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3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Use this section for queries concerning applications on any of the EEA series of forms, and also for applications for EEA Family Permits.

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RedMoon
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3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Post by RedMoon » Sun Aug 11, 2013 11:14 pm

Hi,

I have a question regarding continuity of exercising treaty rights. My situation is as follows:

1) started employment (part-time, 16,5h): 30 March 2006
2) received Work Registration Scheme certificate for that start date: 9 May 2006
3) received HO Residence Registration Certificate: 22 Jan 2007
4) studied for BSc: Oct 2006 to Sept 2009 -proof of sufficient funds available but no comprehensive health insurance as until today I did not know about the requirement
5) studied for MSc 30 Oct 2009 - 29 Sept 2010, graduated: 12 April 2011 -again sufficient funds but no comprehensive health insurance
6) while studying for MSc I voluntarily left part-time job from point 1) to focus on writing MSc dissertation. I received HMRC P45 Part 1A Details of Employee leaving work 27 June 2010. I was only a student for these 3 months not seeking work or ill.
7) went on quick holidays abroad between 9 and 15 Sept 2010.
8 ) Received contract of graduate, full-time employment March 2010 with the starting date: 20 September 2010. I took it on and work there to date.

In one word: I have a 3 months gap in continuity of employment when I was only a student but without comprehensive medical insurance. My question is: are Immigration Officers very strict about such gap and/or lack of comprehensive medical insurance when they assess cases for naturalisation?

Thank you so much in advance for sharing your experiences.


THE NOX

sheraz7
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Re: 3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Post by sheraz7 » Mon Aug 12, 2013 12:03 am

RedMoon wrote:Hi,

I have a question regarding continuity of exercising treaty rights. My situation is as follows:

1) started employment (part-time, 16,5h): 30 March 2006
2) received Work Registration Scheme certificate for that start date: 9 May 2006
3) received HO Residence Registration Certificate: 22 Jan 2007
4) studied for BSc: Oct 2006 to Sept 2009 -proof of sufficient funds available but no comprehensive health insurance as until today I did not know about the requirement
5) studied for MSc 30 Oct 2009 - 29 Sept 2010, graduated: 12 April 2011 -again sufficient funds but no comprehensive health insurance
6) while studying for MSc I voluntarily left part-time job from point 1) to focus on writing MSc dissertation. I received HMRC P45 Part 1A Details of Employee leaving work 27 June 2010. I was only a student for these 3 months not seeking work or ill.
7) went on quick holidays abroad between 9 and 15 Sept 2010.
8 ) Received contract of graduate, full-time employment March 2010 with the starting date: 20 September 2010. I took it on and work there to date.

In one word: I have a 3 months gap in continuity of employment when I was only a student but without comprehensive medical insurance. My question is: are Immigration Officers very strict about such gap and/or lack of comprehensive medical insurance when they assess cases for naturalisation?

Thank you so much in advance for sharing your experiences.


THE NOX
http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/eucit ... ealthcare/

Students issued with a registration certificate before 20 June 2011

if you were not asked to provide evidence of comprehensive sickness insurance, and later apply for permanent residence as a student, your application will not be refused solely on the grounds that there is no evidence of comprehensive sickness insurance on the date of decision.

For further guidance on the transitional arrangements for students who were issued with a registration certificate prior to 20 June 2011, please see Annex B of Chapter 6 of the European Casework Instructions (ECIs).
Please donot send PM. Write in open forum to facilitate others too.
REGARDS

RedMoon
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Post by RedMoon » Sun Aug 18, 2013 3:33 pm

First of all, big thanks for pointing me to this guide. Very helpful. I’ve spent the whole of yesterday pondering over the Regulations on legislation.gov.uk and only got confused.

I’ve followed: Chapter 6 of the European Casework Instructions (ECIs): http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... dlaw/ecis/

There seems to be couple of things going on here:

These arrangements [no requirement for comprehensive medical insurance in the transitional period] apply only to EEA nationals applying for permanent residence documentation on the basis of being a student where they have been issued with a registration certificate in that capacity before 20 June 2011.

