Naturalisation queries

[Arsal385]

I am also in the same boat. I have my appointment this week. I earned as self employed from 2009 to 2013. My return on 2014 was nil and then i closed my account. I tried calling HMRC but they kept me on hold for hours and then disconnected. Even if they issue me my return. The most recent is 2015 when i was not self employed. If i go back to 2014 my return will be nil. My SA302 will only show my salary income but all my previous returns from 2009 to 2013 are showing high incomes.
I am not sending anything with my Application accept current P60. HMRC has sent me my Account Summary for current year ending April 2015 which shows my employment income and NI amount. I am thinking of attaching that one as well.

Please Note: If you check Old AN Form the requirement for providing SA statement was still there but was for those only who were applying as Self Employed means whatever was their current status. In old form you just had to enter your current status either Employee or Self employed or Director and if employee? you just had to enter Tax Ref and in case you were SE you had to provide SA Statement. The only difference is now that we have to mention our 10 year history as well but they have not added that we have to provide them the supporting documents of whatever we have been doing in the past.

This is just my opinion and i might be wrong.

Many Thanks

I think you are right it is not mandatory to attach all the retrospective documents as I heard the more documents you attach the more you invite Home Office to dig out your history and ask you queries.
My self employment only lasted for 14 months when I was on contract and since then I am on permanent PAYE payroll for 4.5 years. We should stick to the documents that are required by Home Office.

[Rizcon]

I am also in the same boat. I have my appointment this week. I earned as self employed from 2009 to 2013. My return on 2014 was nil and then i closed my account. I tried calling HMRC but they kept me on hold for hours and then disconnected. Even if they issue me my return. The most recent is 2015 when i was not self employed. If i go back to 2014 my return will be nil. My SA302 will only show my salary income but all my previous returns from 2009 to 2013 are showing high incomes.
I am not sending anything with my Application accept current P60. HMRC has sent me my Account Summary for current year ending April 2015 which shows my employment income and NI amount. I am thinking of attaching that one as well.

Please Note: If you check Old AN Form the requirement for providing SA statement was still there but was for those only who were applying as Self Employed means whatever was their current status. In old form you just had to enter your current status either Employee or Self employed or Director and if employee? you just had to enter Tax Ref and in case you were SE you had to provide SA Statement. The only difference is now that we have to mention our 10 year history as well but they have not added that we have to provide them the supporting documents of whatever we have been doing in the past.

This is just my opinion and i might be wrong.

Many Thanks

I think you are right it is not mandatory to attach all the retrospective documents as I heard the more documents you attach the more you invite Home Office to dig out your history and ask you queries.
My self employment only lasted for 14 months when I was on contract and since then I am on permanent PAYE payroll for 4.5 years. We should stick to the documents that are required by Home Office.

AN Form just asks for the employment history within last 10 years as PAYE. It doesn't say that if some one was self employed in the past need to write his/her self employment history & nothing is mentioned in AN form Guidelines.
Why you want to write your past self employment history,if you are an employee and paying the taxes via PAYE and attach the irrelevant documents to make your case complicated?
Correct me,if I am wrong, but see the form carefully. It just asks about your nature of job,name of employer and the periods worked for the employer.

[UKBALoveStory]

Hi guys,

My Tier 1 (G) leave to enter was approved in 2009 and got ILR in 2014 with the same IELTS certficate. For English language requirements, in the AN form, there is an option
"I met the knowledge of language and life requirement to qualify for settlement on or after
28th October 2013;"

Now the question is, do I have to resubmit the same expired IELTS certificate or not?

Thanks

[CR001]

Please see FAQs English Language Requirements for Citizenship Applications (click)

[UKBALoveStory]

Please see FAQs English Language Requirements for Citizenship Applications (click)

Thanks for replying, however the FAQ does not say much about the proof.
On AN guide, page 14 it says

Evidence of knowledge of Language and of Life in the UK
From 12th November 2015, we will only accept English language qualifications from
the Home Office approved list of acceptable qualifications.
You will need to provide both:
• Letter confirming success in the Life in the UK Test, stamped and signed by
the Test Supervisor;
and either
• a Home Office approved qualification in English at B1 CEFR or higher, from
the Secure English Language Test list. You should ensure that you state the
test number at section 1.23 of the form);
OR
• confirmation that you met the English language requirement, on or after 28th
October 2013, in order to obtain settlement
OR
• Your original degree certificate and one of the following:
1. A print out from the points-based calculator, with the equivalent level of your
degree and the level of English
2. An English language Assessment (ELA) from UK NARIC (this will also show
us that UK NARIC are content that your qualification is equivalent to a UK
degree)
3. A Statement of Comparability (SoC) from UK NARIC confirming your
qualification is comparable to a UK degree, plus an official letter from your
university with your name, the title of the degree, and that the qualification was
taught in English.
4. An original and official certificate from your university confirming the degree
was taught or researched in a majority English-speaking country (except
Canada), plus and original letter or certificate from UK NARIC confirming that
the equivalent level of your degree, OR
15
• Your passport showing that you are a national of a majority English
speaking country

