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Marriage certificate

Use this section for queries concerning applications on any of the EEA series of forms, and also for applications for EEA Family Permits.

Moderators: Casa, JAJ, ca.funke, Amber, Zimba, vinny, Obie, EUsmileWEallsmile, batleykhan, geriatrix, John, ChetanOjha, archigabe, push

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Cocoa
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Location: London
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Marriage certificate

Post by Cocoa » Tue Aug 23, 2011 8:14 pm

Hi, hope someone can help

I got married to a dual EEA National (Irish-British) outside Europe. He was born in Dublin, Ireland but the entered the country with a British passport, which of course says he was born in 'Dublin'.

In the registry office they recorded his place of birth as 'Dublin, United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland' instead of just 'Dublin' or 'Dublin, Ireland'. I pointed out before the marriage ceremony that his place of birth was technically wrong but they told me they had to use the country name from the passport he used to enter the country.

We will use the EEA-route (his Irish Passport) so I can move back with him to the UK but I don't know if this inconsistency in the marriage certificate will be a problem of if I should get a letter from the registry office to clarify why his place of birth was recorded as it was.

Many thanks!

nonspecifics
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HMMM

Post by nonspecifics » Tue Aug 23, 2011 8:39 pm

I don't think that is relevant. You can be a British Citizen even though you were born in another country. The UK know Dublin is Ireland.

What is more important is that he has dual Irish / British citizenship.

If he is also a British citizen who has dual Irish nationality, UKBA may say he comes under the McCarthy legal ruling.

In other words, the way EU law looks at it is that he may not be exercising Treaty Rights when he comes to the UK; he is a British citizen ( who also happens to have Irish citizenship) returning to Britain, so the EU Directive does not apply - unless he was exercising Treaty Rights by working ( as an example) in another EEA country before returning to the UK.

Cocoa
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Joined: Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:11 pm
Location: London
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Post by Cocoa » Wed Aug 24, 2011 7:16 pm

Many thanks and another question:

What if my husband has a EEA Registration Certificate to show he has been exercising treaty rights as an Irish citizen in the UK, would it be ok to take the EU Directive if we have this document?

Forgot to mention that my husband is already back in the UK, where he works as a self employed person.
Last edited by Cocoa on Wed Aug 24, 2011 7:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Directive/2004/38/EC
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Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 9:09 am
Location: does not matter if you are with your EEA family member

Re: HMMM

Post by Directive/2004/38/EC » Thu Aug 25, 2011 12:48 am

nonspecifics wrote:If he is also a British citizen who has dual Irish nationality, UKBA may say he comes under the McCarthy legal ruling.

In other words, the way EU law looks at it is that he may not be exercising Treaty Rights when he comes to the UK; he is a British citizen ( who also happens to have Irish citizenship) returning to Britain, so the EU Directive does not apply - unless he was exercising Treaty Rights by working ( as an example) in another EEA country before returning to the UK.
This is incorrect. Better to understand McCarthy before saying things like this.

McCarthy was special because although she was Irish, she had never left the UK, was not working in the UK, and up until shortly before the EU law application had not had an Irish passport.

In this case there is a person who was born in Dublin and has had a Irish passport and (likely) has been working in the UK.

It will be no problem for him to "be Irish" the the purposes of this application.

Kitty
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Re: Marriage certificate

Post by Kitty » Thu Aug 25, 2011 10:40 am

Cocoa wrote:In the registry office they recorded his place of birth as 'Dublin, United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland' instead of just 'Dublin' or 'Dublin, Ireland'. I pointed out before the marriage ceremony that his place of birth was technically wrong but they told me they had to use the country name from the passport he used to enter the country.
Not to mention how politically and historically unsound it is to place Dublin in the UK :shock: , how would this policy of using the passport naitonality work for other British citizens born abroad? Does the registry office also end up recording people as being born in "Lahore, UK" or "Kalamazoo, UK"? :lol:

Cocoa
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Location: London
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Post by Cocoa » Thu Aug 25, 2011 7:29 pm

Although my husband lived in Dublin till his early 20's he doesn't remember having an Irish passport so he recently applied for one. If he never had an Irish passport before, would that be an issue for our application? In any case, he already applied for his Irish passport and he is looking into getting a Registration Certificate from the UK. Is it ok if we apply with these documents?

nonspecifics
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McCarthy or Not

Post by nonspecifics » Thu Aug 25, 2011 8:08 pm

@Directive

I welcome corrections when I make mistakes. I am sure your explanation of McCarthy has also been helpful to others too. Keep up the good work.

