ESC

Click the "allow" button if you want to receive important news and updates from immigrationboards.com


Immigrationboards.com: Immigration, work visa and work permit discussion board

Welcome to immigrationboards.com!

Login Register Do not show

Visa fees and health surcharges

General UK immigration & work permits; don't post job search or family related topics!

Please use this section of the board if there is no specific section for your query.

Moderators: Casa, push, JAJ, ca.funke, Amber, zimba, vinny, Obie, EUsmileWEallsmile, batleykhan, meself2, geriatrix, John, ChetanOjha, archigabe, Administrator

Locked
hsyasin
Member
Posts: 174
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2010 11:27 am
Location: UK

Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by hsyasin » Fri May 08, 2015 8:45 am

I'm opening up a discussion here as m extremely frustrated with whats been going on since 2010 with tier1 holders..
The government wanted to limit immigration, fine they closed tier1 general completely.. fair enough.
Then they raised salary bands so that only "skilled" immigrants are left in the uk.. again, doesn't make that much sense as i know alot of friends working in skilled jobs including myself when i started working was just above that limit, but fair enough "Mr. Gov", only skilled worker can earn above 35k, when he is in his early stages..
But what doesn't make sense at all is visa fees, increasing year on year.. and not tiny amount.. in HUGE amounts.. first application i made, i paid around £900, ext after 2years £1500.. then wife came along around £1000 for her..
and now next year £1500 (raised from around £1000 this year) when i apply for ILR and for wife.. well £1750 for her extension and £600 for "NHS health surcharge" £2350 in total for her application :evil:

I mean is there no stop to this? no regulatory body or anything??
is there no questioning anyone of these BSs to even ask, why is there such a huge rise, like when they raise even a penny on food or alcohol, they've to be very careful and go through loads of approvals and even then takes them a while to raise the price..
but here in our case, its like, somebody gets drunk and says, hey lets charge them x amount and the rest say, yay, lets do that..

jayacpr
Member of Standing
Posts: 275
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2015 2:33 am
India

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by jayacpr » Fri May 08, 2015 8:50 am

Can understand Hsyasin :( , but we cant do anything about it :(, i have same frustration as you do , probably everyone,. :evil:

hsyasin
Member
Posts: 174
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2010 11:27 am
Location: UK

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by hsyasin » Fri May 08, 2015 9:04 am

And on their website they very easily say
"For generations, the British public have paid their taxes to help make the NHS what it is today – the surcharge will mean temporary migrants will also pay their way"
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/migr ... ion-a-year

We as migrants have to pay more and more in taxes and to live here, and we're not eligible to any benefits until we get naturalized, they how the hell did we cost nhs more than local british residents.. these locals claim more benefits while sitting home, and having babies so that they get government support, plus get tax credits and food vouchers and get housing benefit and get unemployed benefit incase they lose their job..
whereas if we lose our job, we get a stick up our's unless we find a job.. and by being jobless means, using our savings to survive until we find one, and worst case, can't find a job, get kicked out when visa expries..
how the hell are tier1 migrants a burden on nhs or causing damage to economy

iubus2005
Member
Posts: 199
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 5:29 pm

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by iubus2005 » Fri May 08, 2015 10:06 pm

Anyone knows if the visa fee is tax deductible?

abhisheks9
Member of Standing
Posts: 266
Joined: Fri May 11, 2012 9:16 am
Location: Aberdeen
India

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by abhisheks9 » Sat May 09, 2015 11:28 am

@iubus2005 No visa fee is not tax deductible.

@hsyasin many people are frustrated but no one coming together under one forum or umbrella, like I have been arguing here as well http://www.immigrationboards.com/uk-tie ... 87-20.html
Bigger problem is other people here are actually discouraging people like us to take any legal action or go for judicial review and instead defending uKBa which not only illogical or doesn't make sense but makes already frustrated people isolated, and submit to discriminatory rules and regulations.
As I have often repeated we have fb group (in my signature) where we tried hard enough to gather people but unfortunately not enough people have come forward (only few handful) and instead of fighting together everyone is happy to pay more and go through ILR for their own sake.
Disclaimer: This post does not contain legal advice

User avatar
Casa
Moderator
Posts: 25653
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:32 pm

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by Casa » Sat May 09, 2015 11:51 am

The NHS surcharge has been introduced by the Government, not the UKVI. It's just one part of the Immigration Act which became law last year.
(Casa, not CR001)
Please don't send me PMs asking for immigration advice on posts that are on the open forum. If I haven't responded there, it's because I don't have the answer. I'm a moderator, not a legal professional.