In my case, only the bold red options are applicable I believe (Please correct me if wrong?). But for "confirmation that you met the English language requirement, on or after 28th
October 2013, in order to obtain settlement", I think, BRP certificate and ILR approval letter should do the job. Right?

[CR001]

BRP certificate and ILR approval letter should do the job. Right?

No, the above does not 'prove' Evidence of knowledge of Language and of Life in the UK, it proves you have ILR.

You need to submit LIUK test certificate again and English B1. There have been recent refusals for not meeting the English requirement and in particular using English tests used in previous immigration applications.

Have you clicked on the links in the link I provided, it contains all the information you need.

[lynxukauq]

Now the question is, do I have to resubmit the same expired IELTS certificate or not?

Thanks

Yes just include the expired IELTS along with the application to show as evidence as how you met the requirement in the first place.

Even though there is now this option to met requirements included in the form but using NCS they will insist on how you met it and to include those documents.

[UKBALoveStory]

No, the above does not 'prove' Evidence of knowledge of Language and of Life in the UK, it proves you have ILR.

True, however It will also prove the date of approval is after Oct 2013. isn't it?

You need to submit LIUK test certificate again

agreed

and English B1.

Confused. I don't have an up-to date English certificate (expired IELTS is there which I submitted during my initial Tier 1 Approval, My degree does not give me 10 points for English and I don't have a NARIC.

My NCS appointment is non 22 December, so do I have to do
either a B1 equivalent test OR
get a NARIC equivalent of UK bachelor and letter from my university

and I can't submit the old IELTS certificate or no proof at all?

There have been recent refusals for not meeting the English requirement and in particular using English tests used in previous immigration applications.

I have not seen any examples here on the forum. I am not questioning you, but if you can provide me a link that will be great.

Have you clicked on the links in the link I provided, it contains all the information you need.

Yes, I did, hence more confused

[UKBALoveStory]

Page 14 of AN Booklet November says

If you have already satisfied the requirement to have sufficient knowledge of language and
life in the UK for settlement, by applying on or after 28 October 2013, you do not have to
demonstrate it again.

[CR001]

What is the precise details of the IELTS you have done (including awarding body etc)? Q6 in the link I provided explains about expired test you can submit.

Q6: What if my qualification (Q4) has expired?

Some qualifications on the Home Office’s list will expire after 2 years. If you’re applying for citizenship you can still use an expired test if your B1 level qualification was accepted when settling in the UK.

The most recent one I could find where a new test result was requested.
http://www.immigrationboards.com/britis ... 98520.html

[UKBALoveStory]

What is the precise details of the IELTS you have done (including awarding body etc)?

IELTS General,
Centre Stamp, British Council Lahore, Pakistan.
Test date, Sept 2008.
Validation Stamp, Cambridge ESOL, British Council.

[torikelly91]

Personally I'd suggest doing a new language test since yours is from 2008. If it was more recent like 2013 onwards then may be but its 7 years old.

[CR001]

Validation Stamp, Cambridge ESOL

Not sure if this will be a problem as ESOL is no longer accepted by HO.

[UKBALoveStory]

Page 14 of AN Booklet November says

If you have already satisfied the requirement to have sufficient knowledge of language and
life in the UK for settlement, by applying on or after 28 October 2013, you do not have to
demonstrate it again.

Thanks for replying. Now, from I am more worried than confused
What about this guidance?

[CR001]

From 19 November 2015, you won’t be able to use ESOL qualifications as proof for settlement and citizenship applications.

This is well documented now, ESOL is no longer accepted.

That aside, you still need to submit proof of LIUK and meeting the English requirement with your citizenship application, even if you met the requirement after 28 October 2013.

[lynxukauq]

Page 14 of AN Booklet November says

If you have already satisfied the requirement to have sufficient knowledge of language and
life in the UK for settlement, by applying on or after 28 October 2013, you do not have to
demonstrate it again.

Thanks for replying. Now, from I am more worried than confused
What about this guidance?

