UK Citizen resident in Ireland with Russian Wife - help :(

zen63 · Post by **zen63** » Wed Jun 21, 2006 6:26 pm

My wife and I got married in Russia (she is a Russian Citizen - I am British) and received a single entry visa to fly back to Ireland. I have been living in Ireland for 13 years, have a business here, and employ a number of Irish workers.

We have submitted an EU1 form, and today I was told that this WILL take six months to process. Does anyone know if the system in other EU states is as bad?

This is very annoying as it prevents us from leaving the country and seems to have an impact on her working here (I need to research this more). I understand that before the end of May the GNIB handled these requests directly and the process took a few weeks.

I am furious at the Justice Department for placing these restrictions on us, and effectivly not giving her the rights she is entitled to as the spouse of an EU citizen.

I have lodged a complaint with the head of the the EU treaty rights dept within the Department of Justice. I will also be seeking help from the Irish Obuds(wo)man who agrees this is a crazy wait, the EU petitions system, my local councillor, and local TD.

I'll post back to here if/when I get news,

Does anyone on here have any other advice, or ways in which I can handle this?

Also is it possible for my wife to obtain a PPS number so that she can start working?

Thanks,

Zen

zen63 · Post by **zen63** » Wed Jun 21, 2006 7:07 pm

As far as I can see from the Department of Social and Family Affairs website, you cannot obtain a PPS number to work in Ireland without first getting your Green Card.

So my wife must live in Ireland for six months without the ability to work? This is in contrast to what I have read elsewhere on this forum, how are other spouses able to start work?

zen63 · Post by **zen63** » Wed Jun 21, 2006 7:15 pm

More interesting findings - it seems that my wife cannot apply for an Irish driving licence as this also requires a PPS number.

So thats:

Cannot work
Cannot travel
Cannot vote
Cannot drive
Cannot get bank account

Oh god, im working up a head of steam right now!

Post by **John** » Wed Jun 21, 2006 7:20 pm

Does anyone know if the system in other EU states is as bad?

Unfortunately yes! The EU regulations give member countries up to six months to deal with these applications ... and member countries seem to have an uncanny ability to beat that deadline by just a few days.

If I were you I would take this up with your MEP.

The underlying problem here is that Member States get no money for processing these applications, so tend to give them very low priority, lower priority that applications they are charging money for.

But look upon the bright side .... at least your wife got her use-once visa and is with you. Some other countries would have effectively enforced the couple to spend months apart.

Is the UK as bad? Here we are in June and it is currently looking at some applications made at far back as January.

scrudu · Post by **scrudu** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 11:57 am

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but from the information we have been given, it can take up to 18 months to process, not merely 6. If you read some earlier posts, there are simliar discussions. One poster says she has been waiting 8 months already and still no end in sight

Try going to the Green party. I found them quite helpful. But the most they can do is write a letter in support of your case. And it seems that the Dept of Justice simply ignore these.

It seems there are quite a lot of us in the this situation (IRL and citizens of other EU countries married to non-EU spouses) who are left waiting while their partners application is processed.

The Dept of Justice seem extremely concerned about the few well known cases of "marriages of convenience" and I am presuming this is their way of pushing back. Make it difficult for all and you will probably stop those types of marriages. I am reading an old Oireachtas (government) debate on the subject that is quite interesting to show the beliefs and mindsets that set up this crazy system: http://www.irlgov.ie/committees-00/c-ju ... efault.htm

Best of luck with it, and if you find any other faster solution, let me know! As i said in other posts, the other option available that was recommended to me by the Dept of Justice was "to send your spouse back home, to apply for a D-Spouse visa which should take 8-12 wks to process (reality often longer), and when this is granted she can re-enter with full working/residency rights". Of course this means your wife will be abroad for the next few months

scrudu · Post by **scrudu** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 2:18 pm

Out of curiousity, are you sure that your wife cannot apply for a PPS number to entitle her to work? A friend of mine (Irish) who is married to a Canadian citizen told me that her husband applied for a PPS number (a few years ago), and was granted it. In this way he entered the system, was able to get a bank A/C, mortgage etc.

I just read on the Irish Gov website http://www.welfare.ie/foi/cis_ppsallprocs.html

From my reading of this information, armed with a passport and the other evidence required, your wife should be able to apply for a PPS number, and then quote her Marriage (show marriage Cert) to her future employer to allow her to work?

5. ALLOCATION OF PPS NUMBER

5.1 Where a PPS Number cannot be traced, you will be asked to complete a PPS Number Application Form (REG 1) . The information required on page 1 of the form - "Public Service Identity Data" - is prescribed by law (Social Welfare (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2002, section 12). You will appreciate that Proof of Identity is a vitally important aspect of the PPS Number allocation procedure and must be established before a PPS Number is allocated. The documents you present in support of your application may be held for checking and your signature on the form will be witnessed by the officer receiving your application . To help with your application we list here the prescribed documents to accompany a PPS Number application:

5.5 PROOF OF ID - NON EEA NATIONALS

* Current Valid Passport or Certificate of Registration with the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Green Book or Plastic Card)
and
* Evidence of either birth/work*/unemployment/residency/tax liability/education in the foreign country.
(* includes Work Permit or letter from the Dept. of Justice, Equality and Law Reform giving permission to work)
and
* Evidence of address in Ireland

5.6 The following must not be accepted as Proof of ID:

* Short version of a Republic of Ireland Birth Certificate
* Provisional Driving Licence
* Baptismal Certificate
* Personal letters
* Photo-copies of certificates
* Statements or Books for recently opened Savings Accounts

5.7 The usual proof of address is a utility/household bill but if you don't have one the following are acceptable alternative documents showing address: Official letter/document, financial statement, property lease or tenancy agreement, receipt/bill for rented accommodation, a letter from your employer confirming employment and showing your address. If you are staying with friends or relatives and have none of the above documents then a letter from the householder confirming your residency is acceptable. You will appreciate that all above documents must show both your name and Irish address. If you are a married woman where no bills or documents are in your own name you should mention this and present the household bill.

3. General

It is important for you to understand that neither the Social Services Card or the Temporary Payments Card are Proof of Identity nor are they proof of the right to work in Ireland. Work Permits are generally required by persons from outside the EEA.

scrudu · Post by **scrudu** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 2:19 pm

oh, and as an aside, your wife does not need her residency to apply for a bank account. She will need a bill addressed to her at her Address. But like for the PPS people, she can supply a bill in your name, along with a copy of your bank A/C or P60 to prove she is living there.

This varies from bank to bank on what docs they need! But you do not have to be resident to get a bank A/C

mik · Post by **mik** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 12:53 pm

Scrudu ,

I have also been told that EU 1 and EU 3 applications must be dealt with in 6 months ; this was confirmed by justice dept . helpdesk . This method of application has only been available since May , so anyone applying before May - such as someone waiting 8 months - must be using a different route .

scrudu · Post by **scrudu** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 1:12 pm

Hi Mik,

I did read that due to changes in EU law, the Dept of Justice is not allowed take longer than 6 months to process. The Immigration Council also noted that you have the right to complain to the EU Commission if it did take longer. But last time I spoke to both Dept of Justice and Immigration council (early May) they said it would take longer. But as you say, perhaps this was because the new legislation was not yet in place.

So hopefullly you are right, and now the Dept of Justice will be forced to take less time on the application. That's very welcome news

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UK Citizen resident in Ireland with Russian Wife - help :(

UK Citizen resident in Ireland with Russian Wife - help :(