+ (UKBA issued a registration certificate to the applicant on the basis of their residence in the UK as a student before 20 June 2011.)


1) on the basis of being a student -does it mean being a student now (still being a student as I am no longer a student) or being a student during the gap period that I have and being a worker (as I currently am) for the rest of the period? In other words: is it possible to exercise different types of treaty rights in different periods (student, worker) and still qualify for these transitional arrangements?

2) in that capacity -does anyone know what would be the quickest way to find out from HO whether I applied as a worker or as a student?

3) are these transitional arrangements only for the purpose of comprehensive medical insurance or also for the purpose of the proof of funds?

Also, going back to one of the limbs of my original questions: 4) assuming that there will be a gap: is a gap of 3 months likely to be considered breaking the continuity of Treaty Rights?

Big thanks for reply,


THE NOX

RedMoon
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Post by RedMoon » Sat Aug 24, 2013 8:30 pm

Could anyone please reply. It would be really helpful.

EUsmileWEallsmile
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Post by EUsmileWEallsmile » Sun Aug 25, 2013 8:23 am

I suspect that an application as described would be refused by the home office. I'm not certain this would be the case. If you'd applied as a student without CSI and received a certificate, then the exemption would apply. You didn't do that.

Why do you require PR? As an EU citizen worker, you can live in the UK pretty much hassle free.

It would appear that you would qualify for PR in September 2015, which is not that far away.

RedMoon
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Post by RedMoon » Sun Aug 25, 2013 2:38 pm

First of all big thanks for your reply.

Just to clarify and in light of my questions: so I understand that you mean that an application with a 3 months gap where I was only a student but without comprehensive medical insurance is likely to be refused.

But if I applied as a student for HO Residence Registration Certificate that would mean that I would be fine without CSI as I could either claim the whole period as a student (still without CSI for any part of the period) or all as a worker and only these 3 months gap as a student?

I understand that I will still need proof of funds for any period of claiming as a student as this is not affected by transitional period and also that just because work was part time (average 16,5h it does not make it ineligible)?

Is this correct in your opinion?

On the point of citizenship there are many reasons why I need to do it and also why I didn’t do it so far. I didn’t do it so far because as you say it does not make much difference. But need to do it as after all these years I’ve assimilated into this country more than to my country of origin. Also, practically: things can change with the Government making the rules tougher as in the future or more expensive or both + there might be a prospect of UK leaving EU and assuming that it is not certain what the new rules would be.

I guess that in 2015 the whole process will be about 500 pounds more expensive. Luckily I’ve got FCE English Certificate (ancient now) so will not be too affected by new October language requirements.

EUsmileWEallsmile
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Post by EUsmileWEallsmile » Sun Aug 25, 2013 9:46 pm

I'm a little confused by your questions.

If you had applied for a residence certificate in the capacity of student and and had been accepted, CSI would not apply. Otherwise it would.

What did you do?

RedMoon
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Re: 3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Post by RedMoon » Mon Dec 30, 2013 4:42 pm

Hi all,

I need to try to resurrect this thread a bit because I have just found out from UKBA that I have received my Registration Certificate as a student (before 20 June 2011). Your help with it would be greatly appreciated.
As a reminder (of what was said in an initial post) I have been a part-time worker during Uni, have quit this job to write a dissertation (so was only a student at this time) and 3 months later started a graduate job, in which I work in to this day.

I have a couple of questions regarding applicability of the transitional arrangements (that waive the requirement for CSI):
Annex B of Chapter 6 of the European Casework Instructions: http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... iew=Binary states that: “These arrangements apply only to EEA nationals applying for permanent residence documentation on the basis of being a student where they have been issued with a registration certificate in that capacity before 20th June 2011.”

