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kindley
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Post by kindley » Wed Jan 06, 2010 9:48 am

meats wrote:
gotcha wrote:
republique wrote:No, it doesn't work the other way around because my comment makes sense in the context of the economic crises. You came up with 1:10 ratio like it was some kind of fact so I say prove it. All I said, it is likely the reverse because of the economic crises, which mean probability. My statement for sure is still more likely than yours.
Can you prove your fact? It's your opinion, so does I stick to my opinion. And as I said earlier, OP was not asking about job market, the way he/she was answered is really annoying. People seating here in good or bad job preaching about job market to hopefull.
How can there be 10 success stories for every failure when unemployment is at a record high AND STILL RISING!!??!? Even a bloody dingbat would see that you're so wrong that it's funny. You're not actually Gordon Brown are you? Only he would come up with something as stupid as you are gotcha.
@meats, I would suggest you still go immigration adivice rather than your preposterous and distortional political comments to say the least.

You seem to be the campaign arm of the Tory party on here. When you say unemployement "is at a record high AND STILL RISING", perhaps you should tell us that David cameron wouldn't have done anything bec he wanted the recession to take it course.

Yeah unemployment is rising but you didn't tell us what figures- (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8353933.stm) from the ONS revealed recently that rise in unemployment as actually slowed. Perhaps you should tell us if not for the action taken by Gordon Brown whom I'm actually not a big fan of, unemployment didn't reach 3 million by December as predicted by many analysis?

Perhaps you should also tell us what happened in the last recession under the Tory govt where people were left to fend for themselves.
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kindley
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Post by kindley » Wed Jan 06, 2010 9:52 am

meats wrote:
gotcha wrote:
republique wrote:No, it doesn't work the other way around because my comment makes sense in the context of the economic crises. You came up with 1:10 ratio like it was some kind of fact so I say prove it. All I said, it is likely the reverse because of the economic crises, which mean probability. My statement for sure is still more likely than yours.
Can you prove your fact? It's your opinion, so does I stick to my opinion. And as I said earlier, OP was not asking about job market, the way he/she was answered is really annoying. People seating here in good or bad job preaching about job market to hopefull.
How can there be 10 success stories for every failure when unemployment is at a record high AND STILL RISING!!??!? Even a bloody dingbat would see that you're so wrong that it's funny. You're not actually Gordon Brown are you? Only he would come up with something as stupid as you are gotcha.
@meats, I would suggest you still go immigration adivice rather than your preposterous and distortional political comments to say the least.

You seem to be the campaign arm of the Tory party on here. When you say unemployement "is at a record high AND STILL RISING", perhaps you should tell us that David cameron wouldn't have done anything bec he wanted the recession to take it course.

Yeah unemployment is rising but you didn't tell us what figures- (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8353933.stm) from the ONS revealed recently that rise in unemployment as actually slowed. Perhaps you should tell us if not for the action taken by Gordon Brown whom I'm actually not a big fan of, unemployment didn't reach 3 million by December as predicted by many analysis?

Perhaps you should also tell us what happened in the last recession under the Tory govt where people were left to fend for themselves.
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Post by gotcha » Wed Jan 06, 2010 10:01 am

meats wrote: How can there be 10 success stories for every failure when unemployment is at a record high AND STILL RISING!!??!? Even a bloody dingbat would see that you're so wrong that it's funny. You're not actually Gordon Brown are you? Only he would come up with something as stupid as you are gotcha.

Somebody will accuse on personel level, when he has nothing to argue about. It looks like, you want to reduce competion in UK market by discouraging people to come here.

What the hell you are doing here then ?

I jumped in to this thread, because, somebody has replied to OP in a way uncalled for, and other people started preaching about job market. In fact, OP has asked for nothing of it. He just shared about his plan to arrive in UK.

This is my last post on this thread. You go on with your knowledge and facts.