iubus2005
Member
Posts: 199
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 5:29 pm

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by iubus2005 » Sun May 10, 2015 10:24 am

@Abhishek, why is this not deductible? I have not seen anything that says otherwise. This is a work visa, and not reimbursed by the employer?

vinny
Moderator
Posts: 32760
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2007 7:58 pm

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by vinny » Sun May 10, 2015 10:47 am

This is not intended to be legal or professional advice in any jurisdiction. Please click on any given links for further information. Refer to the source of any quotes.
We do not inherit the Earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children.

abhisheks9
Member of Standing
Posts: 266
Joined: Fri May 11, 2012 9:16 am
Location: Aberdeen
India

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by abhisheks9 » Sun May 10, 2015 10:59 am

@iubus2005
Sorry there was language problem from my side may be should have explained better.
Visa fees cannot be included for any rebate for tax, that is you pay fee from your own pocket and as you said not reimbursed by employer or anyone and this in short cannot be claimed for any kind of tax exemption.
I think I am clear this time?
Disclaimer: This post does not contain legal advice

hellonewhere
Member
Posts: 139
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2015 12:27 pm

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by hellonewhere » Sun May 10, 2015 11:06 am

iubus2005 wrote:@Abhishek, why is this not deductible? I have not seen anything that says otherwise. This is a work visa, and not reimbursed by the employer?

Hi,

You might find this useful to your query.
The keyword being "wholly and exclusively" and satisfying all the other requirements mentioned.

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/ ... ductible_e

hellonewhere
Member
Posts: 139
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2015 12:27 pm

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by hellonewhere » Sun May 10, 2015 11:22 am

@iubus

To expand;

If you came to the UK specifically to work on this contract, say as a secondment for a company you were already working for, then the cost of your travel to the contract location would be allowable as would the cost of the Visa as it is specifically an associated cost of the travel. However, if you came to the UK on a tier one visa to look for work and then found this contract the cost would not be allowable and neither would the cost of travel from your home country to the UK under the wholly and exclusively rule.

I await for others' views.

secret.simon
Moderator
Posts: 10975
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 9:29 pm

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by secret.simon » Mon May 25, 2015 8:39 am

hsyasin wrote:I mean is there no stop to this? no regulatory body or anything??
I agree the charges are extortionate. Most of my friends and colleagues were shocked when I told them how much I paid through my visa journey. There is a way to put a stop to this. This is not meant in a rude manner and I do not want a flame war, but you could reevaluate whether you wish to remain in the UK.

The UKVI & the government are looking at what the market can bear. Are people flooding out of the UK to avoid paying these exorbitant charges? Not in any obvious manner.

A parallel is the increase in number of Americans renouncing US citizenship. US citizens are charged on their global income and as those taxes and responsibilities (of filing tax returns, etc) have increased onerously, people have started renouncing US citizenship. In a sense, people are voting with their wallets to leave. And that may be the only way to get this to stop.

But at the end of the day, if people are staying and paying, there is no reason for the government to reduce these charges. The Home Office is one of the few government departments other than the Treasury to earn money and given the spending reductions in the Budget, i can only see the fees and charges going one way; up.
abhisheks9 wrote:Bigger problem is other people here are actually discouraging people like us to take any legal action or go for judicial review and instead defending uKBa which not only illogical or doesn't make sense but makes already frustrated people isolated, and submit to discriminatory rules and regulations.
With respect, @abhisheks9, people giving considered contrarian views are not a problem on a community forum, they are an asset. I would rather be "discouraged" on the forum by somebody explaining an alternate viewpoint than be encouraged in indulging in idle daydreaming.

While I am not a lawyer, the prospects of a judicial review or legal action in such a case are slim bordering on non-existent. The rules are made under laws passed by Parliament, which in our unwritten constitution is supreme. There is no obvious manner in which the rules and charges are illegal.

I'm not sure that a legal action on this question (of fees and charges) would engage human rights legislation, but if it were, in any case, significant changes to human rights legislation is coming down the tracks and it would be foolhardy to think that there would be any longterm change to the Home Office policy of increasing charges regularly.

