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Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Use this section for any queries concerning the EU Settlement Scheme, for applicants holding pre-settled and settled status.

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Tairdoh
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Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by Tairdoh » Mon Oct 03, 2022 5:11 pm

Hi,
I'm just inquiring about a possibility to apply for Settled status for my mother who has been on her Pre-Settled status since May 2021
She is 67 years old and has reached her state pension age already but not receiving a pension yet being not from the U.K. originally. She's currently working too mainly doing full time hours work.
But recently I have come across this excerpt stating that:
"If you retired or had to stop working

If you get a UK State Pension, you’ll automatically get settled status if your late application to the EU Settlement Scheme is successful.
You might get settled status if you've lived in the UK for less than 5 years and any of the following apply:
you had to stop working permanently because of an accident or illness
you retired early
you stopped working when you reached State Pension age".

Can anyone give an advice on it?

Thanks!

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contorted_svy
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by contorted_svy » Mon Oct 03, 2022 6:01 pm

If you reach State Pension age
If you’re from the EU, Switzerland, Norway, Iceland or Liechtenstein, you can get settled status if you stopped working when you reached State Pension age and either:

you worked continuously or were self employed in the UK for at least 1 year beforehand and have lived continuously in the UK, the Channel Islands or the Isle of Man for more than 3 years
your spouse or civil partner is a British citizen
Does this apply to her situation? If not, she most likely won't get settled status.
All advice comes from personal research and experience and should not be regarded as professional opinion.

Tairdoh
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by Tairdoh » Wed Oct 12, 2022 2:53 pm

contorted_svy wrote:
Mon Oct 03, 2022 6:01 pm
If you reach State Pension age
If you’re from the EU, Switzerland, Norway, Iceland or Liechtenstein, you can get settled status if you stopped working when you reached State Pension age and either:

you worked continuously or were self employed in the UK for at least 1 year beforehand and have lived continuously in the UK, the Channel Islands or the Isle of Man for more than 3 years
your spouse or civil partner is a British citizen
Does this apply to her situation? If not, she most likely won't get settled status.
Thanks for the reply. No, my mother is a NON-EU citizen and she's been on her pre-settled status since Sep 2021 but arrived in the U.K. in May 2021. She's 67 years old though.

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contorted_svy
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by contorted_svy » Wed Oct 12, 2022 4:24 pm

Tairdoh wrote:
Wed Oct 12, 2022 2:53 pm
contorted_svy wrote:
Mon Oct 03, 2022 6:01 pm
If you reach State Pension age
If you’re from the EU, Switzerland, Norway, Iceland or Liechtenstein, you can get settled status if you stopped working when you reached State Pension age and either:

you worked continuously or were self employed in the UK for at least 1 year beforehand and have lived continuously in the UK, the Channel Islands or the Isle of Man for more than 3 years
your spouse or civil partner is a British citizen
Does this apply to her situation? If not, she most likely won't get settled status.
Thanks for the reply. No, my mother is a NON-EU citizen and she's been on her pre-settled status since Sep 2021 but arrived in the U.K. in May 2021. She's 67 years old though.
I don't know if this ruling applies also to non-EEA citizens, but I am not familiar enough with this guidance to give an answer.
All advice comes from personal research and experience and should not be regarded as professional opinion.

meself2
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by meself2 » Wed Oct 12, 2022 5:05 pm

https://www.gov.uk/settled-status-eu-ci ... an-5-years
If you’re from the EU, Switzerland, Norway, Iceland or Liechtenstein, you can get settled status if you stopped working when you reached State Pension age and either:

you worked continuously or were self employed in the UK for at least 1 year beforehand and have lived continuously in the UK, the Channel Islands or the Isle of Man for more than 3 years
judging from the website, she also had to be in the country for 3+ years even if it did apply
but I'm not very familiar as well
Not a qualified immigration adviser. Use links and references given to gain confirmation and/or extra information.

JB007
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by JB007 » Wed Oct 12, 2022 5:11 pm

Tairdoh wrote:
Mon Oct 03, 2022 5:11 pm
..who has been on her Pre-Settled status since May 2021
She is 67 years old and has reached her state pension age already but not receiving a pension yet being not from the U.K.
Not will she. To be able to get a UK state pension, she would have needed 10 tax years of NICs. Paying NICs ends as soon as they reach the UK SPA: which is about 66 and a half atm.