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Post by republique » Wed Jan 06, 2010 1:32 pm

gotcha wrote:
republique wrote:No, it doesn't work the other way around because my comment makes sense in the context of the economic crises. You came up with 1:10 ratio like it was some kind of fact so I say prove it. All I said, it is likely the reverse because of the economic crises, which mean probability. My statement for sure is still more likely than yours.
Can you prove your fact? It's your opinion, so does I stick to my opinion. And as I said earlier, OP was not asking about job market, the way he/she was answered is really annoying. People seating here in good or bad job preaching about job market to hopefull.
You are repeating what I said to you.
I already told you it isn't fact. It is common sense in the light of the economic crisis. YOU provided some 10 to 1 stat like it is a fact so you prove it.
Clearly you don't understand when someone says, it is likely the reverse means probability not fact and again my statement is more likely true that yours. That's deduction. So all analytical methods still support my reasoning. Try to come up with your own contrary arguments instead repeating mine.

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Post by meats » Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:02 pm

kindley wrote:
meats wrote:
gotcha wrote:
republique wrote:No, it doesn't work the other way around because my comment makes sense in the context of the economic crises. You came up with 1:10 ratio like it was some kind of fact so I say prove it. All I said, it is likely the reverse because of the economic crises, which mean probability. My statement for sure is still more likely than yours.
Can you prove your fact? It's your opinion, so does I stick to my opinion. And as I said earlier, OP was not asking about job market, the way he/she was answered is really annoying. People seating here in good or bad job preaching about job market to hopefull.
How can there be 10 success stories for every failure when unemployment is at a record high AND STILL RISING!!??!? Even a bloody dingbat would see that you're so wrong that it's funny. You're not actually Gordon Brown are you? Only he would come up with something as stupid as you are gotcha.
@meats, I would suggest you still go immigration adivice rather than your preposterous and distortional political comments to say the least.

You seem to be the campaign arm of the Tory party on here. When you say unemployement "is at a record high AND STILL RISING", perhaps you should tell us that David cameron wouldn't have done anything bec he wanted the recession to take it course.

Yeah unemployment is rising but you didn't tell us what figures- (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8353933.stm) from the ONS revealed recently that rise in unemployment as actually slowed. Perhaps you should tell us if not for the action taken by Gordon Brown whom I'm actually not a big fan of, unemployment didn't reach 3 million by December as predicted by many analysis?

Perhaps you should also tell us what happened in the last recession under the Tory govt where people were left to fend for themselves.
kindley, i suggest that you have a look at the unemployment figures, both the 'official' ones and the more realistic ones being quoted by the majority of the press in this country.

As the link you posted just proved, unemployed is STILL INCREASING!

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Post by meats » Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:13 pm

gotcha wrote:
meats wrote: How can there be 10 success stories for every failure when unemployment is at a record high AND STILL RISING!!??!? Even a bloody dingbat would see that you're so wrong that it's funny. You're not actually Gordon Brown are you? Only he would come up with something as stupid as you are gotcha.

Somebody will accuse on personel level, when he has nothing to argue about. It looks like, you want to reduce competion in UK market by discouraging people to come here.

What the hell you are doing here then ?

I jumped in to this thread, because, somebody has replied to OP in a way uncalled for, and other people started preaching about job market. In fact, OP has asked for nothing of it. He just shared about his plan to arrive in UK.

This is my last post on this thread. You go on with your knowledge and facts.
What am i doing here? I was born here, just like my parents, and their parents and their parents etc. What are you doing here?

The fact that you seem to think that there are 10 success for every failure just goes to show how deluded you are about the current job market in the UK. Have you not heard or read about 500 applications for just 1 or 2 jobs or has that conveniently slipped your mind?

kindley
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Post by kindley » Wed Jan 06, 2010 6:53 pm

meats wrote:
kindley wrote:
meats wrote:
gotcha wrote:
Can you prove your fact? It's your opinion, so does I stick to my opinion. And as I said earlier, OP was not asking about job market, the way he/she was answered is really annoying. People seating here in good or bad job preaching about job market to hopefull.
How can there be 10 success stories for every failure when unemployment is at a record high AND STILL RISING!!??!? Even a bloody dingbat would see that you're so wrong that it's funny. You're not actually Gordon Brown are you? Only he would come up with something as stupid as you are gotcha.
@meats, I would suggest you still go immigration adivice rather than your preposterous and distortional political comments to say the least.