Reading from the guidance it does says that you don't have to demonstrate it

ACCEPTABLE QUALIFICATIONS (CLICK)

As of 12th November 2015, we will only accept an English language qualification that is on
the Home Office’s list of approved tests as evidence that you have met the requirement
to hold a B1 level English qualification. This must be taken at a Home Office approved
test centre.

The list of recognised tests can be found on the gov.uk website:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... uage-tests.

If you met the requirement to have sufficient knowledge of language and life in the UK when
you applied for settlement by having a B1 level test you do not have to demonstrate it
again. (People who applied for settlement on or after 28 October 2013 needed to have had
a B1 level qualification.)

[psnlb]

I was in the exact same situation as yours with same entry and ILR dates. I used TOEFL to get my Tier 2 in 2009. For naturalization I ended up with a letter from HO requesting I pass a new test so I did the Trinity College one. My advice is to just do a new one. Hope this helps.

[ALI97]

Hi CROO1
If this is the case that everybody have to prove again life in UK test and English knowledge, they why the option is still there on AN firm that I already met English Knowledge on or after 28 October 13
I applied via ncs Aberdeen and they confirmed from home office and just tick on an form and said no need to submit English knowledge proof and I never submitted ...as my application still in process applied on 24 November 15

[UKBALoveStory]

Hi CROO1
If this is the case that everybody have to prove again life in UK test and English knowledge, they why the option is still there on AN firm that I already met English Knowledge on or after 28 October 13
I applied via ncs Aberdeen and they confirmed from home office and just tick on an form and said no need to submit English knowledge proof and I never submitted ...as my application still in process applied on 24 November 15

Also, See the second response on this thread

http://www.immigrationboards.com/britis ... l#p1235062

[cs95tdg]

I think a pertinent question to ask the Home office is whether a English language qualification that is no longer on the list of acceptable English qualifications (subsequent to Nov 12th, 2015), but was valid at the time you were granted ILR (after Oct 2013), would that still be acceptable for naturalisation?

Personally if I had such a qualification and were planning to apply for naturalisation after November 12th, I'd do a new test and submit it instead.

But it's worth asking the question from the Home office, if you do not wish to do so.

[UKBALoveStory]

I think a pertinent question to ask the Home office is whether a English language qualification that is no longer on the list of acceptable English qualifications (subsequent to Nov 12th, 2015), but was valid at the time you were granted ILR (after Oct 2013), would that still be acceptable for naturalisation?

Personally if I had such a qualification and were planning to apply for naturalisation after November 12th, I'd do a new test and submit it instead.

But it's worth asking the question from the Home office, if you do not wish to do so.

I can see few questions on whatdotheyknow with no response from home office
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/ ... _3_for_app
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/ ... met_the_kn

[cs95tdg]

Based on that, it comes down to whether you would prefer to 1) write and ask the question yourself - then wait for a response, 2) risk possible complications by going ahead with your existing qualification or 3) doing a acceptable test and submitting that instead.

I'm generally risk averse, so would personally write and ask the question myself (then again may be not, if you'd rather not delay your application), and if I didn't receive a reply within a reasonable timeframe, just to do another acceptable test instead.

It beats the possibly of having the home office delay your application, asking for alternate evidence at a later date. Or even the possibility of the application being refused, and having to submit a reconsideration request. All of which are complicated. Keep it simple if possible.

[UKBALoveStory]

Based on that, it comes down to whether you would prefer to 1) write and ask the question yourself - then wait for a response, 2) risk possible complications by going ahead with your existing qualification or 3) doing a acceptable test and submitting that instead.

I'm generally risk averse, so would personally write and ask the question myself (then again may be not, if you'd rather not delay your application), and if I didn't receive a reply within a reasonable timeframe, just to do another acceptable test instead.

It beats the possibly of having the home office delay your application, asking for alternate evidence at a later date. Or even the possibility of the application being refused, and having to submit a reconsideration request. All of which are complicated. Keep it simple if possible.

I have called home office helpline at two separate occasions today and they confirmed it is acceptable, however I also know that the advice provided by call centre guys is not trustworthy. I have also sent couple of emails, will post when and if I get any response.

[UKBALoveStory]

Meanwhile on this link
https://www.gov.uk/english-language/app ... ifications

It says

Some qualifications on the Home Office’s list expire after 2 years.

You can use an expired test if:

you’re applying for citizenship and your B1 level qualification was accepted when settling in the UK
you’re applying to settle in the UK and your qualification was accepted for another UK immigration application, eg when you got permission to enter

I think it now clarify that it should be acceptable. Do you guys agree? especially CROO1, as I found you always helpful and knowledgeable.

[cs95tdg]

Is your qualification on this list below?

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... ebsite.pdf

The fact that has now expired would not matter.