The tax year they reach SPA does not count towards one of those 10 years either, even if they paid enough NICs that year for it to be a qualifying year towards a SP.

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contorted_svy
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by contorted_svy » Wed Oct 12, 2022 5:53 pm

I don't think OP is interested in UK pension, but in getting early settled status. However it seems this is not an option
All advice comes from personal research and experience and should not be regarded as professional opinion.

JB007
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by JB007 » Thu Oct 13, 2022 10:30 am

contorted_svy wrote:
Wed Oct 12, 2022 5:53 pm
I don't think OP is interested in UK pension, but in getting early settled status. However it seems this is not an option
I embolded the part I was replying to. The OP used the word "yet" which means "at this time" "thus far" "at a future time, eventually". Which would indicate that she expected her mother to get a UK state pension: which as I explained, she won't.

It appears the OP and her EU husband are planning to move to another EU country but are looking at ways to get her mother Settled Stauus in the UK.
eea-route-applications/eu-settled-statu ... l#p2061697

secret.simon
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by secret.simon » Thu Oct 13, 2022 9:47 pm

Tairdoh wrote:
Mon Oct 03, 2022 5:11 pm
But recently I have come across this excerpt stating that:
"If you retired or had to stop working

If you get a UK State Pension, you’ll automatically get settled status if your late application to the EU Settlement Scheme is successful.
You might get settled status if you've lived in the UK for less than 5 years and any of the following apply:
you had to stop working permanently because of an accident or illness
you retired early
you stopped working when you reached State Pension age".

Can anyone give an advice on it?

Thanks!
To start with, if posting an excerpt, a link to the source of the excerpt, so that others can read the entire text, is always much appreciated and would help us in giving more precise advice.

This Gov.UK page on the topic of applying for Settled Status early is much clearer.

That provision, of applying for Settled Status on reaching State Pension age, applies to EEA citizens who reach State Pension age and their dependents.

So, if the EEA citizen sponsor reaches State Pension age, they themselves and their non-EEA dependents can apply for Settled Status.

Non-EEA dependents don't get any advantage of being able to apply for Settled Status on reaching State Pension age themselves.

If you want to have a look at the legal text in question, it is Paragraph EU11 of Appendix EU of the UK Immigration Rules, condition 5, which starts,
(a) The applicant is (or, as the case may be, was) a family member of a relevant EEA citizen; and
(b) The relevant EEA citizen is a person who has ceased activity; and...
I am not sure where you got the excerpt from, but it is obviously oversimplified, stating the other requirements without stating that the main requirement of reaching the State Pension age applies to the EEA citizen, not the dependent.

Also see from Page 187 of the EEA Settled Status caseworker guidance how such an application is assessed.
I am not a lawyer or immigration advisor. My statements/comments do not constitute legal advice. E&OE. Please do not PM me for advice.

Tairdoh
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by Tairdoh » Thu Oct 20, 2022 8:06 pm

JB007 wrote:
Wed Oct 12, 2022 5:11 pm
Tairdoh wrote:
Mon Oct 03, 2022 5:11 pm
..who has been on her Pre-Settled status since May 2021
She is 67 years old and has reached her state pension age already but not receiving a pension yet being not from the U.K.
Not will she. To be able to get a UK state pension, she would have needed 10 tax years of NICs. Paying NICs ends as soon as they reach the UK SPA: which is about 66 and a half atm.

The tax year they reach SPA does not count towards one of those 10 years either, even if they paid enough NICs that year for it to be a qualifying year towards a SP.
Thank you for the reply.
The reason I put that reference to her age wasn't for asking whether she'd be eligible for her pension which I already know she wouldn't for the reason you have outlined in your response hence I used "state pension age " and not "eligibility ".

Tairdoh
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by Tairdoh » Thu Oct 20, 2022 8:11 pm

contorted_svy wrote:
Wed Oct 12, 2022 5:53 pm
I don't think OP is interested in UK pension, but in getting early settled status. However it seems this is not an option
Thank you, you are absolutely right.I wasn't inquiring about the pension itself.

