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Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Use this section for queries concerning applications on any of the EEA series of forms, and also for applications for EEA Family Permits.

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iuliacrisp
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Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by iuliacrisp » Sat Sep 06, 2014 6:15 pm

Hello, I am new to to this forum and not sure if this has been discussed previously, if so, please direct me to the thread.

I'm in search of the best solution for our situation, any advice is highly appreciated: I'm EEA member (Romanian), husband non- EEA with resident card for family members (worded exactly "resident permit for member of Romanian citizen"). We want to travel together to Northern Ireland and settle there,with our two sons, both born in RO. We had every intention of applying for EEA FP for my husband, but once arrived at the visa application center he was told that there are big delays and it would take longer than expected, resulting in us missing our flights and complicate our arrangements in NI. In addition, the guy in charge of sending our documents to the center in Warsaw (not Bucharest as I was expecting) said that it would have been preferable to attach some bank statements to the application and after telling him this was not required by law, his answer was: "I know but... I'm speaking from the experience of the refusals I heard of .." Anyway, we decided not to apply at all for the EEA permit, since the answer would of taken too long to come. Our intention was to (courageously) try entering UK under the free movement directive, only showing marriage certificate and resident card.
However, our flight is to Dublin and we want to take the bus to Belfast, I understand that there is no border control between the two, right? In this case, my husband would only get stamped from the Irish authorities and if so, what are his chances of applying for a resident card in Northern Ireland? I know that I have to prove I'm a qualified person (after the initial 3 months right of residence). Would this be enough for him to have a successful EEA 2 application? The situation is even more complicated though: I am currently on maternity leave and I receive funds form the Romanian State (and continue to until I apply for benefit in another country). What is my best option to prove I'm qualified person - self-sufficient maybe?

Apologizes for the long message, really grateful for your time and any input. Thank you!

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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by Obie » Sat Sep 06, 2014 6:30 pm

That is fine, you will have no issue, it is perfectly legal means.

However you will need to be a qualified person for a Residence Card to be issued.
Seasons greetings to everyone and a prosperous 2020

iuliacrisp
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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by iuliacrisp » Sat Sep 06, 2014 6:55 pm

Is it advisable to reveal the intention of arriving to NI in case we are asked at the Irish border or the airline desk? I'm afraid they will ask for the EEA FP.
About the 'qualified' status of the EEA member in UK: in attempting to prove self-sufficiency, not clear how the bank statement should look like - a big amount of money sufficient for how long?? It seems so relative... Would the proof of maternity allowance from RO (in addition to other funds in the account) help the purpose or not? - if necessary, I can open another thread about this.
Thanks

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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by Obie » Sat Sep 06, 2014 6:59 pm

You won't see a border guard on the Northern Ireland or Ireland border, but if you do, you can present yourself as an EEA national who has the right to be accompanied by her spouse.
Seasons greetings to everyone and a prosperous 2020

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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by iuliacrisp » Sat Sep 06, 2014 7:55 pm

Obie wrote:You won't see a border guard on the Northern Ireland or Ireland border, but if you do, you can present yourself as an EEA national who has the right to be accompanied by her spouse.

Isn't there a ROI passport control when you leave the Dublin airport? I thought they might ask. Thanks for the suggestion.

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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by Obie » Sat Sep 06, 2014 8:05 pm

I have never heard of one
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el patron
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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by el patron » Tue Sep 09, 2014 9:23 am

Obie wrote:I have never heard of one
From memory everyone goes through passport control at Dublin airport upon arrival, even those from CTA (though presumably presentation of passports is not obligatory in such cases)

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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by Obie » Tue Sep 09, 2014 9:44 am

This person is asking about when you leave Dublin Airport.

I am of the view that she is talking about Dublin Airport to Northern Ireland via a land border.

According to my understanding OP is travelling to Dublin en route to Northern Ireland.
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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by Wanderer » Tue Sep 09, 2014 10:09 am

el patron wrote:
Obie wrote:I have never heard of one
From memory everyone goes through passport control at Dublin airport upon arrival, even those from CTA (though presumably presentation of passports is not obligatory in such cases)
I flew Leeds - Dublin for a year every week and had to present passport at Dublin every time, though not always (but mostly) the other way.

There's just two queues, EEA and non_EEA...
An chéad stad eile Stáisiún Uí Chonghaile....

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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by el patron » Tue Sep 09, 2014 12:15 pm

Obie wrote:This person is asking about when you leave Dublin Airport.

I am of the view that she is talking about Dublin Airport to Northern Ireland via a land border.

According to my understanding OP is travelling to Dublin en route to Northern Ireland.
You are quite correct Obie on the literal meaning. I believe I was looking to what was perhaps intended!

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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by iuliacrisp » Tue Sep 09, 2014 2:30 pm

I'm sorry, I might have not been clear enough: I was referring to the moment when we'll land in Dublin Airport and we'll have to show documents. Once out of airport we will, indeed, go to take a bus to Belfast, but I understand that there is no land border control. My worry is about my non -EEA husband lack of EEA FP for UK and whether he will be asked to present one after revealing our final destination to the ROI airport authorities (maybe there is no need to do that?).

Also, regarding my second paragraph (EEA2), is there anywhere else on this forum that I could ask the question?

Thank you all for your time.

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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by ruthie » Tue Sep 09, 2014 6:54 pm

iuliacrisp wrote:I'm sorry, I might have not been clear enough: I was referring to the moment when we'll land in Dublin Airport and we'll have to show documents. Once out of airport we will, indeed, go to take a bus to Belfast, but I understand that there is no land border control. My worry is about my non -EEA husband lack of EEA FP for UK and whether he will be asked to present one after revealing our final destination to the ROI airport authorities (maybe there is no need to do that?).

