Human right application refused removal help

rajuk20 · Post by **rajuk20** » Wed Jul 22, 2015 7:16 pm

I am new in this forum
my application for human rights on the basis of family life is refused because i was aged 18 at the time of application.
came as minor 12 years old along with overstayed parents in 2007 and now aged 20.

now as my sister lived here for 7 years and 4 months she was granted leave to remain for 2 and half years on the basis of 7 year child rule and also parents granted leave to remain for 2 and half years. Home office is now claiming that i dont fulfill the requirement of immigration rules and i can return to india because i was aged 18 when my father made the application on 7 year rule.

Now home office treated my application seperate from my family even though we all came together as a visitors. now i was given right to appeal.

what are my chances to remain in the uk with my family? :/
to claim private life there is still 3 years wait for my half of the life in the uk. i don't fulfill immigration rules but studied here adopted uk culture and life in the uk. is there any chances for me to succeed by proving very significant obstacles as i have no family back home and my parents and sister is here??

am i likely to win the appeal? help please
also on temporary admission reporting
will i get detained?

feeling really stressed and sad because its not even my fault of overstayer what are options someone save me

Post by **Obie** » Wed Jul 22, 2015 8:55 pm

Notwithstanding the fact that you have turned 18, you continue to have family life with your parents as you are a young adult who has not yet found a family of his own.

Your appeal has a reasonable prospect of success.

Post by **noajthan** » Wed Jul 22, 2015 9:22 pm

rajuk20 wrote:I am new in this forum
my application for human rights on the basis of family life is refused because i was aged 18 at the time of application.
came as minor 12 years old along with overstayed parents in 2007 and now aged 20.

now as my sister lived here for 7 years and 4 months she was granted leave to remain for 2 and half years on the basis of 7 year child rule and also parents granted leave to remain for 2 and half years. Home office is now claiming that i dont fulfill the requirement of immigration rules and i can return to india because i was aged 18 when my father made the application on 7 year rule.

Now home office treated my application seperate from my family even though we all came together as a visitors. now i was given right to appeal.

what are my chances to remain in the uk with my family? :/
to claim private life there is still 3 years wait for my half of the life in the uk. i don't fulfill immigration rules but studied here adopted uk culture and life in the uk. is there any chances for me to succeed by proving very significant obstacles as i have no family back home and my parents and sister is here??

am i likely to win the appeal? help please
also on temporary admission reporting
will i get detained?

feeling really stressed and sad because its not even my fault of overstayer what are options someone save me

This may give you hope that you have a good basis for an appeal against the HO's known hardline approach on HR:
https://www.freemovement.org.uk/when-is ... e-engaged/

A young adult living with his parents or siblings will normally have a family life to be respected under Article 8. A child enjoying a family life with his parents does not suddenly cease to have a family life at midnight as he turns 18 years of age.

Get good representation & don't give up.
Good luck.

rajuk20 · Post by **rajuk20** » Wed Jul 22, 2015 9:30 pm

home office refused my application under paragraph 276ADE over 18 and spent less than 20 years but there would be very significant obstacles to re integrate to my country of origin.

so in appeal what kind of evidence will they expect from me? only arguments is enough or evidence will also be needed and what kind of?
how to prove about very significant obstacles?
on what basis i can rely if they don't want to grant me visa on very significant obstacles which they says that having spent 12 years in india i can resettle there because they dont believe that i have lost all ties and culture. they also accept that i have established my private life in refusal letter.

can i still rely on article 8 private life even if i dont fulfill requirement of 276ADE of over 18 and spent less than 20 years?
because home office says im over 18 so do the judge will recognize family life even if i am adult living with my parents?