Defending the UKBA/UKVI is not illogical. It has a specific job to do and while I strongly disagree with the rules set for it by the government, I appreciate that the staff at the UKVI do the job. Compared to where I come from, I appreciate that the rules are adhered to and yet have a certain amount of discretion, that the staff do their job fairly and transparently. I do not know of many other immigration departments who publish their internal guidelines, which helps us understand what outcome to expect, if not anticipate.

secret.simon
Moderator
Posts: 10975
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 9:29 pm

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by secret.simon » Mon May 25, 2015 8:56 am

More than the fees and charges, I hate it that I have fewer rights than somebody from the EU who comes into this country, that I can not bring my parents here, that there are so many hurdles to getting a significant other here. But I have a choice; I could live by the rules here or I can leave. And having considered the matter, I choose the former.

User avatar
Casa
Moderator
Posts: 25653
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:32 pm

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by Casa » Mon May 25, 2015 9:08 am

The argument would be that as a British citizen you would have the same rights in another EU state to live there with your family without paying visa fees or with financial earnings/language conditions. i.e the rights are reciprocal at present.
(Casa, not CR001)
Please don't send me PMs asking for immigration advice on posts that are on the open forum. If I haven't responded there, it's because I don't have the answer. I'm a moderator, not a legal professional.

abhisheks9
Member of Standing
Posts: 266
Joined: Fri May 11, 2012 9:16 am
Location: Aberdeen
India

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by abhisheks9 » Mon May 25, 2015 10:53 am

@secret.simon
others discouraging viewpoints are Asset? really? how? by encouraging to cow down to discriminatory rules?
I am idle daydreaming? you yourself said you are not a lawyer and neither i am, but you are putting me down by calling my 'alternative' daydreaming, and terming other discouraging members alternatives?? seriously? you are just here trying to defend by labeling me. you call my protest as day dreaming and your discouraging words as 'alternatives', never heard such weird opinions till now here.
And again in same breathe you disagree with rules and but also defending it by calling it not illogical.
for me i think UKVI are not problem but mentality that persist here is.
Disclaimer: This post does not contain legal advice

naveediiqbal
Senior Member
Posts: 606
Joined: Sat May 26, 2012 4:49 pm
Pakistan

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by naveediiqbal » Mon May 25, 2015 12:08 pm

hsyasin wrote:I'm opening up a discussion here as m extremely frustrated with whats been going on since 2010 with tier1 holders..
The government wanted to limit immigration, fine they closed tier1 general completely.. fair enough.
Then they raised salary bands so that only "skilled" immigrants are left in the uk.. again, doesn't make that much sense as i know alot of friends working in skilled jobs including myself when i started working was just above that limit, but fair enough "Mr. Gov", only skilled worker can earn above 35k, when he is in his early stages..
But what doesn't make sense at all is visa fees, increasing year on year.. and not tiny amount.. in HUGE amounts.. first application i made, i paid around £900, ext after 2years £1500.. then wife came along around £1000 for her..
and now next year £1500 (raised from around £1000 this year) when i apply for ILR and for wife.. well £1750 for her extension and £600 for "NHS health surcharge" £2350 in total for her application :evil:

I mean is there no stop to this? no regulatory body or anything??
is there no questioning anyone of these BSs to even ask, why is there such a huge rise, like when they raise even a penny on food or alcohol, they've to be very careful and go through loads of approvals and even then takes them a while to raise the price..
but here in our case, its like, somebody gets drunk and says, hey lets charge them x amount and the rest say, yay, lets do that..
I agree

honey2008
Member
Posts: 152
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2014 6:36 pm

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by honey2008 » Mon May 25, 2015 12:48 pm

@secret.simon :- I totally agree with you.

To make changes you have to have POWER and powers lies with the Government backed by people through Parliament.

It's our choice to accept it or not accept it.

Although I don't support their frequent/high changes to VISA fees BUT it is always my choice to pay or not.

Rest we have to understand the HARD facts and take decisions accordingly to be at peace.

Also everybody has a right to an opinion that must be taken in spirit of this lovely forum and understanding/expressing different views for enhancement of his wisdom is better idea instead of accusations/questioning somebody's views.

Ta
Honey

Wanderer
Diamond Member
Posts: 10511
Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 12:46 pm
Ireland

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by Wanderer » Mon May 25, 2015 12:57 pm

Bear in mind too the visa fees have to cover the cost of running a Border Police Force, removal service, HRA court costs etc, there was none of this about 15 years ago - it was all free and we didn't have the Asylum/refugee/economic migrant situation we have now.

Factor in price elasticity of demand and you will realise UK plc can charge whatever they want, people will pay it..
An chéad stad eile Stáisiún Uí Chonghaile....

honey2008
Member
Posts: 152
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2014 6:36 pm

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by honey2008 » Mon May 25, 2015 1:05 pm

@Wanderer
Factor in price elasticity of demand and you will realise UK plc can charge whatever they want, people will pay it..