You seem to be the campaign arm of the Tory party on here. When you say unemployement "is at a record high AND STILL RISING", perhaps you should tell us that David cameron wouldn't have done anything bec he wanted the recession to take it course.

Yeah unemployment is rising but you didn't tell us what figures- (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8353933.stm) from the ONS revealed recently that rise in unemployment as actually slowed. Perhaps you should tell us if not for the action taken by Gordon Brown whom I'm actually not a big fan of, unemployment didn't reach 3 million by December as predicted by many analysis?

Perhaps you should also tell us what happened in the last recession under the Tory govt where people were left to fend for themselves.
kindley, i suggest that you have a look at the unemployment figures, both the 'official' ones and the more realistic ones being quoted by the majority of the press in this country.

As the link you posted just proved, unemployed is STILL INCREASING!
@Meats, Well like I said unemployment is still rising but it has been slowing. And by the way, unemployment is a lagging indicator of a recession so that's not surprising. This government, Gordon Brown's government has done what the Tory government didn't do by stimulating the economy to minimise the effect of the recession.

What you, Daily Mail and Telegraph wouldn't tell us is that the Tory would have done "nothing" if they were in power. Hence, unemployment would have gone off the roof!
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Post by meats » Wed Jan 06, 2010 7:02 pm

Well the actual unemployment in the UK is closer to 6 million and not the official 2.5 million or whatever the massaged figures suggest. I'd hardly say that Labour has stimulated the economy either, they've bankrupted the UK! I'd also say that creating just under a million jobs in the civil service isn't stimulating the economy. It's a sure fire way of ruining an economy. Did you know that just over a fifth of all people working in the UK are working in the civil service, paid for by the taxpayer?! And Gordon is busy crippling the wealth generating private sector to the extent where they big boys are talking about upping from London and going abroad. God help us all if they do leave as everyone will have a tax rate of around 50%+ if that were to happen, just so we can pay off this incompetent government's debts.

At least you acknowledge that the UK is still in recession, according to Gordon we're not actually in a recession.

Another Labour government ruining a strong economy inherited by a Tory government. This time what with it looking quite likely that Labour are going to go bankrupt themselves we won't have any socialist muppets ruining the economy for quite a while if ever again.

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Post by kindley » Wed Jan 06, 2010 8:19 pm

meats wrote:
gotcha wrote:
republique wrote:No, it doesn't work the other way around because my comment makes sense in the context of the economic crises. You came up with 1:10 ratio like it was some kind of fact so I say prove it. All I said, it is likely the reverse because of the economic crises, which mean probability. My statement for sure is still more likely than yours.
Can you prove your fact? It's your opinion, so does I stick to my opinion. And as I said earlier, OP was not asking about job market, the way he/she was answered is really annoying. People seating here in good or bad job preaching about job market to hopefull.
How can there be 10 success stories for every failure when unemployment is at a record high AND STILL RISING!!??!? Even a bloody dingbat would see that you're so wrong that it's funny. You're not actually Gordon Brown are you? Only he would come up with something as stupid as you are gotcha.
@Meats, a lot of people who read your posts would appreciate if you try to be a bit clear and objective on this subject matter by not being distortional when you say unemployement is "still rising". It is true unemployment is rising but be clear and objective, kindly add that the rise in unemployment is slowing.

This forum is not for Gordon Brown bashing, is it?
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kindley
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Post by kindley » Wed Jan 06, 2010 8:44 pm

meats wrote:Well the actual unemployment in the UK is closer to 6 million and not the official 2.5 million or whatever the massaged figures suggest. I'd hardly say that Labour has stimulated the economy either, they've bankrupted the UK! I'd also say that creating just under a million jobs in the civil service isn't stimulating the economy. It's a sure fire way of ruining an economy. Did you know that just over a fifth of all people working in the UK are working in the civil service, paid for by the taxpayer?! And Gordon is busy crippling the wealth generating private sector to the extent where they big boys are talking about upping from London and going abroad. God help us all if they do leave as everyone will have a tax rate of around 50%+ if that were to happen, just so we can pay off this incompetent government's debts.

At least you acknowledge that the UK is still in recession, according to Gordon we're not actually in a recession.

