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Mother with Sole Responsibility

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TandT
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Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by TandT » Sat May 06, 2023 1:31 am

To all well-knowledgeable advisers and members with personal experience within the forum!!!!

Please how can a British child could be brought into the United Kingdom by the mother of the child who is only the sole carer and responsible for the upbringing of that British child? The child is still a baby and the father is not interested other than to just process the British passport for the child. That is it. Because he had already said he doesn't want a child from the beginning but when it happened he said the only he could do is to give that child the identity only just because he doesn't want his other wife to know for now.

The mother really needs help. She is my aunty and all I could do is to help with a piece of genuine information or If there is anything I could do to help from the UK if necessary. She is really struggling in Africa with the baby.

Thank you, everyone.

vinny
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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by vinny » Sat May 06, 2023 3:06 am

Unfortunately, I think The Immigration Rules
49. In relation to in-country applications, there are immigration rules that provide eligibility to applicants having a genuine and subsisting relationship with a British citizen child. These broadly complement the protection against removal afforded by s.117B(6) in the context of decisions by courts and tribunals. Paragraph EX.1, which concerns exceptions to certain eligibility requirements for leave to remain as a partner or parent, is predicated, in the same way as is s.117B(6), on it “not being reasonable to expect the [qualifying] child to leave the UK” (EX.1(a) (ii)). Paragraph R-LTRPT.1.1, which concerns requirements for limited leave to remain as a parent, includes a relationship requirement that covers a child who is “a British citizen or settled in the UK” (E-LTRPT.2.2(c), but by E-LTRPT.2.2(b) the child concerned must be “living in the UK”.

50. In relation to entry clearance applications, Section E-ECPT includes a route for parents of a child who is either a British citizen or settled in the UK (E-ECPT.2.2(c)), but (again) the child must be “living in the UK”. The Rules do provide at GEN.1.3(c) that for the purposes of Appendix FM “references to a British citizen in the UK also include a British citizen who is coming to the UK with the applicant as their partner or parent” (emphasis added) but in the case of a British citizen child with an applicant parent the only applicable rules currently are those set out in GEN. 3.1 – GEN. 3.3. under the heading “Exceptional circumstances”. As we have seen, EX.1 does not apply when applicants apply from abroad for entry clearance, even though they have British citizen children in the UK.

51. Although there is no path, therefore, for parents of a British citizen child not living in the UK under the main routes to entry clearance set out in Appendix FM, GEN.3.3.2 does require the decision-maker, in considering whether there are exceptional circumstances giving rise to a breach of Article 8 because such a refusal (including refusal of entry clearance) “would result in unjustifiably harsh consequences for the applicant, their partner, a relevant child or another family member whose Article 8 rights it is evident from that information would be affected by a decision to refuse the application.” (emphasis added). That clearly requires the decision-maker to take into account the impact on any relevant child, although the definition of “relevant child” makes no reference to nationality. We shall come back to this aspect of the Rules later on.
makes it difficult?

27.
In SD (British citizen children - entry clearance) Sri Lanka [2020] UKUT 43(IAC) the Tribunal held (in the context of an entry clearance appeal)
  1. British citizenship is a relevant factor when assessing the best interests of the child.
  2. British citizenship includes the opportunities for children to live in the UK, receive free education, have full access to healthcare and welfare provision and participate in the life of their local community as they grow up.
  3. There is no equivalent to s.117B(6) of the Nationality, Immigration and Asylum Act 2002 in any provision of law or policy relating to entry clearance applicants.
  4. In assessing whether refusal to grant a parent entry clearance to join a partner has unjustifiably harsh consequences, the fact that such a parent has a child living with him or her who has British citizenship is a relevant factor. However, the weight to be accorded to such a factor will depend heavily on the particular circumstances and is not necessarily a powerful factor.
  5. When assessing the significance to be attached to a parent's child having British citizenship, it will also be relevant to consider whether that child possesses dual nationality and what rights and benefits attach to that other nationality.
16.
Whilst I accept that Section 117B (6) cannot apply directly because it is concerned with removal of those in genuine and subsisting parental relationship with a qualifying child, the case of SD is not directly on point either. In that case, the children concerned (who were British nationals) were also outside the jurisdiction (living in Sri Lanka). The guidance given in the headnote that "[t]here is no equivalent to s.117B(6) ...in any provision of law or policy relating to entry clearance applicants" has to be read in that context. The children on whose position reliance was placed in that case were themselves not living in the UK. Although Section 55 is applied to their situation via the lens of Gen 3.3 of Appendix FM, as a domestic legal provision applying to children living in the UK, it does not apply directly whereas in this case, Section 55 does apply to the Sponsor's daughter. It is somewhat difficult to see why, if the Appellant in this case is found to be in a genuine and subsisting parental relationship with a child who is found to meet the definition of a qualifying child (depending on the reasonableness question), the public interest does not favour him being entitled to enter if it would not require his removal even if he were in the UK illegally.
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TandT
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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by TandT » Fri May 12, 2023 11:09 pm

Thank you so much Vinny for your time and expertise. I think the only option is to find her way to the UK in order to benefit from FLR FP as a parent to a British child.

