Immigrationboards.com

[SRAQAI]

Hi All,

Some here know about my case, with my Husband in Pakistan attempting to obtain a Schengan entry visa for France, from the French Embassy, Islamabad. His last application was rejected based on Article 32, point 2 of the Visa Code, which does not apply to us. An appeal has been posted to them and I have got acknowledgement of receipt from the Appeals Commission in Nantes, France. Now we are waiting out the appeal which can take upto 2 months. In the meantime, we have lodged another application to the French Embassy, Islamabad, which was submitted 2 days ago. This is because we want to travel in the second week of September. So much hassle!

Now, in regards to the rejected application, for which we appealed, I also contacted France based SOLVIT team, after being advised to do so by 'Your Europe' advice. However, they again referred me back to the useless UK SOLVIT team, who then emailed me, wanting to 'deal' with my case. of course, once again, this person who works for UK SOLVIT refused to take forward my complaint. She says:

"The Directive wording is that it applies to citizens who move to and reside in another Member State, and to their family members to accompany or join them there. At the time of the application, you had not exercised free movement rights to move to another Member State. The Directive applies at the point that you move to another Member State, and then your husband can make an application to join you, unless he is accompanying you at the time, in line with Article 3.1 of Directive 2004/38/EC."

Is this correct? Does one already need to be in Europe, in order for the Directive to kick in? She is making out that I have to already be in France before my husband can apply at the embassy for a visa. How comes this is an issue, she is telling me about NOW, and did not mention a word about this, since July 2011?? Ive been in contact with her throughout this ordeal, until I refused to deal with her. This UK 'SOLVIT' person makes every effort to NOT help us. My husband has been trying to obtain a visa and each time the UK SOLVIT have relied on 'grey areas' in order to not take forward our case. Last time, she questioned whether our marriage certificate was recognised by the embassy, even though the Embassy themselves did not highlight this issue to us. She is just pulling things out of thin air.

If I had to be in France at the time hubby applies for the visa, then I am sure the Embassy would have rejected the application on this basis, but they did not.

I have contacted 'Your Europe' again explaining this and I am awaiting their response, along with a request for advice as to what to do, if this new application is rejected. The difference with this new application, is that now, me and my husband will be traveling together from Pakistan, instead of him joining me there... but I wanted to know whether I do in fact have to be in France at the time my husband applies for a visa.
This will help me decipher what the outcome of the appeal could be.

Our plan was that I was going to travel to France as soon as hubby gets the visa, and then he was going to fly out a couple of days after I arrive there. Does this not fall under the Directive 2004/38/EC?

Thank you!

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

[SRAQAI]

Thanks so much, Emillie for the reply

I have been dealing with the UK SOLVIT 'team' on and off since July 2011, when my husband first attempted to get an entry visa into France. She has been having a laugh since then. One minute she thinks our marriage is not valid, even though the French Embassy themselves have not pointed that out, and the next minute the Directive doesn't apply to us! We have been trying the same route since July 2011, and me entering France before or after the hubby does, wasn't relevant before, it just seems to be now. I have made all the complaints against her to every facility I can think of, including the EU Commission, Your Europe, the EU Ombudsman and the BIS, where she is stationed. UK SOLVIT is only a one man band - or woman shall I say.

I just sent her an email outlining Metock case, but I am concerned that because it focuses on the fact that the non-EU Citizen doesnt have to be in the EU before the Directive kicks in, she might just turn around and say "Well, there is nothing specific that mentions that a Union Citizen doesn't have to be in a second EU state before Directive kicks in". She tries every single tactic to make out that we do not qualify and the responses to my complaints that I have made, were that they cannot deal with it because SOLVIT does not fall under their scope.

When the French Embassy made it troublesome for us to lodge an application, her response was that "there is no evidence that the French Embassy acted in contradiction to the Directive" !!!!!

Hubby's application is in for the third time... lets see how this turns out! Ive also got acknowledgement for receipt of my appeal from France, they will take 2 months to process. I also complained about the UK SOLVIT in that too!

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

Regarding the perosn you are daling with in SOLVIT, they must have a reporting structure and or complaints procedure. In general, people are accountable to someone else at the end of the day.