Another Labour government ruining a strong economy inherited by a Tory government. This time what with it looking quite likely that Labour are going to go bankrupt themselves we won't have any socialist muppets ruining the economy for quite a while if ever again.
@Meats, you quite so selective with your criticism of Gordon Brown, isn't it? You agree that governement has created a lot of jobs in the civil service and but wouldn't agree with the figure that says the unemployment is under 2.5 million. The so called experts prediction using the same analystic tools had predicted unemployment would have risen over 3 million by December 2009 but it never happened. Well to you it might not be good news that Gordon Brown didn't "let the recession to run its course" but those that managed to be gainfully employed in this hard time, would be appreciative of the help and supports the govt afforded them by propping up the economy.

Well, as for the govt bankcrupting the country, this country's debt as a against the National Income is lower than many countries.

It is very reasonable that the govt did what they had to do to stimulate and help help the banks bec if they didn't the recession would have been much more harsher and the conversation, I believe we would be having now would have been you questioning why the govt didnt nationalise the banks.

By the way, you haven't told us what the Tories would have done. Well I know going by the last recession and going by what David Cameron and his colleagus have said they would do-NOTHING! They would have let the unemployement run its course and would have inevitably resulted in you your figure of 6 million unemplyment, collapse of the banking sector and ultimately collapse of general economic activities!
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Post by meats » Thu Jan 07, 2010 12:48 am

kindley,

Unemployment is above 2.5 million, it is around 6 million. If you do any sort of research into who can claim unemployment benefits then you will see that anyone with over £6k worth of savings is excluded from that and other benefits. That rules out pretty much anyone over the age of 40 from claiming any benefits SHOULD they wish to do so having been made redundant. Add in the million or 2 that Labour have admitted are claiming incapacity benefit and disability benefit when they're neither incapacitated or disabled and you're getting close to that 6 million mark. I appreciate that actually researching stuff is quite clearly beyond you but i recommend you search into the real number of unemployed people in this country.

Having been outsourced to the civil service last year i know first hand that the council were creating jobs when none were needed. How anyone can actually justify a fifth of a country's work force working in the civil service is beyond me. Thankfully the Tories will reduce that, resulting in higher employment as it should be right now had it not been for Labour's creating soft jobs to Spammy Spammer figures. Thankfully as well cutting the civil service down to a more realistic size will reduce the tax payers expenditure.

The government should've let Northern Rock go under. That way you wouldn't see Lloyds or RBS in the trouble that they're in now, especially Lloyds. I said from the beginning that the government should've let Northern Rock go under however after they saved Northern Rock they couldn't unfortunately let Lloyds and RBS go under. RBS would've been saved regardless anyway in my opinion, whether by UK government or externally as it was at the time the 4th biggest bank in the world.

I seem to remember that the Tories have rescued the UK economy on several occasions only for Labour to then go and ruin it AGAIN. Labour inherited a strong economy and have ruined it. What would the Tories have done? Ask David Cameron. The first thing that would've gone though would've been lots of jobs in the civil service which would've saved the tax payer a considerable amount of money.

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Post by meats » Thu Jan 07, 2010 1:17 am

And if Gordon and Labour are doing anywhere near as well as you claim would Gordon be fighting off an internal coup at the moment? :lol:

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Post by ThirdWorldTraveller » Thu Jan 07, 2010 1:49 pm

ohhh..an interesting topic. Nobody answers the OP's question with a correct context, and a conservative naysayer who has nothing to do with immigration( he, his parents, his grandparents are all sons and daughters of the soil, proud fellow) is bashing gordon brown and every other immigrant within reach and without context.
No wonder that the poor OP has run for his life.
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Post by meats » Thu Jan 07, 2010 3:44 pm

HSMP_maybe wrote:ohhh..an interesting topic. Nobody answers the OP's question with a correct context, and a conservative naysayer who has nothing to do with immigration( he, his parents, his grandparents are all sons and daughters of the soil, proud fellow) is bashing gordon brown and every other immigrant within reach and without context.
No wonder that the poor OP has run for his life.
I don't remember 'bashing' any immigrants on this thread, i seem to remember correcting kindley about the unemployment figures in this country and gotcha who seems to think that there are 10 success stories for every failure. But if you feel that that is 'bashing' then continue on your merry way as most people with half a brain would tell you that what i said is actually pretty factual.