Another mistake I - and others make - is making assumptions about a case, where there is a lack of detail, instead of asking for more information to give a more considered answer.

At least I stimulated the flow of information to try and help the OP get info from those who know what they are talking about. :D

joshuaaubin
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Post by joshuaaubin » Thu Aug 25, 2011 8:47 pm

You dont need to hold a passport to show your citizenship, many in this country and others that does not hold a passport dont make them not to be a citizen of that country, sometime passport is just for a legal process.
He dont need to hold an irish passport to be called an irish, he was born an irish, he did not aquire it from the parent or others, he was an irish by birth.
This so call law make many get the passport because of there non eea partner as it is one of the requirement. one of my wife family from ireland who is around 54yrs have never ever hold a passport in her life and never left the country, will they say she is not an irish?
This is a case i read in N Ireland, the judge said he dont need to hold an irish passport to be call an irish, he was born an irish, unlike mccarthy, she has to get a passport to show that she is an irish because she was born in england.
http://www.bailii.org/uk/cases/UKUT/IAC ... anada.html

Cocoa
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Location: London
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Post by Cocoa » Thu Aug 25, 2011 9:07 pm

Thanks to everyone you've been very helpful !

Cocoa
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Post by Cocoa » Fri Oct 28, 2011 3:16 pm

Hello, I just got my EEA Family Permit, many thanks for all your help!

I will fly to the UK in November but I'm not sure if once at Passport Control I have to queue in the 'European Passport' line or in the 'Other Passports' line (I am Mexican). As far as I am concerned I don't have to fill in a landing card and my passport shouldn't be stamped because I will be holding a EEA Family Permit, is this right?

Directive/2004/38/EC
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Location: does not matter if you are with your EEA family member

Post by Directive/2004/38/EC » Fri Oct 28, 2011 3:23 pm

Cocoa wrote:Hello, I just got my EEA Family Permit, many thanks for all your help!

I will fly to the UK in November but I'm not sure if once at Passport Control I have to queue in the 'European Passport' line or in the 'Other Passports' line (I am Mexican). As far as I am concerned I don't have to fill in a landing card and my passport shouldn't be stamped because I will be holding a EEA Family Permit, is this right?
How long did it take to get your EEA FP?

Your passport should never be stamped once you have a Residence Card. They can legally stamp it if you have an EEA FP.

I believe you should technically be able to use the EU passports line. What the line should say is "People traveling on the basis of EU free movement law". I personally would take whichever line is shorter. If they have a problem with you in the EU line, then they will politely ask you to go to the other line.

Enjoy the UK. Be aware that you are arriving when it tends to be cold and dark and windy. It can be quite a shock to arrive at that time of year. Expect it and you will not be so surprised. There is all sorts of wonderful stuff in London. Just keep warm, keep happy, and look forward to the lovely spring that will eventually arrive!

Cocoa
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Location: London
Mexico

Post by Cocoa » Fri Oct 28, 2011 7:11 pm

Many thanks for your message. It was quite quick, my permit was ready in 9 working days.

I look forward to London and joining my husband!

EUsmileWEallsmile
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Post by EUsmileWEallsmile » Fri Oct 28, 2011 9:47 pm

I'm delighted to hear of your success. EEA family permits are issued in other parts of the world in three to four weeks. You did well.

I also wonder about timeline for Irish passport renewal abroad. I know of one individual who applied in August 2010, but got return October 2010. Again you did well.

Best of luck.

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