Can I suggest that if you still have problems with this particular person that you ask them for a third party review? I would suggest something along the lines of "you appear to be misinformed about the application of the directive 2004/38/EC and in particular, its relevance to my case. I request that my request for SOLVIT involvement is treated seriously. For the avoidance of doubt this is a complaint and is to be treated as such. Please detail your complaints procedure and advise how my case could be reviewed by someone else within the SOLVIT organisation. Thank you".

[SRAQAI]

Oh, ive done that many months ago. This was her response:

"Good afternoon [name removed]

As I am Head of the UK SOLVIT team, you can make a complaint about me to BIS complaints, http://www.bis.gov.uk/contact/complaints

Regards

[Name removed]
UK SOLVIT Centre

There is not a 'team' of UK SOLVIT, it is only herself in the UK. I made a complaint to the people she mentioned that I should complain to. No use. They never heard of her and hence cannot take a complaint for an organization that they are not a part of. They referred me to the UKBA.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

[SRAQAI]

Emillie,

Thank you so much for your encouragement, and I must say, thank you so much for your contribution to this forum

Do you think its worth sending a complaint to the UKBA about her? I don't think she is employed by them or has anything to do with them, so I am not sure its worth it. I think SOLVIT is an EU Commission organization, however when I complained to the Ombudsman, they said they cannot take up this complaint. Where else to complain?

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

Definitely not UKBA. It is not their issue.

Keep at them, someone will listen eventually. Have you tried your Euro MP?

[SRAQAI]

[toto italy]

Maybe this will be of help to you.

http://ec.europa.eu/solvit/site/centres/addresses/index.htm#ukingdom
_________________
Toto Italy

[toto italy]

Maybe this will be of help to you.

http://ec.europa.eu/solvit/site/centres/addresses/index.htm#ukingdom
_________________
Toto Italy

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

[SRAQAI]

Thanks so much to both of you

I have another question. We have the third application in for the French entry visa and its still being processed. If, again, they reject the application, I am thinking of just giving up - ill get my husband to pack his bags and we will travel together from Pakistan (im in Pakistan right now, trying to sort this out!). Getting a visa to Dubai for Pakistani passport holders is not an issues and Emirates airlines actually give you one, if you book a flight with them. Me and hubby had our honeymoon in Dubai for this reason that getting a visa there is easy. From Pakistan back to EU, one usually have to transit in Dubai anyway, or somewhere in the UAE or Gulf. Now the Pakistan-Dubai leg of the trip will not be a problem, but the Dubai-Paris leg might be. If I print out the Directive and me and my husband just try and board the flight together, do you think we will have major problems? I am thinking of contacting Emirates now, and educating them about this Directive and telling them our travel plans, mentioning that we will be traveling together, but my husband will be without a visa.

What do you think?

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

[SRAQAI]

Thanks Emillie,

Yes this is what I am worried about - the Boarding of the flight. From Pakistan to Dubai, we shouldnt have an issue, because he will have a visit Visa for the UAE. I spoke to the local Emirates office here in Pakistan and I mentioned to them an EU Regulation, which allows Pakistani passport holders to travel without a visa, as long as an EU Citizen Spouse was traveling with them. I tried to keep it simple. He mentioned that if there is an EU Regulation stating this, then there should be no reason why he would be denied boarding onto the flight from Dubai. Thing is, I do not want to risk it, I want to make sure that there will be someone in Dubai from Emirates who is expecting us and can make sure my husband will board our flight and they can make the necessary checks before hand. He advised me to come and see them at the Emirates office, which Ill probably do tomorrow.

The reason why I chose France (Paris in particular) is because of its easy access to London. Ill need to travel a few times a week to London and also, I want to do business in Paris, so it makes sense to do it in France. I have been thinking about Ireland though... considering its an English speaking country...

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

[SRAQAI]

Thank you Emillie

Just throwing this one out there, but what do you think of the liklihood that he could be held/detained in France at the border there? I know I am being unrealistic and the chances of this are slim, but I want to be prepared for the worst case scenario - being a Pakistani in today's world (especially in the west) means that they are not welcomed with such open arms!

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

[Directive/2004/38/EC]