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Post by Wanderer » Thu Jan 07, 2010 4:12 pm

Having 'sort of' - I'll say no more, 'worked with' GB in the past I say the man is a genius, no other person could have guided the UK through this hole the better, ok he has zero charisma but he is 1000 times better than us at this job, and probably the same for any Tory, who, let's face it are somewhat inexperienced in managing a country now since Thatcher bludgeoned a government on the back of beating lil' ole' Argentina in a war....
An chéad stad eile Stáisiún Uí Chonghaile....

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Post by meats » Thu Jan 07, 2010 4:16 pm

Wanderer wrote:Having 'sort of' - I'll say no more, 'worked with' GB in the past I say the man is a genius, no other person could have guided the UK through this hole the better, ok he has zero charisma but he is 1000 times better than us at this job, and probably the same for any Tory, who, let's face it are somewhat inexperienced in managing a country now since Thatcher bludgeoned a government on the back of beating lil' ole' Argentina in a war....
Another strong economy left by the Tories only for Labour to ruin another strong economy. Tories inherit a nearly bankrupt economy now and will make it strong again as only they can. This time however it won't be Labour inheriting it as they're going to be out of power for at least a generation. I wouldn't be surprised if UKIP become the 2nd party in the UK within the next couple of years.

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Post by Wanderer » Thu Jan 07, 2010 4:59 pm

meats wrote:
Wanderer wrote:Having 'sort of' - I'll say no more, 'worked with' GB in the past I say the man is a genius, no other person could have guided the UK through this hole the better, ok he has zero charisma but he is 1000 times better than us at this job, and probably the same for any Tory, who, let's face it are somewhat inexperienced in managing a country now since Thatcher bludgeoned a government on the back of beating lil' ole' Argentina in a war....
Another strong economy left by the Tories only for Labour to ruin another strong economy. Tories inherit a nearly bankrupt economy now and will make it strong again as only they can. This time however it won't be Labour inheriting it as they're going to be out of power for at least a generation. I wouldn't be surprised if UKIP become the 2nd party in the UK within the next couple of years.
Not gonna happen mate, no one in Tory Gov has the sheer ability of GB, no-one in UK, look at his CV, it's head and shoulders above anyone else's.

I think it's time politics has taken out of the economy equation, the UK is a plc, it should be run as a company, as Labour is doing, not quite sure I agree with that but there's no 100%'s. Why politicise it? We should be picking the from the brains and high-flyers in Gov and Industry and building a country on that, not petty politics and gain-saying.

But that smacks of Socialism/communism, but has anyone tried to build a truly socialist government on top of strong economy? Russia/USSR? No - weak economy. Sweden? Yes, beautiful people, beautiful place, huge taxes, huge social safety net, people are happy and never have to worry about having no job, no work, no health insurance, education is free even to foreigners, it's all in place. From the cradle to the grave. Nearest thing to communism working IMHO.

This is what the UK should aspire to, not petty political point-scoring, but to build a socialist lifestyle for everyone, what is wrong with it?

Or do we let the rich get richer and poor get poorer? I'm no friend of the freeloader, but despite everything the UK has all the cards, and can make this Swedish-style utopia a reality, easily.

But it wont happen un Toryism, and maybe not under Labour, the nextgen, let's hope the whole political landscape dies and the UK can be run as benefit to it's citizens.
An chéad stad eile Stáisiún Uí Chonghaile....

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Post by meats » Thu Jan 07, 2010 5:15 pm

Wanderer wrote:
meats wrote:
Wanderer wrote:Having 'sort of' - I'll say no more, 'worked with' GB in the past I say the man is a genius, no other person could have guided the UK through this hole the better, ok he has zero charisma but he is 1000 times better than us at this job, and probably the same for any Tory, who, let's face it are somewhat inexperienced in managing a country now since Thatcher bludgeoned a government on the back of beating lil' ole' Argentina in a war....
Another strong economy left by the Tories only for Labour to ruin another strong economy. Tories inherit a nearly bankrupt economy now and will make it strong again as only they can. This time however it won't be Labour inheriting it as they're going to be out of power for at least a generation. I wouldn't be surprised if UKIP become the 2nd party in the UK within the next couple of years.
Not gonna happen mate, no one in Tory Gov has the sheer ability of GB, no-one in UK, look at his CV, it's head and shoulders above anyone else's.

