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settlement visa via Surinder Singh route

Use this section for queries concerning applications on any of the EEA series of forms, and also for applications for EEA Family Permits.

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s1dhart
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Posts: 13
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2012 8:42 pm

Post by s1dhart » Wed Aug 15, 2012 9:33 pm

Thanks for the detailed response Ben, Directive/2004/38/EC

I came across this pdf while going through the europa.eu -
http://ec.europa.eu/justice/citizen/fil ... _ec_en.pdf
On pg 7 in section - "Rules for your family members" it states -
Your family members, who are Union citizens themselves, are
covered by the very same rules.
Those family members who are not nationals of a Member State
(so-called third country family members) may enter the host Member State with a valid passport. If they come from certain countries which are subject to visa obligation, they may be required to have an entry visa. Countries whose nationals are subject to visa are listed in Regulation (EC) No 539/2001, or under national law in the case of the United Kingdom and Ireland.
India comes under the third countries whose national requires Visa under national law in the case of the United Kingdom and Ireland.
Does it mean my parents do need a entry visa prior to reaching the port ?

I am struggling to decide on whether to -
- go via NI into Ireland
- or take a flight and request a free movement visa on port
- or apply for via embassy in advance before travel.

All Suggestion will be welcomed and hugely appreciated :)

Ben
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Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2007 3:33 pm
Location: Elsewhere
Contact:

Post by Ben » Wed Aug 15, 2012 11:03 pm

Taking a flight from the UK to Ireland without an entry visa would be problematic in terms of logistics - staff working at check-in on behalf of the airline are likely to (unlawfully) refuse travel.

Applying for an EUTR visa at the Irish embassy in London in advance of flying / sailing to Ireland from Britain is fine, but be prepared for staff at the embassy to make your lives difficult and probably refuse the visa applications initially, later issuing them on appeal and following further documentation / letters / headache from you.

Sailing or flying to Northern Ireland from Britain and entering Ireland over land eliminates the stress of entry visa applications mentioned above and, whilst perhaps not the most direct or convenient route, is likely the most stress-free option whilst still being entirely lawful - providing you and your parents are all in possession of your passport and that they have sufficient evidence to prove that they are your parents and that they are dependant on you.
I am no longer posting publicly on this website - PM me if needed.

Directive/2004/38/EC
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Posts: 7121
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 9:09 am
Location: does not matter if you are with your EEA family member

Post by Directive/2004/38/EC » Wed Aug 15, 2012 11:25 pm

Ben wrote:Taking a flight from the UK to Ireland without an entry visa would be problematic in terms of logistics - staff working at check-in on behalf of the airline are likely to (unlawfully) refuse travel.
You would also have to deal with border guards at Dublin airport. When we entered without a visa (husband/wife), they seemed a little foggy on their obligations. I suspect they would be more foggy in this case.
Ben wrote:Applying for an EUTR visa at the Irish embassy in London in advance of flying / sailing to Ireland from Britain is fine, but be prepared for staff at the embassy to make your lives difficult and probably refuse the visa applications initially, later issuing them on appeal and following further documentation / letters / headache from you.
I also suspect they might refuse the application at first. Or even not accept the application. It would then take 2-4 months to appeal.

The plus side of doing this, is at the end of the process you will have a "certificate"/visa which certifies that your parents are travelling on the basis of EU law. So you have already gone through this step.
Ben wrote:Sailing or flying to Northern Ireland from Britain and entering Ireland over land eliminates the stress of entry visa applications mentioned above and, whilst perhaps not the most direct or convenient route, is likely the most stress-free option whilst still being entirely lawful - providing you and your parents are all in possession of your passport and that they have sufficient evidence to prove that they are your parents and that they are dependant on you.
Agreed. Note that the MRAX case has a number of different aspects, several of which are relevant for this situation. The no-visa entry aspect we have talked about. The other aspect is a reconfirmation that you do not need to have an otherwise required visa to apply for a RC. So you have a very clear answer if anyone says "You are not allowed to apply for a RC since you did not have a visa to enter Ireland". See http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/Lex ... 59:EN:HTML


My original suggestion was to get a visa, since I assumed your parents were happily living away in their home country. That way you can go through the fight while everyone is living at home. If they are already mobile, then that would change the way that I would make my decision in a similar situation.

