get if tax paid is underpaid or overpaid.
Employer History showing missing data?

applied for ILR Last month ,but Its been refused ,as i was alleged used false payslips when i applied for tier 1, but they extend my tier 1 extension after that . now after 5 years , they said me this reason, i am here from last 8 years and nothing wrong has been done , everything is complete legal.

...

a applied by by premium service. i am not working in that company .

in 2010 when the tier 1 came , we have to show £20000 and i was having £8000 short . for that some guy came to me and said there is legal but in direct way and u have to pay tax on it. he make me as an IT consultant and transfered me £2000 in my account for 4 months . then i stopped , but i paid insurance and tax . the people (which i found out now ) had been caught and either deported or left .

...

i have the proof that i paid taxes , also home office except it. but what they saying is i paid them money and they paid me back into my account . its like a circulation of money .

For anyone that's confused, here's what this person has done.

He was £8000 short for applying for a visa.
He gives a company £8000 and they pay it back to him at £2000/month for 4 months.
It's declared as a salary, he pays NI and PAYE/tax on it and the company give him payslips. (Really, they would just give him £8000 as an IT consultant from the kindness of their hearts?)
He takes the payslips and bank statements to the HO, and now it looks like he earns £20000, not £12000.
The HO gives him a visa but later the HO realises this is a scam company.
The HO blacklists the company, the people involved in the company all leave because they'd probably face criminal charges.
Now OP applies for ILR, the HO checks his previous applications, notices that he used a scam company and ban him for deception.

There is nothing legal about this, OP is lucky he's not going to jail for tax fraud. The cost of prosecuting is probably more than throwing him out the country. The only reason OP got the visa in the first place was because he used deception.

Isnt this the sole reason why tier 1 g was abused and led to the closure.

HO is getting after such scam companies all the time making it easy for HMRC to penalise them

Also will be interesting to see some cases in which fraud income has been shown to ho and nothing declated to hmrc and dwp.

In that case what happens to applicant if that company is still trading and what if that company turns out to be a tier 2 sponsor.

is there any list of scam companies ??
why didnt they act when he had an extension ???? why in the time ILR??

jayacpr wrote:is there any list of scam companies ??
why didnt they act when he had an extension ???? why in the time ILR??

Because the checks are more thorough now and there is much more connectivity between government agencies.

Fraud is fraud whether it was initially missed or not. Does driving at 140mph on the motorway and not being caught mean no offence was committed?

They didn't routinely start checking HMRC data till recently, the mou was only signed a couple of years ago. They know they'll eventually catch these people when they renew their visas, so there is no reason to go back and check everyone.

Google for: UKBA HMRC mou

Hi all after reading all the conversation I have a question. When I have applied my first tier 1 application back in 2010 , I have claimed that I am earning 29k ( calculated on the basis of Gross pay every month) and was approved by HO. But when I have received my P60 it shows only 23k. I have asked my company about that and they replied because I am Travel and sub scheme so ( I have no idea what is that ) so they are paying tax on my total gross pay and they paying back some amount of money into my account every month , that's why I am earning more money each month. ( Complex to understand for me thoug ) and this a Govt approved scheme. After that I got my extension through a different company. Now I am reading all this bit worried does it effects me on ILR application ? Because I claimed 29 k but my company pay tax on 23k . Kindly advise .

anumkh wrote:Hi all after reading all the conversation I have a question. When I have applied my first tier 1 application back in 2010 , I have claimed that I am earning 29k ( calculated on the basis of Gross pay every month) and was approved by HO. But when I have received my P60 it shows only 23k. I have asked my company about that and they replied because I am Travel and sub scheme so ( I have no idea what is that ) so they are paying tax on my total gross pay and they paying back some amount of money into my account every month , that's why I am earning more money each month. ( Complex to understand for me thoug ) and this a Govt approved scheme. After that I got my extension through a different company. Now I am reading all this bit worried does it effects me on ILR application ? Because I claimed 29 k but my company pay tax on 23k . Kindly advise .

In most travel and subsistence schemes, the expenses paid to the worker for travelling to a temporary workplace are not paid on top of the worker’s salary. Instead, the worker enters into a salary sacrifice arrangement, where he “sacrifices” part of his salary, which reduces the amount of pay subject to tax and NICs. The travel expenses are then paid to the worker, in
addition to this reduced pay, and are free of tax and NICs.

Many temporary workers, including those who are paid at or near the National Minimum Wage (NMW), participate in travel and subsistence schemes operated by some Employment Businesses and umbrella companies. These schemes take advantage of the tax relief and the disregards that exist for the purposesof National Insurance Contributions (NICs) in relation to travel from home to temporary workplace. By creating a single employment contract for each worker, these schemes convert what would otherwise be a series of permanent workplaces (for which there is no tax relief available on travel expenses) into temporary
workplaces (for which tax relief on travel expensesis due). Workers agree that an amount of pay, which would otherwise be subject to tax and NICs, is replaced with expenses payments for travel to a temporary workplace. In this way, these schemes deliver tax and NICs savings for workers. Also, the Employment Businesses or umbrella companies save employer’s NICs on the
pay which has been replaced with tax and NICs free travel expenses.

May be due to out of 29K earning the non taxable element was 6K. so the taxable gross become 23K on which tax would have been paid. Try getting exact calculations from your employer if possible. and if that is the case you may be fine

@anumkh am sorry if my answer was too technical.