My half life is going to be when i turn 24 long time to wait still reporting to immigration authorities and also served with removal notice RED001 that i am liable to detained and removable if incase if i lost appeal to first tier tribunals what can i do that they will not detain me

Post by **noajthan** » Wed Jul 22, 2015 10:12 pm

rajuk20 wrote: home office refused my application under paragraph 276ADE over 18 and spent less than 20 years but there would be very significant obstacles to re integrate to my country of origin.

so in appeal what kind of evidence will they expect from me? only arguments is enough or evidence will also be needed and what kind of?
how to prove about very significant obstacles?
on what basis i can rely if they don't want to grant me visa on very significant obstacles which they says that having spent 12 years in india i can resettle there because they dont believe that i have lost all ties and culture. they also accept that i have established my private life in refusal letter.

can i still rely on article 8 private life even if i dont fulfill requirement of 276ADE of over 18 and spent less than 20 years?
because home office says im over 18 so do the judge will recognize family life even if i am adult living with my parents?

My half life is going to be when i turn 24 long time to wait still reporting to immigration authorities and also served with removal notice RED001 that i am liable to detained and removable if incase if i lost appeal to first tier tribunals what can i do that they will not detain me

The article is giving examples of recent judgements & legal opinions from recent cases.

Yes HR applies to you and you can invoke it as a defence.
Remember the HO ruling is just one side of the argument.
You must have developed both a 'private life' and 'family life' here in UK with your parents & siblings;
also in the wider community, through school/college, also with involvement in local society and the place you live, etc.

You will need to produce evidence of how you have integrated and adapted into life in this country.
Show that your life and immediate future is here, including your future plans and ambitions - and all supported by your family network here.
Show that they need you as well as you needing them.

You would also have to show how difficult life would be if returning alone to the country you left so many years ago.
(Who and what would be there for you; how & where would you even manage to live).

You can't be expected to make this case & represent it at the appeal all by yourself.
If at all possible you need good representation.
They will help gather the evidence and make your case.

Post by **secret.simon** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 2:52 pm

I do not mean any disrespect to the OP and I appreciate that he is not at fault as he was only 12 years old at the time of his coming to the UK, but I am going to strike a discordant note here in saying that his family seem to be (from his description) the type of applicants that have abused the system, thus making it harder for all of us who have followed the harder but legal process to get our families to live with us or even just to visit us in the UK.

rajuk20 wrote:came as minor 12 years old along with overstayed parents in 2007 and now aged 20. now as my sister lived here for 7 years and 4 months she was granted leave to remain for 2 and half years on the basis of 7 year child rule and also parents granted leave to remain for 2 and half years...even though we all came together as a visitors.

It seems from the original post that the family came to the UK with a small child (his sister) as visitors and used her 7 year illegal stay as an anchor to get leave to stay in the UK. This is precisely the type of abuse that has made it so difficult to get the families of legal residents and citizens to merely visit the UK, even though they may not wish to settle here.

To then base an application on human rights grounds after clearly breaking the law (and mind you his family are neither refugees nor asylum seekers) beggars belief, discredits the concept of and impoverishes support for human rights. In my opinion, which I am aware is not widely shared on these forums, this is a clear and blatant abuse of the human rights provision. Obie is learned in the law and would advise on the law as it stands, but this is the kind of case that the Home Office should reject for it to be tested in the courts by judicial review, so that we have a better understanding of the human rights provisions involved.

I do not wish to hurt the OP's feelings, as he is blameless due to his age, but my advice would be for him to return to India and apply from there in the legal way, rather than get around the rules (that his family have already broken).

physicskate · Post by **physicskate** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 3:37 pm

I too don't see the human rights' violation and arguing 'human rights' does diminish the arguments of others...

In fact, the fact that the OP spent over 7 years in India before coming to the UK diminishes the 7 year rule and suggests that they would be able to adapt to life back in their home country.

I think it is a shame that the OP was put in this situation and a shame that his parents did not originally seek legal recourse to live in the UK. His life would be much easier now...

But that is an opinion...

I the light of rules, it becomes quite difficult to prove dependency after the age of 18 if the do not have previous dependent visas. In fact, a lot of 19, 20 year olds come to this forum seeking to join a parent and the route is closed to them. Fairness aside, I think the OP will not have an easy time of gaining legal residence without significant funds and a very skillful legal representative.

OP, do you work? Study? Working would be illegal. Might it be possible for you to get a student visa??

Post by **secret.simon** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 4:01 pm

physicskate wrote:OP, do you work? Study? Working would be illegal.

That is a valid point.