1) I am not clear what “on the basis of being a student” means: -does it mean being a student now (still being a student and applying while being a student -I am no longer a student but a worker now) or being a student during any period that I want to claim exercising Treaty Rights for? In other words: is it possible to exercise different types of treaty rights in different periods (e.g. worker then student then worker) and still qualify for these transitional arrangements?

2) Assuming that I will not qualify for the transitional arrangements because of failing in point 1). Do I have to provide evidence of CSI for the whole period when I was a student or only that I have CSI at the point of application? (I’ve heard of such interpretations so would like to clear that as I will have comprehensive CSI through my employer at the point of application).

3) Am I right that these transitional arrangements only apply to CSI and I will still need to show the evidence of sufficient funds for the three month period when I was only a student?

Thank you very much in advance for your help.

askmeplz82
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Re: 3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Post by askmeplz82 » Mon Dec 30, 2013 7:57 pm

UK Student Visa : 04/2004 - 09/2009
EEA Residence Stamp: 12/2009 - 03/2010
EEA Residence Card : 07/2010 - 7/2015
Eu Settlement Scheme : 01/05/ 2019
Biometrics: 01/05/2019
COA: 03/05/2019
EU Settled Status: Confirmed on 16th July 2019

RedMoon
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Re: 3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Post by RedMoon » Mon Dec 30, 2013 8:18 pm

Hi, thanks for your reply.

Unfortunately, the link that you have sent contains mostly the same information to Annex B of the link (http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... iew=Binary) that I was basing my questions on.

nemerkh
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Re: 3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Post by nemerkh » Tue Dec 31, 2013 12:09 am

Well my friend had a similar case. He is noneu wife is eu. She had a 3 months gap in employment. Sent for eea3/4 without CSI. Home office sent application back explaining that he needed a CSI. so he bought a CSI (obviously from the application date-ie not being covered back to the 3 months of gap) and resent the application to HO. got his PR within 3 weeks.

By definition you should have had CSI for those 3 months but you could hit a lucky strike.

RedMoon
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Re: 3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Post by RedMoon » Thu Jan 02, 2014 9:29 pm

Thanks for your reply.

He he, I suspect that they misinterpreted the phrase: having/not having a CSI at the point of application -I am not sure whether the regulations mean to have CSI when applying (for the current period) or submit the proof of CSI for the past period claimed as a student so at the time of application it is there for caseworker consideration. -one of my questions referred to that. Does anyone else have experience/knowledge to share?

Also, my period of not working is "covered" by studying as well so although now I will be applying as a worker (and not a student) if I qualify under transitional arrangements I will qualify for an exception from CSI requirement -this is the second question I am looking for answers to.

Big thanks for your help.

RedMoon
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Re: 3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Post by RedMoon » Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:47 pm

Could anyone help with this question? Big thanks

monab
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Re: 3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Post by monab » Tue Oct 27, 2015 9:32 am

RedMoon wrote:Hi all,

I need to try to resurrect this thread a bit because I have just found out from UKBA that I have received my Registration Certificate as a student (before 20 June 2011). Your help with it would be greatly appreciated.
As a reminder (of what was said in an initial post) I have been a part-time worker during Uni, have quit this job to write a dissertation (so was only a student at this time) and 3 months later started a graduate job, in which I work in to this day.

I have a couple of questions regarding applicability of the transitional arrangements (that waive the requirement for CSI):
Annex B of Chapter 6 of the European Casework Instructions: http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... iew=Binary states that: “These arrangements apply only to EEA nationals applying for permanent residence documentation on the basis of being a student where they have been issued with a registration certificate in that capacity before 20th June 2011.”

1) I am not clear what “on the basis of being a student” means: -does it mean being a student now (still being a student and applying while being a student -I am no longer a student but a worker now) or being a student during any period that I want to claim exercising Treaty Rights for? In other words: is it possible to exercise different types of treaty rights in different periods (e.g. worker then student then worker) and still qualify for these transitional arrangements?