I think it's time politics has taken out of the economy equation, the UK is a plc, it should be run as a company, as Labour is doing, not quite sure I agree with that but there's no 100%'s. Why politicise it? We should be picking the from the brains and high-flyers in Gov and Industry and building a country on that, not petty politics and gain-saying.

But that smacks of Socialism/communism, but has anyone tried to build a truly socialist government on top of strong economy? Russia/USSR? No - weak economy. Sweden? Yes, beautiful people, beautiful place, huge taxes, huge social safety net, people are happy and never have to worry about having no job, no work, no health insurance, education is free even to foreigners, it's all in place. From the cradle to the grave. Nearest thing to communism working IMHO.

This is what the UK should aspire to, not petty political point-scoring, but to build a socialist lifestyle for everyone, what is wrong with it?

Or do we let the rich get richer and poor get poorer? I'm no friend of the freeloader, but despite everything the UK has all the cards, and can make this Swedish-style utopia a reality, easily.

But it wont happen un Toryism, and maybe not under Labour, the nextgen, let's hope the whole political landscape dies and the UK can be run as benefit to it's citizens.
It definitely won't happen under Labour, all that we'll get under Labour is a bankrupt country and a huge amount of freeloaders.

I was reading an article in the Telegraph last night that actually said that Brown has so far done a good job with the economy, however he is not the man to continue with it due to his Keynesians approach to solving it with more debt. I'll try and find the article, i just had a quick look but can't find it.

I was also reading another article on there last night, again i can't find it but i'll have more of a look later on, about what could be done to help improve things in the UK. One of the things was to change NI payments. So instead of it going to the NHS it would go into a pot just for you, so it would be an automatic saving that you have access to should you ever need any treatment.

One of the other things was to change the benefits system, which needs changing regardless of who is in power, so that you could only claim for 2 children regardless of whether you've got 2 or 12. There were other changes to but that was the one that stood out. As i said i'll try and find that article later on.

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Post by kindley » Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:44 pm

meats wrote:
Wanderer wrote:Having 'sort of' - I'll say no more, 'worked with' GB in the past I say the man is a genius, no other person could have guided the UK through this hole the better, ok he has zero charisma but he is 1000 times better than us at this job, and probably the same for any Tory, who, let's face it are somewhat inexperienced in managing a country now since Thatcher bludgeoned a government on the back of beating lil' ole' Argentina in a war....
Another strong economy left by the Tories only for Labour to ruin another strong economy. Tories inherit a nearly bankrupt economy now and will make it strong again as only they can. This time however it won't be Labour inheriting it as they're going to be out of power for at least a generation. I wouldn't be surprised if UKIP become the 2nd party in the UK within the next couple of years.
@Meats, you know what? Youy haven't told us what Cameron and hgis colleagues would do. In fact, The Spectator editor who is actually one of the Tory supporter admits Cameron's Tory add up to nothing!
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Post by meats » Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:46 pm

kindley wrote:
meats wrote:
Wanderer wrote:Having 'sort of' - I'll say no more, 'worked with' GB in the past I say the man is a genius, no other person could have guided the UK through this hole the better, ok he has zero charisma but he is 1000 times better than us at this job, and probably the same for any Tory, who, let's face it are somewhat inexperienced in managing a country now since Thatcher bludgeoned a government on the back of beating lil' ole' Argentina in a war....
Another strong economy left by the Tories only for Labour to ruin another strong economy. Tories inherit a nearly bankrupt economy now and will make it strong again as only they can. This time however it won't be Labour inheriting it as they're going to be out of power for at least a generation. I wouldn't be surprised if UKIP become the 2nd party in the UK within the next couple of years.
@Meats, you know what? Youy haven't told us what Cameron and hgis colleagues would do. In fact, The Spectator editor who is actually one of the Tory supporter admits Cameron's Tory add up to nothing!
Have a look on their website, their policies are all on there available for all to read.

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