Tairdoh
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by Tairdoh » Thu Oct 20, 2022 8:23 pm

JB007 wrote:
Thu Oct 13, 2022 10:30 am
contorted_svy wrote:
Wed Oct 12, 2022 5:53 pm
I don't think OP is interested in UK pension, but in getting early settled status. However it seems this is not an option
I embolded the part I was replying to. The OP used the word "yet" which means "at this time" "thus far" "at a future time, eventually". Which would indicate that she expected her mother to get a UK state pension: which as I explained, she won't.

It appears the OP and her EU husband are planning to move to another EU country but are looking at ways to get her mother Settled Stauus in the UK.
eea-route-applications/eu-settled-statu ... l#p2061697
Well the reason I used "yet" was that at some point in the future my mother would be able to get a pension if she lives long enough for it, especially her being 67 years of old working full time and having regular contributions towards her pension pot. So , it's not a case of a "freeloader " who is after the pension only where there's clearly no eligibility for it.
Myself and my EU/ British husband have no intention to leave the U.K. neither now nor in the future
and all I needed to know whether there was a possibility for her to get EUSS sooner than on completion of the 5 year qualifying period.

Tairdoh
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by Tairdoh » Thu Oct 20, 2022 8:33 pm

secret.simon wrote:
Thu Oct 13, 2022 9:47 pm
Tairdoh wrote:
Mon Oct 03, 2022 5:11 pm
But recently I have come across this excerpt stating that:
"If you retired or had to stop working

If you get a UK State Pension, you’ll automatically get settled status if your late application to the EU Settlement Scheme is successful.
You might get settled status if you've lived in the UK for less than 5 years and any of the following apply:
you had to stop working permanently because of an accident or illness
you retired early
you stopped working when you reached State Pension age".

Can anyone give an advice on it?

Thanks!
To start with, if posting an excerpt, a link to the source of the excerpt, so that others can read the entire text, is always much appreciated and would help us in giving more precise advice.

This Gov.UK page on the topic of applying for Settled Status early is much clearer.

That provision, of applying for Settled Status on reaching State Pension age, applies to EEA citizens who reach State Pension age and their dependents.

So, if the EEA citizen sponsor reaches State Pension age, they themselves and their non-EEA dependents can apply for Settled Status.

Non-EEA dependents don't get any advantage of being able to apply for Settled Status on reaching State Pension age themselves.

If you want to have a look at the legal text in question, it is Paragraph EU11 of Appendix EU of the UK Immigration Rules, condition 5, which starts,
(a) The applicant is (or, as the case may be, was) a family member of a relevant EEA citizen; and
(b) The relevant EEA citizen is a person who has ceased activity; and...
I am not sure where you got the excerpt from, but it is obviously oversimplified, stating the other requirements without stating that the main requirement of reaching the State Pension age applies to the EEA citizen, not the dependent.

Also see from Page 187 of the EEA Settled Status caseworker guidance how such an application is assessed.
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/immig ... om-the-eu/
This was an original post which I've used an excerpt from. It's under "If you’ve lived in the UK for less than 5 years" paragraph.
It's been said here that it would only apply to an EU National reaching their SP age but I didn't see that mentioned unless I overlooked it.

secret.simon
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by secret.simon » Fri Oct 21, 2022 12:55 am

You should contact them to clarify, and if necessary, update their webpage.

As I mentioned, I think the law is quite clear and the Gov.UK website states the correct position on that point as well.
I am not a lawyer or immigration advisor. My statements/comments do not constitute legal advice. E&OE. Please do not PM me for advice.

JB007
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by JB007 » Fri Oct 21, 2022 10:21 am

Tairdoh wrote:
Thu Oct 20, 2022 8:23 pm
Well the reason I used "yet" was that at some point in the future my mother would be able to get a pension if she lives long enough for it, especially her being 67 years of old working full time and having regular contributions towards her pension pot. So , it's not a case of a "freeloader " who is after the pension only where there's clearly no eligibility for it.
And that is why I explained she will never get a UK state pension as you seem to think she might, even if she worked for years in the UK. It was nothing to do with being a "feeloader", because UK state pensions are now contribution based; based on our own contributions. But becasue of her age, no matter how many yeras she works, she will never get a UK state pension.

The UK stopped the "freeloading" part in April 2016; when they changed UK state pensions to now being based on our own contributuions and ended the claiming a UK state pension via the NIC contributions of a spouse. I seem to recall there was quite an upset on the Thai forums, where young women will marry an old man, expecting to be given UK benefits and a UK state pension when their old partner dies.