2) Assuming that I will not qualify for the transitional arrangements because of failing in point 1). Do I have to provide evidence of CSI for the whole period when I was a student or only that I have CSI at the point of application? (I’ve heard of such interpretations so would like to clear that as I will have comprehensive CSI through my employer at the point of application).

3) Am I right that these transitional arrangements only apply to CSI and I will still need to show the evidence of sufficient funds for the three month period when I was only a student?

Thank you very much in advance for your help.
Hi there,

I bit late to the topic, but did you manage to clarify what 'on the basis of being a student' meant?
What registration certificate did you have?
I am unsure if my Blue card registration certificate received before 20 June 2011 on the basis of obtaining a higher education degree in UK (so, on the basis of my residence as a student in UK - my interpretation) would qualify me for these transitional agreements.

Your help is highly appreciated, thanks!
Anyone that had experience on this, please shed some light... Thanks again!

RedMoon
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Re: 3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Post by RedMoon » Tue Oct 27, 2015 10:55 am

Hi,

From what I've found out calling the helpline (UKBA European Enquiries: 0300 123 2253 ?) you don't still need to be a student but needed to be a student for the time you are claiming to be a student. And this is the period which naturally would count toward your "Treaty Rights claim period" -pretty straightforward, I think I overcomplicated things a bit there.

My interpretation of your situation is that because you were granted HO registration card on the basis of higher education in the UK (and I understand you were not working at that time so there is no risk of confusion) you should qualify under transitional arrangements.

But if I were you I would ring UKBA and check whether they have documents (or at least their titles) to confirm. In my case they did not have documents anymore, but had title of a fax to the University to check whether I study there which for me was an indication that they should interpret issuance of my card as a student and not a worker. From what I know there is no "tick box" student/worker in their registration card file.

As a side note relating to the reason for my thread (3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights? -only covered as a student without CSI: I received naturalisation without any enquiries. Straight letter with approval so really glad.

Big thanks to everyone for their help with all my posts!

monab
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Re: 3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Post by monab » Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:07 am

Hi, many thanks for your reply!

Congratulations on your naturalisation! I know exactly how you felt, I also tend to over-think things now. I just don't want to waste £1000 on a misinterpretation...

To clarify my previous post, I was not working, and had just finished my degree when I applied for the Blue card (with the intention to work).
It all indicates that I do qualify, I just wanted to make sure they don't just refer to yellow cards (that clearly certify your student status) and Blue card on the UK degree avenue also qualify.

Best regards

monab
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Re: 3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Post by monab » Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:11 am

One more thing - I did call the helpline and every time I get a different answer and never an exact one. I have a feeling they don't really know the details of the transitional agreements I refer to, and if I go into details on which certificate exempts you I never get a clear answer.

I wanted to have a written answer with an answer on the matter, but I never received a reply from HO.
So I am just trying to make my best guess, to feel as confident as possible before risking the fee for naturalisation.

RedMoon
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Re: 3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Post by RedMoon » Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:20 am

Hi again,

Exactly, £1000 is a lot of money to risk. Hence I was so rigorous.

If you want to be on a safe side you may want to try to apply the same rigour which might complicate things a bit: you were no longer a student when the registration certificate was issued (although you could argue that it was issued on the basis of being a student -as there were no other basis). It might be down to case officer interpretation, although I think you should be fine.

BTW: Beware of my advice as I am a plain guy with knowledge of the application process limited to my own application and nothing beyond so please cross-check or ring them up to confirm.

to prove the above e.g. I have no idea what yellow card is, and by HO registration certificate I mean the one with the front I've attached to this reply.
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monab
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Re: 3 Months gap in claiming Treaty Rights?

Post by monab » Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:30 am

No worries RedMoon, I will take your advice with caution.
That is the exact registration certificate I had.
All sounds logic to me, though I will give it a bit more consideration if I should actually speak to a solicitor.

Thanks for all!

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