Please does she has to marry a settled or British citizen outside the UK with a marriage certificate in order to apply for the spouse route? or she can apply just as a partner without a marriage certificate provided their relationship is 2 years and above? If she is lucky to find someone who likes her here in the UK to start a union together.

Thank you again Vinny and to anyone with knowledge on this question.

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Ticktack
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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by Ticktack » Mon May 15, 2023 2:59 pm

TandT wrote:
Fri May 12, 2023 11:09 pm
Thank you so much Vinny for your time and expertise. I think the only option is to find her way to the UK in order to benefit from FLR FP as a parent to a British child.

Please does she has to marry a settled or British citizen outside the UK with a marriage certificate in order to apply for the spouse route? or she can apply just as a partner without a marriage certificate provided their relationship is 2 years and above? If she is lucky to find someone who likes her here in the UK to start a union together.

Thank you again Vinny and to anyone with knowledge on this question.
You have to be married to a settled or British Citizen to apply for a spouse visa from outside the UK.
No sin in failing, you just have to try and try again!

TandT
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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by TandT » Wed May 17, 2023 1:13 am

Thank you for your reply.

But how many years should your relationship be to apply for a fiancee visa from outside the United Kingdom? And the document needed. Thank you.

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Ticktack
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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by Ticktack » Wed May 17, 2023 9:08 am

TandT wrote:
Wed May 17, 2023 1:13 am
Thank you for your reply.

But how many years should your relationship be to apply for a fiancee visa from outside the United Kingdom? And the document needed. Thank you.
There's no time stamp on that. What you need to consider is the fact that the visa allows you to come to the UK and get married within 6 months (of your arrival in the UK). You need to be able to evidence that you and your UK sponsor have been together (1 week, 5 years, 10 years). And you intend to spend the rest of your lives together. Hard to prove this things if the time together is too short.
Pictures, phone calls, messages. Anything to show that your relationship is genuine and subsisting, and you plan on taking it to the next level ASAP.
No sin in failing, you just have to try and try again!

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Frontier Mole
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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by Frontier Mole » Thu May 18, 2023 4:52 pm

Has the father agreed formally to cede sole responsibility to the mother? Is there a legal document that sets that out?

Is the father normally resident in the U.K.?

Has the child been issued with a U.K. passport?

THO
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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by THO » Fri May 19, 2023 10:41 am

Am I reading this right? The father is British, the mother Liberian, and now she has got herself a baby by an already married man who was clear he expected her to take precautions, she is wanting to come to the UK, (presumably because she expects the British tax payer to take care of her and her child, since she is having a hard time in Africa) and thinks that she is entitled because of her child's father's nationality?

I'm not sure there is this route, otherwise it would be a very easy way for any number of women to come to the UK. Simply have a baby by a man who has a British passport. Presumably, in that case it would work the other way around, I simply could have got my now wife pregnant, and she could have come here without all the massive Idiot spammer we went through to get marriage and spousal visas.

Then it seems, since her first plan is not possible, that her other route is to find someone already here and marry them instead, and she wants to do it as quickly as possible. If this is true, I pity the poor unsuspecting sap who thinks he has found true love.

Could this person be an AI bot, sending in posts to wind people up?

secret.simon
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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by secret.simon » Fri May 19, 2023 12:44 pm

@THO, this was in the news just a few days ago.

BBC News: UK men offered £10K to pose as dads in visa scam, BBC investigation finds
THO wrote:
Fri May 19, 2023 10:41 am
Presumably, in that case it would work the other way around, I simply could have got my now wife pregnant, and she could have come here without all the massive Idiot spammer we went through to get marriage and spousal visas.
I think there is a specific prohibition for a person who can apply for both a partner and a parent visa to apply for the latter. They are required to apply for a partner visa, meeting all those requirements.
I am not a lawyer or immigration advisor. My statements/comments do not constitute legal advice. E&OE. Please do not PM me for advice.

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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by JB007 » Fri May 19, 2023 1:47 pm

secret.simon wrote:
Fri May 19, 2023 12:44 pm
@THO, this was in the news just a few days ago.

BBC News: UK men offered £10K to pose as dads in visa scam, BBC investigation finds
I saw that and wondered how long it will be before we see these using that scam on here; calling themselves "victims".

