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passport stamps and IOs name/identifying number

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86ti
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passport stamps and IOs name/identifying number

Post by 86ti » Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:12 am

I have two questions regarding entrance procedures:

1) Do stamps that are put into passports have a uniform appearance? What I am particularly interested in is if stamps have numbers/codes etc. that would identify an individual immigration officer or have any other identifying features.

2) Are IOs required to reveal their name or identifying number (do they have one?) on request?

geriatrix
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Re: passport stamps and IOs name/identifying number

Post by geriatrix » Tue Aug 17, 2010 10:10 am

86ti wrote:Do stamps that are put into passports have a uniform appearance?
I would vote yes. All stamps in my and partner's passport look the same (not all our trips abroad have been together).
86ti wrote:What I am particularly interested in is if stamps have numbers/codes etc. that would identify an individual immigration officer or have any other identifying features.
Immigration Officer
(Numeric code)
Date of Arrival
Airport (Terminal)

Text in italics are the variable inputs.

regards

86ti
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Post by 86ti » Tue Aug 17, 2010 11:39 am

Thanks a lot for your feedback. The interesting bit is that we have one stamp that fits your description but we recently got another one where the second line with the numeric code is missing and I keep wondering why. (This last stamp shouldn't have been put there and after a complaint the head of the Border Forces at Manchester airport has apologized but also asked as for further information regarding the identity of the IO).

Mr Rusty
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Post by Mr Rusty » Wed Aug 18, 2010 8:26 am

86ti wrote:Thanks a lot for your feedback. The interesting bit is that we have one stamp that fits your description but we recently got another one where the second line with the numeric code is missing and I keep wondering why. (This last stamp shouldn't have been put there and after a complaint the head of the Border Forces at Manchester airport has apologized but also asked as for further information regarding the identity of the IO).
So the officer managed to make the endorsement without his/her identifying number coming out - perhaps someone complained about this person before. Officers are required to make a clear endorsement in a "stamping on book" at the start of their shift, but the stamps aren't very high-tech. Additionally after the repeated action several hundred times in a shift, the old wrist gets a bit weary and it's not surprising that a less than perfect stamp is sometimes the result.
Such episodes as your complaint usually generate a general exhortation to improve the quality of endorsements and possibly a reminder about the mistake if the individual culprit can't be identified.

86ti
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Post by 86ti » Wed Aug 18, 2010 9:15 am

Mr Rusty wrote:
86ti wrote:Thanks a lot for your feedback. The interesting bit is that we have one stamp that fits your description but we recently got another one where the second line with the numeric code is missing and I keep wondering why. (This last stamp shouldn't have been put there and after a complaint the head of the Border Forces at Manchester airport has apologized but also asked as for further information regarding the identity of the IO).
So the officer managed to make the endorsement without his/her identifying number coming out - perhaps someone complained about this person before. Officers are required to make a clear endorsement in a "stamping on book" at the start of their shift, but the stamps aren't very high-tech. Additionally after the repeated action several hundred times in a shift, the old wrist gets a bit weary and it's not surprising that a less than perfect stamp is sometimes the result.
Such episodes as your complaint usually generate a general exhortation to improve the quality of endorsements and possibly a reminder about the mistake if the individual culprit can't be identified.
Thanks, that helps a lot to better understand the situation.

For completeness I add a link to a scan of the stamp that may be useful to others in a similar situation.
Image

The Station Agent
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Post by The Station Agent » Thu Aug 19, 2010 4:42 pm

there are no conditions stated on the stamp. Does the traveller have ILR? In which case the stamp will just be there to note their re-entry date. They're starting to stamp people in and out regardless of whether they have an extant stamp.

86ti
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Post by 86ti » Thu Aug 19, 2010 5:35 pm

The Station Agent wrote:there are no conditions stated on the stamp. Does the traveller have ILR? In which case the stamp will just be there to note their re-entry date. They're starting to stamp people in and out regardless of whether they have an extant stamp.
My wife has an EEA residence card which means that IOs are prohibited from stamping her passport as per the EEA regulations.

PaperPusher
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Post by PaperPusher » Thu Aug 19, 2010 6:02 pm

Out of curiosity, where does it say that in the EEA regulations?

86ti
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Post by 86ti » Thu Aug 19, 2010 6:25 pm

PaperPusher wrote:Out of curiosity, where does it say that in the EEA regulations?
11(3).

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Post by Kitty » Thu Aug 19, 2010 7:53 pm

86ti wrote:For completeness I add a link to a scan of the stamp that may be useful to others in a similar situation.
Image
Interesting. I have seen plenty of stamps where the whole thing came out very faintly, but in your case everything except the IO's number seems to have printed beautifully...

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Post by alikhan28 » Thu Aug 19, 2010 8:12 pm

Kitty wrote:
86ti wrote:For completeness I add a link to a scan of the stamp that may be useful to others in a similar situation.
Image
Interesting. I have seen plenty of stamps where the whole thing came out very faintly, but in your case everything except the IO's number seems to have printed beautifully...
After looking this scan I can say this is not a big problem.

Its OK in my view.

Ali

Mr Rusty
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Post by Mr Rusty » Fri Aug 20, 2010 2:26 am

Kitty wrote: Interesting. I have seen plenty of stamps where the whole thing came out very faintly, but in your case everything except the IO's number seems to have printed beautifully...
- and half of the airport name?