A UK state pension is based on the NICs we pay.
Once we reach state pension age, we no longer pay NICs.
Therefore she will not even meet the 10 tax years minimum NIC contributions needed for a UK state pension as she has arrived in the UK to late (too old) for a state pension form the UK.

As also explained above, even the tax year we reach state pension age is not counted towards a UK state pension, even if we paid enough NICs duing that tax year to make it a full qualifying year for a state pension. A qualifying year is havng paid enough money via NICs that tax year.
e.g
you arrive in the UK your late 50s and work and then pay NICs for 10 tax years when you reach state pension age (which is part way though a tax year). You have 10 Qualifying years according to HMRC, but legislation states the year you reached State Pension age is not counted. Legislation state you cannot have the year you reached state pension as a QY. Therefore the DWP Pension Service correctly states you have 9 Q years for a UK state pension and have not reached the minimum of 10 years requuired for a part state pension. Therfore no entitlement to a state pension.

What she will get is an employers pension for all the years she works and she is allowed to use her earnings towards another private pension. The UK gvenment wil contribute to both of those private pensions. She can also use ISAs to save for when she no longer wants to work, which are not taxed. Some people use staock and shares ISAs too and max out their allowed contributions each year.

JB007
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by JB007 » Fri Oct 21, 2022 10:51 am

If you and you EU husband are still planning to move to another country (from you March 2022 thread)-

"Will a person who is on pre-settled status be able to apply for a settled status if a sponsoring EU National has left the U.K.?"
eea-route-applications/eu-settled-statu ... l#p2061697

As your mother is working, you could look at the requirements to receive a state pension from the country you are moving to. If the country has an insurance based healthcare system, she will get that insurance through her employer.

Tairdoh
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Re: Early EUSS application due to the retirement

Post by Tairdoh » Tue Oct 25, 2022 6:18 pm

JB007 wrote:
Fri Oct 21, 2022 10:21 am
Tairdoh wrote:
Thu Oct 20, 2022 8:23 pm
Well the reason I used "yet" was that at some point in the future my mother would be able to get a pension if she lives long enough for it, especially her being 67 years of old working full time and having regular contributions towards her pension pot. So , it's not a case of a "freeloader " who is after the pension only where there's clearly no eligibility for it.
And that is why I explained she will never get a UK state pension as you seem to think she might, even if she worked for years in the UK. It was nothing to do with being a "feeloader", because UK state pensions are now contribution based; based on our own contributions. But becasue of her age, no matter how many yeras she works, she will never get a UK state pension.

The UK stopped the "freeloading" part in April 2016; when they changed UK state pensions to now being based on our own contributuions and ended the claiming a UK state pension via the NIC contributions of a spouse. I seem to recall there was quite an upset on the Thai forums, where young women will marry an old man, expecting to be given UK benefits and a UK state pension when their old partner dies.

A UK state pension is based on the NICs we pay.
Once we reach state pension age, we no longer pay NICs.
Therefore she will not even meet the 10 tax years minimum NIC contributions needed for a UK state pension as she has arrived in the UK to late (too old) for a state pension form the UK.

As also explained above, even the tax year we reach state pension age is not counted towards a UK state pension, even if we paid enough NICs duing that tax year to make it a full qualifying year for a state pension. A qualifying year is havng paid enough money via NICs that tax year.
e.g
you arrive in the UK your late 50s and work and then pay NICs for 10 tax years when you reach state pension age (which is part way though a tax year). You have 10 Qualifying years according to HMRC, but legislation states the year you reached State Pension age is not counted. Legislation state you cannot have the year you reached state pension as a QY. Therefore the DWP Pension Service correctly states you have 9 Q years for a UK state pension and have not reached the minimum of 10 years requuired for a part state pension. Therfore no entitlement to a state pension.

What she will get is an employers pension for all the years she works and she is allowed to use her earnings towards another private pension. The UK gvenment wil contribute to both of those private pensions. She can also use ISAs to save for when she no longer wants to work, which are not taxed. Some people use staock and shares ISAs too and max out their allowed contributions each year.
Thank you for such comprehensive response on the topic. But as I already said the main question was based mainly on the early EUSS eligibility and NOT on receiving state pension.
Regarding my old post, we are no longer planning to move from the U.K.

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