Totally agree and that's my point.

secret.simon
Moderator
Posts: 10975
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 9:29 pm

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by secret.simon » Wed May 27, 2015 8:01 pm

Wanderer wrote:Factor in price elasticity of demand and you will realise UK plc can charge whatever they want, people will pay it..
You have summed up my argument in a very economic (in both words and the terminology used) sentence. There is demand and people will pay. That is how markets (and immigration is one global market) work.

hip999
Newly Registered
Posts: 17
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2012 10:44 pm
Location: London

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by hip999 » Wed Aug 19, 2015 10:06 am

The greatest area of concern is that is charged even to those who pay taxes and, more relevantly, National Insurance. It would be fairer if it was deductible from National Insurance (NI) payments made in a year, so if you pay £500 NI per year then you have the £200 deducted from that but if you pay no NI then you pay the surcharge and have no refund.

I have checked my calculations below using easily available wages checkers on the internet but you should check for yourselves before making any decisions. I would suggest to those subject to the health surcharge that if possible they split their jobs to reduce or eliminate National Insurance payments; this is perfectly legal and can be done by any worker. This is because NI is paid on each job (if different employers) and only on wages above £8060 per year (in the 2015/2016 tax year). Your earnings above £8060 a year attract a NI rate of 12%! There is no point if you are not earning much over £8060 per year or if you enjoy your job and want to stay full time in it.

In the following example I have made no allowances for any special circumstances, just those paying full NI on their wages (which will be most people):

For example, if you are working 40 hours per week in one job (say in a Care Home) and earning £7 an hour, then your annual wage is £14560 ... the NI on this would be £780 per year. BUT, if you worked only 20 hours in that Care Home and 20 hours in a different Care Home (must be a different employer) then your will earn £7280 per year from each job AND PAY NO NATIONAL INSURANCE. This means the government took £200 off you for each year of your Visa for the health surcharge and you legally avoided paying them £780! So over a 5 year Visa you will have paid them £1000 in health surcharge and legally avoided paying £3900 in National Insurance. This would pay for the health surcharge in full and probably your Visa fees also! The two jobs do not have to be in the same field (i.e. not both in Care work); any two jobs will do.

The principle is very simple: If you earn more than £8060 in a year then you pay NI; so if you earn significantly more than this then think about having two jobs instead. BUT (obviously) do not give up a high paying job for a low paid one! And please pass on this information to anyone you know. It can save money even if not an immigrant and even if not paying health surcharges. It does not apply to income tax as that is calculated by adding together all your earnings from every source.

User avatar
Casa
Moderator
Posts: 25653
Joined: Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:32 pm

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by Casa » Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:17 am

You've missed a crucial point that NI contributions count towards your pension and other benefits...not simply the use of NHS treatment.
https://www.gov.uk/national-insurance/overview
(Casa, not CR001)
Please don't send me PMs asking for immigration advice on posts that are on the open forum. If I haven't responded there, it's because I don't have the answer. I'm a moderator, not a legal professional.

hip999
Newly Registered
Posts: 17
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2012 10:44 pm
Location: London

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by hip999 » Wed Aug 19, 2015 11:45 am

I accept what you say and agree I did not consider that fact.... but I would still say to have two jobs, perhaps one paying a small amount of NI to gain the pension or other benefits and the other at or below £8060 per year. Most immigrants are not even allowed to claim benefits so that just adds in my opinion to the reason they should try to legally avoid NI during the years of their Visa. Also, would I personally worry too much about claiming a State pension when the government keep changing the rules and age at which it can be claimed? A cynic might say they hope most people will die before or soon after claiming it. Also, most workers on a Visa will not be allowed to stay here to retirement age so probably will receive no pension at all.

Obviously these are personal choices and need to be looked at by the individual but if I was an immigrant (and I am not) being charged what, as a UK citizen and taxpayer, but with a conscience for the exploitation of the vulnerable, I regard as exhorbitant fees and now the health surcharge by the government then I would be looking to legally avoid paying NI contributions (or reducing them by at least £200 per year) for at least the period of my Visa.

yar
Newly Registered
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Jun 08, 2014 8:50 pm

Re: Visa fees and health surcharges

Post by yar » Thu Aug 27, 2015 9:59 pm

Anyone thought of filing a judicial review to challenge the NHS surcharge? Anyone knows who to do so?

Locked
cron