TandT
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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by TandT » Wed May 31, 2023 1:10 am

Frontier Mole wrote:
Thu May 18, 2023 4:52 pm
Has the father agreed formally to cede sole responsibility to the mother? Is there a legal document that sets that out?

Is the father normally resident in the U.K.?

Has the child been issued with a U.K. passport?
Answers to all your questions.

1, There are no legal documents on that but just verbal agreement between the two.

2, Yes, he does.

3, The child had been issued a British passport.

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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by TandT » Wed May 31, 2023 1:15 am

JB007 wrote:
Fri May 19, 2023 1:47 pm
secret.simon wrote:
Fri May 19, 2023 12:44 pm
@THO, this was in the news just a few days ago.

BBC News: UK men offered £10K to pose as dads in visa scam, BBC investigation finds
I saw that and wondered how long it will be before we see these using that scam on here; calling themselves "victims".
PLEASE, MAKING THIS TYPE OF YOUR COMMENT IS NOT A WISE ONE BECAUSE NOT EVERY SITUATION IS A SCAM. AT LEAST THERE ARE SO MANY WAYS THE AUTHORITY CAN CHCEK THE GENUINETY OF PEOPLE'S CASES.

blondesafari
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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by blondesafari » Wed May 31, 2023 6:43 am

TandT wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 1:15 am
JB007 wrote:
Fri May 19, 2023 1:47 pm
secret.simon wrote:
Fri May 19, 2023 12:44 pm
@THO, this was in the news just a few days ago.

BBC News: UK men offered £10K to pose as dads in visa scam, BBC investigation finds
I saw that and wondered how long it will be before we see these using that scam on here; calling themselves "victims".
PLEASE, MAKING THIS TYPE OF YOUR COMMENT IS NOT A WISE ONE BECAUSE NOT EVERY SITUATION IS A SCAM. AT LEAST THERE ARE SO MANY WAYS THE AUTHORITY CAN CHCEK THE GENUINETY OF PEOPLE'S CASES.
Wow! So rude on a forum that helps people! This certainly is a scam at the moment! Why does your aunt want the British taxpayer to pay for bringing up her child?

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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by THO » Wed May 31, 2023 9:19 am

Just another freeloader, and hopefully one that will not make it to the UK. She so obviously used the man to get pregnant and conceive a baby that has a UK passport, is a despicable to bring a child into the World. And then to admit if she can't get a passport through the baby, perhaps she can find and marry a man in the UK to get one that way just beggars belief and it screams fraud.

secret.simon
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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by secret.simon » Wed May 31, 2023 2:15 pm

TandT wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 1:10 am
1, There are no legal documents on that but just verbal agreement between the two.
A verbal agreement is not worth the paper it is written on.

You may want to get something in writing, ideally in a court judgment.
I am not a lawyer or immigration advisor. My statements/comments do not constitute legal advice. E&OE. Please do not PM me for advice.

TandT
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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by TandT » Fri Jun 16, 2023 2:32 am

blondesafari wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 6:43 am
TandT wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 1:15 am
JB007 wrote:
Fri May 19, 2023 1:47 pm
secret.simon wrote:
Fri May 19, 2023 12:44 pm
@THO, this was in the news just a few days ago.

BBC News: UK men offered £10K to pose as dads in visa scam, BBC investigation finds
I saw that and wondered how long it will be before we see these using that scam on here; calling themselves "victims".
PLEASE, MAKING THIS TYPE OF YOUR COMMENT IS NOT A WISE ONE BECAUSE NOT EVERY SITUATION IS A SCAM. AT LEAST THERE ARE SO MANY WAYS THE AUTHORITY CAN CHCEK THE GENUINETY OF PEOPLE'S CASES.
Wow! So rude on a forum that helps people! This certainly is a scam at the moment! Why does your aunt want the British taxpayer to pay for bringing up her child?
THE AUTHORITY IS VERY SMART THAN YOU THE GHOST WRITER. THEY INVESTIGATE BEFORE MAKING THEIR DECISION BUT PEOPLE LIKE YOU ARE NOT FIT TO WORK IN SUCH PLACES BECAUSE OF YOUR LACK OF IGNORANCE AND POOR JUDGMENT.

TandT
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Re: Mother with Sole Responsibility

Post by TandT » Fri Jun 16, 2023 2:37 am

secret.simon wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 2:15 pm
TandT wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 1:10 am
1, There are no legal documents on that but just verbal agreement between the two.
A verbal agreement is not worth the paper it is written on.

You may want to get something in writing, ideally in a court judgment.
God will bless you and increase you with good knowledge and wisdom. The lawyer has already taken up the case and requested for court judgment paperwork on that. But I will do the groundwork to locate him here in the UK at all cost.

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