86ti
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Post by 86ti » Fri Aug 20, 2010 7:16 am

alikhan28 wrote:After looking this scan I can say this is not a big problem. Its OK in my view.
In what sense is it ok? Have you actually read this thread and realized that this stamp has been put there against the law? The missing identifying number doesn't put the affair in a better light either.

Kitty
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Post by Kitty » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:25 am

Mr Rusty wrote:
Kitty wrote: Interesting. I have seen plenty of stamps where the whole thing came out very faintly, but in your case everything except the IO's number seems to have printed beautifully...
- and half of the airport name?
Well, fair comment. Mind you, if you click on the picture in the post and look at an enlarged version of it, the IO number isn't just faint, it really does seem to be non-existent.

86ti
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Post by 86ti » Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:48 am

Kitty wrote:
Mr Rusty wrote:
Kitty wrote: Interesting. I have seen plenty of stamps where the whole thing came out very faintly, but in your case everything except the IO's number seems to have printed beautifully...
- and half of the airport name?
Well, fair comment. Mind you, if you click on the picture in the post and look at an enlarged version of it, the IO number isn't just faint, it really does seem to be non-existent.
The number should also be between two bold stars... But actually I didn't want to discuss so much why this particular stamp looks as it does and for what reason (we could speculate about this to no end and the border forces at Manchester airport will anyway do what they have to) but I rather wanted to know how it should look like and, more specificially, what obligations IOs have to identify themselves.

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Post by Mr Rusty » Fri Aug 20, 2010 9:17 am

86ti wrote:..... I rather wanted to know ........., more specificially, what obligations IOs have to identify themselves.
Immigration Officers used to have a number on the warrant issued to them on behalf of Her Majesty. The instruction was that if asked for i/d by a passenger they should give their warrant number.
I understand that those working at ports and airports no longer have warrants, in fact having amalgamated with Customs they are no longer "Immigration Officers", but are now "Border Force Officers". Doubtless they have some sort of i/d and give the number on that if required. There was a move at one time to make them all wear name badges like a supermarket checkout, but there wasn't much talk of that when I left.

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Post by wabuthu » Fri Aug 20, 2010 2:29 pm

i have a question, i left the country and came back in early january and my visa stamp is completely faint, it doesn't even show the date that i came back into the country. i'm very dismayed by this...can i complain and get a sortof restamp or letter from home office to prove that i returned on 21st january?

secondly, this is neither here nor there...but i always remember the point of entry officer who stamped my passport at heathrow was indian...and while i was standing there a caucasian immigration officer from one of the other desks came upto him and asked him if he knew how to speak indian so that he could go translate and shout at one of the people he was talking to and they had a big laugh about it. i always remember how inhumane i thought it was. anyway at that point is when he quickly stamped my faint stamp that doesn't show at all and walked off with his colleague laughing away to go shout at the applicant. very unprofessional behaviour.
i'm not a professional, i'm just giving responses from personal experiences or from ukba or ukcisa links that appear appropriate to the situation. currently on PSW visa

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Post by geriatrix » Fri Aug 20, 2010 3:02 pm

wabuthu wrote:i have a question, i left the country and came back in early january and my visa stamp is completely faint, it doesn't even show the date that i came back into the country. i'm very dismayed by this...can i complain and get a sortof restamp or letter from home office to prove that i returned on 21st january?
Did you fill up a landing card on arrival? If yes, your (re)entry date is recorded with UKBA in their database.


regards

alikhan28
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Post by alikhan28 » Fri Aug 20, 2010 5:18 pm

86ti wrote:
alikhan28 wrote:After looking this scan I can say this is not a big problem. Its OK in my view.
In what sense is it ok? Have you actually read this thread and realized that this stamp has been put there against the law? The missing identifying number doesn't put the affair in a better light either.
Indeed I have read the thread.

You are worrying to much.

If stamp is not correct then how this is yours fault.
Home office has s computer database and they records every arrival.

Ali

wabuthu
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Post by wabuthu » Fri Aug 20, 2010 5:31 pm

sushdmehta wrote:Did you fill up a landing card on arrival? If yes, your (re)entry date is recorded with UKBA in their database.

regards
@sushdmehta: thanks so much for letting me know this, yes i did fill in a landing card. i'm much more relieved and settled about it now :)
i'm not a professional, i'm just giving responses from personal experiences or from ukba or ukcisa links that appear appropriate to the situation. currently on PSW visa

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Post by INSIDER » Sat Aug 21, 2010 12:12 am

As for IOs identifying themselves, there is no rule that says they must identify themsleves by name, many choose not to. I think it is perfectly understandable why. In this day and age of easy communication it would be so easy for a malicious passenger to put an IOs name out on the internet and compromise that officer's safety and privacy.

Having said that every IO/CIO does have a unique badge number which is easily visible on the slider/epaulette[sp] on their shoulder. I would imagine that in most cases an officer would in fact have no qualms in giving out their number. This unique number has no relation to the stamp number used in passports.

alikhan28
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Post by alikhan28 » Sat Aug 21, 2010 8:18 pm

INSIDER wrote:As for IOs identifying themselves, there is no rule that says they must identify themsleves by name, many choose not to. I think it is perfectly understandable why. In this day and age of easy communication it would be so easy for a malicious passenger to put an IOs name out on the internet and compromise that officer's safety and privacy.

Having said that every IO/CIO does have a unique badge number which is easily visible on the slider/epaulette[sp] on their shoulder. I would imagine that in most cases an officer would in fact have no qualms in giving out their number. This unique number has no relation to the stamp number used in passports.
Indeed good explanation.

Ali

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