What is the source of the family's income? If any of the family members have worked in the past seven years, that would have been illegal. I can see why Cameron was pushing for such income to be seized as the proceeds of crime. That is exactly what it is.

If they are being funded by members of the community, surely that would make such members accessory to an immigration crime.

If he were to study, he would have to apply as an overseas student, paying well over the odds for his education in this country. Even if he were to be given DLR, he would not be eligible for either the home students rates or student loans.

His parents have a lot to answer to him for.

rajuk20 · Post by **rajuk20** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 5:12 pm

physicskate wrote: i am stuck in this system because i lived my life as same standard as british childrens how can they tell me to return to country where i dont know anyone there no family no friends there? i am looking to buy some time to wait for my half of the life any possibility to spend time by making wasted applications so that atleast i can claim private life when i turn 24
if i find british girlfriend can i marry?? what are chances and doors for me

rajuk20 · Post by **rajuk20** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 5:14 pm

i am stuck in this system because i lived my life as same standard as british childrens how can they tell me to return to country where i dont know anyone there no family no friends there? i am looking to buy some time to wait for my half of the life any possibility to spend time by making wasted applications so that atleast i can claim private life when i turn 24
if i find british girlfriend can i marry?? what are chances and doors for me

Post by **secret.simon** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 5:42 pm

rajuk20 wrote:i am stuck in this system

You are not stuck in this system. You can and should leave.

rajuk20 wrote:i lived my life as same standard as british childrens how can they tell me to return to country where i dont know anyone there no family no friends there?

Silly argument. You have lived the first 12 years, the most formative, in India. It would be hard to believe that the experiences of the past seven years outweigh that of the first 12.

I lived my early life to the same standards as other people in my country of birth. That did not prevent me from coming to the UK in a legal way and working to set up my life here. I did not have either friends or family here. I built up a network of people I know here.

Also, given how Indian culture works, I find it improbable that you have no family in India. The siblings or cousins of your parents can help you resettle. Given that you lived the first 12 years of your life in India, there would be a mutual recognition and I am sure they would support you.

Even if they were not to, I do not see how that remedies your illegal stay here.

rajuk20 wrote:i am looking to buy some time to wait for my half of the life any possibility to spend time by making wasted applications so that atleast i can claim private life when i turn 24if i find british girlfriend can i marry?? what are chances and doors for me

So, having broken the law and knowing that you have, now you want our help not in legalising your stay, but in continuing to break the law. I am not sure you deserve a response to that request.

If you marry a British spouse, they will need to meet certain requirements. They will need to be earning more than £18, 600 per year and also show that they can provide accommodation for you. You will have to go back to your home country and reapply from there. There is a good chance that you will get a spouse visa, in spite of your current illegal stay. However, citizenship will be at least ten years from the day you leave the UK.

While I may sound harsh on you, understand that the way your parents gamed the system has made life much harder for people like me. My parents can not visit the UK or come and live with me because somebody else's parents broke the law and so the UK had to tighten the requirements for visitor visas.

There is no such thing as a victimless crime.

rajuk20 · Post by **rajuk20** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 6:00 pm

rajuk20 wrote:yes

rajuk20 · Post by **rajuk20** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 6:09 pm

@secret.simon yes you are right its not only my parents everyone in uk abusing this human rights systems why cant you talk about them?

physicskate · Post by **physicskate** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 6:16 pm

rajuk20 wrote:@secret.simon yes you are right its not only my parents everyone in uk abusing this human rights systems why cant you talk about them?

He is! It's just that you have written in and specifically asked how to game the system. You have made yourself an easy target to what we see on this forum all the time...

Your case is also exemplary of why the govt is continuing to try to change and has changed the requirements of human rights' claims in recent years.

rajuk20 · Post by **rajuk20** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 6:26 pm

you are saying having spent 12 years in home country it is hard to believe that lost ties and culture first of all who would wanna help and support to someone who left the country when he was child and got family in this country no one is that kind to support someone that is like i am homeless and people target me easily by bullying who spent time in growing up in england cant even speak the language of my country properly as my langauge is english and grew up here.

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Human right application refused removal help

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