Note also that the RC application has to be decided within 6 months, and I suspect it will be approved smoothly. I would urge you to immediately start working in Ireland, at least part time. It helps also in settling into a new place.

Note also that a RC is NOT a prerequisite to moving back to the UK. You having worked in Ireland is however. I personally would work for at least 3 months, though there are no hard and fast rules. You may also find Ireland an amazing place to live, which it is, and want to stay a lot longer.

star001
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Posts: 6
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2012 9:05 pm

Post by star001 » Sat Sep 01, 2012 9:12 pm

hello ,
please help me out,i am British national currently working is Spain from last 1 year and my mother is with me as a non eea family member of eu national, she currently have 5 year resident card from Spain,i am planing to go back to uk ,will surrinder singh case is going to be helpful for me?

ruthie
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Posts: 96
Joined: Fri Apr 14, 2006 3:18 am

Post by ruthie » Sun Sep 02, 2012 7:49 am

s1dhart wrote: India comes under the third countries whose national requires Visa under national law in the case of the United Kingdom and Ireland.
Does it mean my parents do need a entry visa prior to reaching the port ?

I am struggling to decide on whether to -
- go via NI into Ireland
- or take a flight and request a free movement visa on port
- or apply for via embassy in advance before travel.

All Suggestion will be welcomed and hugely appreciated :)
Isn't the recent Visa Waiver Program of ROI applied on Indian nationals as well?

yaz
Newly Registered
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2012 7:48 pm

Post by yaz » Fri Sep 14, 2012 10:14 pm

s1dhart wrote:Thanks for the detailed response Ben, Directive/2004/38/EC

I came across this pdf while going through the europa.eu -
http://ec.europa.eu/justice/citizen/fil ... _ec_en.pdf
On pg 7 in section - "Rules for your family members" it states -
Your family members, who are Union citizens themselves, are
covered by the very same rules.
Those family members who are not nationals of a Member State
(so-called third country family members) may enter the host Member State with a valid passport. If they come from certain countries which are subject to visa obligation, they may be required to have an entry visa. Countries whose nationals are subject to visa are listed in Regulation (EC) No 539/2001, or under national law in the case of the United Kingdom and Ireland.
India comes under the third countries whose national requires Visa under national law in the case of the United Kingdom and Ireland.
Does it mean my parents do need a entry visa prior to reaching the port ?

I am struggling to decide on whether to -
- go via NI into Ireland
- or take a flight and request a free movement visa on port
- or apply for via embassy in advance before travel.

All Suggestion will be welcomed and hugely appreciated :)
s1dhart, did you manage to get anything organised so far? what sort of visa did your parents get in order to enter Ireland?

mongle
Newly Registered
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:14 pm

Re:

Post by mongle » Sun Sep 06, 2015 1:38 pm

Ben wrote:Taking a flight from the UK to Ireland without an entry visa would be problematic in terms of logistics - staff working at check-in on behalf of the airline are likely to (unlawfully) refuse travel.

Applying for an EUTR visa at the Irish embassy in London in advance of flying / sailing to Ireland from Britain is fine, but be prepared for staff at the embassy to make your lives difficult and probably refuse the visa applications initially, later issuing them on appeal and following further documentation / letters / headache from you.

Sailing or flying to Northern Ireland from Britain and entering Ireland over land eliminates the stress of entry visa applications mentioned above and, whilst perhaps not the most direct or convenient route, is likely the most stress-free option whilst still being entirely lawful - providing you and your parents are all in possession of your passport and that they have sufficient evidence to prove that they are your parents and that they are dependant on you.
I am British and i have secured a job starting October in Dublin. My dependent parents are currently with me in the UK and they can stay here on the UK visa for 2 more months. I intend to travel to Dublin via Belfast as per third option provided by Ben though the UK visa is valid as per Irish visa waiver program. However, how do we get the stamp on entry if there is no one at the border? Can we go the Garda the next day and get the 90 day stamp showing identity and dependency proofs? Or do i just apply for the RC in a weeks' time and provide payslips, etc later?

would be great to get any feedback or advice

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