Basically, what you received was a "salary sacrifice".

Normally, this isn't included in your P60, that's why it shows a lower amount because there is no provision in PAYE Regulations for non-cash benefits to be taxed through payroll.

If you are worried, you can get a confirmation from your employer re the scheme and their agreement with HMRC.

It's not a problem.

I guess people who went for 2 nd tier 1 extensions last year,ukba must have rigorously checked their tax returns and called few for interviews??
So people who got tier 1 ext for 2nd time must have had their application scrutinised well?

Any inputs on this

Hi thanks for your kind response. I tried to contact them but they said P60 is the final doc etc.I am not working with them any more may be that's why they are not interested. All I want to know does this effect my ILR application in future as many people said that IlR application has been refused because of less tax paid . Though most of them are self employed but still want to find what will be the situation of employee's who are relying on salaries and paying their tax through PAYE.

said P60 is the final doc

P60s are only issued once which is why employees are advised to keep them safe.

anumkh wrote:Hi thanks for your kind response. I tried to contact them but they said P60 is the final doc etc.I am not working with them any more may be that's why they are not interested. All I want to know does this effect my ILR application in future as many people said that IlR application has been refused because of less tax paid . Though most of them are self employed but still want to find what will be the situation of employee's who are relying on salaries and paying their tax through PAYE.

You must have a P11D?. That's where it will be logged.

Wow...UKBA is getting more and more tougher these days.

What I don't understand is how can these people with payslips prove to UKBA that their employment was genuine at the time of their tier 1 initial application when the company is dissolved and the applicant's records are not with HMRC regarding that employment.

Waiting to see some responses how they justify it to UKBA.

Thanks " hellonewhere". Thank you for your advise . I'll cantact them and ask them again.

@chase , i have the same question , coz i am one of them ,and @4s6s tooo

anumkh wrote:Thanks " hellonewhere". Thank you for your advise . I'll cantact them and ask them again.

To be honest, you don't even need a P11D neither any confirmation from your employer.

If you have a look at your payslip, you will have;

Total Gross Pay to date:xxxx
Gross for tax to date:xxxxx

and on the same payslip, the travel and sub benefit will be mentioned.

The total gross pay to date and gross for tax to date will obviously be different.
As the benefit is such that you aren't getting taxed on it.

hellonewhere wrote:

anumkh wrote:Thanks " hellonewhere". Thank you for your advise . I'll cantact them and ask them again.

To be honest, you don't even need a P11D neither any confirmation from your employer.

If you have a look at your payslip, you will have;

Total Gross Pay to date:xxxx
Gross for tax to date:xxxxx

and on the same payslip, the travel and sub benefit will be mentioned.

The total gross pay to date and gross for tax to date will obviously be different.
As the benefit is such that you aren't getting taxed on it.

Dear " hellonewhere" Thanks again. YEs you are right , Just check my pay slips. But what I did I have claimed ' TOTAL GROSS PAY TO DATE" instead of " GROSS FOR TAX TO DATE". now I am wondering does it effect my ILR application as now a days HO checking from HMRC. Company I have worked for is a big company and not a umbrella or dissolved company.
waiting for kind response.

anumkh wrote:

hellonewhere wrote:

anumkh wrote:Thanks " hellonewhere". Thank you for your advise . I'll cantact them and ask them again.

To be honest, you don't even need a P11D neither any confirmation from your employer.

If you have a look at your payslip, you will have;

Total Gross Pay to date:xxxx
Gross for tax to date:xxxxx

and on the same payslip, the travel and sub benefit will be mentioned.

The total gross pay to date and gross for tax to date will obviously be different.
As the benefit is such that you aren't getting taxed on it.

Dear " hellonewhere" Thanks again. YEs you are right , Just check my pay slips. But what I did I have claimed ' TOTAL GROSS PAY TO DATE" instead of " GROSS FOR TAX TO DATE". now I am wondering does it effect my ILR application as now a days HO checking from HMRC. Company I have worked for is a big company and not a umbrella or dissolved company.
waiting for kind response.

Thank you.

I don't know about the home office but what I know is your gross pay is the amount including the benefit.
To add; your gross pay was 29k.
Your P60 differs as you don't pay tax and NI on it. It's a perfectly legal scheme same as childcare vouchers, pension contributions, season ticket loan, employee loan etc.

Take your payslips and P60 with you and you ought to be fine.
I am sure HO has seen plenty of cases such like yours and are aware of it.

Good luck, please keep us posted.

Please Guys , help me with my question , i have payslips at the time of intial application as i said before , after i saw this post i am worried as the company is dissolved .

jayacpr wrote:Please Guys , help me with my question , i have payslips at the time of intial application as i said before , after i saw this post i am worried as the company is dissolved .

Mate,

What I understand, is if you were working legally and all the TAX and NI is paid on time correctly, regardless of the company now busted or dissolved it shouldn't be an issue.

I have found this on GoV.uk, but can see the date of Memorandum, if you can find one it would be wise, because if this SLA agreement was done before your extension then they must have checked you info from HMRC and approve the visa, but if this agreement was done in recent days then we can expect scrutiny.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... ustoms.pdf

Have you done your 2nd extension.,
If yes then ukba would have checked your initial application history,and u must have got ur 2nd extension without any problem