Also, regarding my second paragraph (EEA2), is there anywhere else on this forum that I could ask the question?

Thank you all for your time.
I think you might have three choices.

1.Apply for an EEA family permit which may or may not get refused.
2.Avoid telling them your final destination, just say you want to stay in Dublin for a short visit, which is true.
3.Prepare for couple of hours of explanation in the worst case scenario if they challenge your lacking of visa to enter UK, but they have to let you in eventually as your travelling to UK is perfectly legal.

If I were you I would choose 2, if doesn't work, then 3. I don't think they will ask questions like 'Where do you want to go after leaving Ireland?', The most probable question is 'How long do you plan to stay?' or 'What do you plan to do in Ireland?'.
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iuliacrisp
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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by iuliacrisp » Tue Sep 09, 2014 8:48 pm

ruthie wrote:
iuliacrisp wrote:I'm sorry, I might have not been clear enough: I was referring to the moment when we'll land in Dublin Airport and we'll have to show documents. Once out of airport we will, indeed, go to take a bus to Belfast, but I understand that there is no land border control. My worry is about my non -EEA husband lack of EEA FP for UK and whether he will be asked to present one after revealing our final destination to the ROI airport authorities (maybe there is no need to do that?).

Also, regarding my second paragraph (EEA2), is there anywhere else on this forum that I could ask the question?

Thank you all for your time.
I think you might have three choices.

1.Apply for an EEA family permit which may or may not get refused.
2.Avoid telling them your final destination, just say you want to stay in Dublin for a short visit, which is true.
3.Prepare for couple of hours of explanation in the worst case scenario if they challenge your lacking of visa to enter UK, but they have to let you in eventually as your travelling to UK is perfectly legal.

If I were you I would choose 2, if doesn't work, then 3. I don't think they will ask questions like 'Where do you want to go after leaving Ireland?', The most probable question is 'How long do you plan to stay?' or 'What do you plan to do in Ireland?'.
Thank you! I would go for the same choice. There is no time left to apply for EEA FP (that was the problem primarily). Hopefully they won't ask for return tickets or anything. This would not comply with the law, righ?

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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by Wanderer » Tue Sep 09, 2014 11:43 pm

iuliacrisp wrote:
ruthie wrote:
iuliacrisp wrote:I'm sorry, I might have not been clear enough: I was referring to the moment when we'll land in Dublin Airport and we'll have to show documents. Once out of airport we will, indeed, go to take a bus to Belfast, but I understand that there is no land border control. My worry is about my non -EEA husband lack of EEA FP for UK and whether he will be asked to present one after revealing our final destination to the ROI airport authorities (maybe there is no need to do that?).

Also, regarding my second paragraph (EEA2), is there anywhere else on this forum that I could ask the question?

Thank you all for your time.
I think you might have three choices.

1.Apply for an EEA family permit which may or may not get refused.
2.Avoid telling them your final destination, just say you want to stay in Dublin for a short visit, which is true.
3.Prepare for couple of hours of explanation in the worst case scenario if they challenge your lacking of visa to enter UK, but they have to let you in eventually as your travelling to UK is perfectly legal.

If I were you I would choose 2, if doesn't work, then 3. I don't think they will ask questions like 'Where do you want to go after leaving Ireland?', The most probable question is 'How long do you plan to stay?' or 'What do you plan to do in Ireland?'.
Thank you! I would go for the same choice. There is no time left to apply for EEA FP (that was the problem primarily). Hopefully they won't ask for return tickets or anything. This would not comply with the law, righ?
I can say for sure because I've done it there is full passport control at Dublin Airport for everyone. However, if you take the ferry from Holyhead (or other UK port to Eire) there is no passport control at all. There are periodic searches, I was picked once but no documentation was asked for, so as long as you don't panic there is no issue.

The CTA is a sort of Schengen, and been around a bit longer. It works well despite our differences. I'm Irish and British BTW.
An chéad stad eile Stáisiún Uí Chonghaile....

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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by Obie » Tue Sep 09, 2014 11:49 pm

This person is not concerned with Dublin Passport check.

Her spouse has a residence CArd issued under EU law, so he can enter Dublin without a Visa.

Her question is focused on how to enter Northern Ireland once she is in Dublin.

That is how it appears to me.
Seasons greetings to everyone and a prosperous 2020

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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by mgb » Wed Sep 10, 2014 1:03 am

There is no border post between NI and the republic. If there is a rarely temporary check point at the NI side they simply present the marriage certificate and ask for a stamp code 1A.
It looks like the op has fear about the procedure at the Dublin airport. The officers at the passport control in Dublin are checking if a person has the right to enter the republic of ireland and not more.

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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by iuliacrisp » Thu Sep 11, 2014 3:21 pm

Obie wrote:This person is not concerned with Dublin Passport check.

Her spouse has a residence CArd issued under EU law, so he can enter Dublin without a Visa.

Her question is focused on how to enter Northern Ireland once she is in Dublin.

That is how it appears to me.
Yes, that is what I am concerned about. Thank you.

iuliacrisp
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Re: Going to Northern Ireland through Dublin no EEA FP

Post by iuliacrisp » Thu Sep 11, 2014 3:22 pm

mgb wrote:There is no border post between NI and the republic. If there is a rarely temporary check point at the NI side they simply present the marriage certificate and ask for a stamp code 1A.
It looks like the op has fear about the procedure at the Dublin airport. The officers at the passport control in Dublin are checking if a person has the right to enter the republic of ireland and not more.
Clear enough. Thank you!

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