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EEA (PR) REFUSED then ILR (LR) REFUSED now APPEAL IN PROCESS

Only for queries regarding Indefinite Leave to Remain (ILR). Please use the EEA-route section for queries about the EEA-route settled status under Appendix EU (EU settlement scheme)

Moderators: Casa, JAJ, ca.funke, Amber, Zimba, vinny, Obie, EUsmileWEallsmile, batleykhan, geriatrix, John, ChetanOjha, archigabe, push

hrak1978
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URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by hrak1978 » Wed Jul 05, 2017 10:49 pm

Evening Genious People,

I have been visiting this gigantic place of updated information. I am having extreme problem and have questions if i can get help from all.

My visa history:

Came to uk in 2005 on student visa which i extended 3 times until 2011.
My dad came from Spain he retired there and then on pension from June 2010. I applied for eea 2 as family member which i got it on appeal and valid until july 2016. My age was 30 at that time but as i was single so my solicitor said yes you can get it. And in first hearing my appeal was allowed.

Got married in 2014 and wife got visa in just 22 days from pakistan as an EFM.

I didn't apply for 10 year in 2015 due to my sickness but i was self employed and earning well. More than my dad. My eea pr refused as i was earning more in feb 2017 and was given appeal right.

I appealed in time and during the time scale i applied for 10 year long resident. And had enrolled biometric again in april. Previous one was in august 2016 relating to eea pr.

My employer had done ECS it came as negative. And the reason is that home office said i applied for this visa after my previous visa expired.

I have seen similar cases here but some of them got ILR and some got no right to work.

Can you please advise if home office is correct and how and should i resign or is it going to effect my ILR?

Your advice in this matter will be valuable for me.

Waiting for your reply.

Many thanks.

Obie
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by Obie » Wed Jul 05, 2017 11:19 pm

The Home Office is wrong to say there is no right to work. The right to work in this instance does not derive from EC law, but from EU law directly.

To succeed under ILR long residence, you will need to meet the same test as a PR application.

FOr present purposes, i think it is safe to say that Home Office was wrong on this occasion.
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

hrak1978
Member of Standing
Posts: 314
Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:21 pm

Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by hrak1978 » Thu Jul 06, 2017 7:30 am

Morning Obie sir,

Much appreciated on advice. Can you please advise any link or any sort of home office referance in this catagory. So that i can provide it to my employer as they are going to terminate me.

One question please:
Did i break my 3c in this case. I.e: eea pr refused and during the appeal i submitted new fresh 10 year LR application and withdraw the appeal too.

Please advise.

Many thanks.

Obie
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by Obie » Thu Jul 06, 2017 8:26 am

You rep should write to UKVI about replacement COA in accordance with their policy and the fact that an appeal against residence card was filed in time.
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

hrak1978
Member of Standing
Posts: 314
Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:21 pm

Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by hrak1978 » Thu Jul 06, 2017 12:16 pm

Hi Again

I requested copy of COA on 20th feb and received it on 25th feb as well valid for 6 months. But my employer have done the ECS again on monday and yesterday it came negative again.

And i had a meeting today with my employer and they have terminated me with immediate effect even i should him COA dated feb.

Please advise as it is tense situation? Should i approach my local MP if he can ask Home office to do something or what do u advise?

Many thanks.

Obie
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by Obie » Thu Jul 06, 2017 12:33 pm

That is wrong and totally unacceptable. You need to threaten Home Office with legal action, and also tell the employer you will take it further.

If it is any comfort, i have never seen a case like yours against home office or employer fail.
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

hrak1978
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by hrak1978 » Thu Jul 06, 2017 3:10 pm

My employer has given me 5 days to appeal against the decision. And told me to speak to the solicitor and he stated that are they going to put you back. As it is home office decision not the company.

I am extremely tensed due to this situation. I got 2 year old boy and wife. So how can i manage all this.

Can you please advise anything official link please? I have been to my local MP and luckily he gave me the time and send an email to home office in front of me. And the MP said home office now taking 4 to 6 weeks in reply even if the email is from member of parliament.

I have done what i can but more can be done in a way if i got something legal. Can you please shed some light on it ??

I will be really grateful.

Obie
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by Obie » Thu Jul 06, 2017 3:17 pm

You need to send a pre-Acton protocol them with a treat to pursue legal action within a specified timeframe. That appears to be the only thing they understand this days.
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

Yopcity1568
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by Yopcity1568 » Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:30 pm

Hello hrak1978,

Sorry to hear about that! The HO tend to do that a lot!!! They did the same to me and stopped me from working after refusing my ILR (LR). Even though I applied before my 5 years EU residence Card expired!!! As a single mum with a child and not working!!! From the 20/04/16 till now I cannot work but thanks God my appeal was allowed on the 29/06/17. I'm now waiting for the HO to appeal or give me my ILR. Trust in God he will sort out everything
Good luck to you

hrak1978
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by hrak1978 » Sat Jul 08, 2017 10:36 am

Hello Yopcity1568,

Good to hear you got it sorted.


I had a long meeting with my solicitor, in ECS which my employer did and the reply from HO was totally wrong. They kept on saying i wasn't issued COA after my visa expired but in fact i got duplicated copy from HO on 25 feb 2017 dated 23 feb which is still valid but HO hasn't updated the system and it result in this.

Now my employer terminated me with immediate effect with 5 days to appeal. I have contacted my local MP and explained to him all. He sent an email on thursday 6th July to HO and ask for details. Lets see what will happen.

Secondly i am waiting for the letter from my employer regarding my termination then i will have 5 days from that day. So i am waiting and preparing myself for the appeal too.

Fingers crossed lets see how it goes. Many thanks for the wishes. Much appreciated.

God bless to you as well.

hrak1978
Member of Standing
Posts: 314
Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:21 pm

Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by hrak1978 » Sat Jul 08, 2017 10:38 am

Hi Guru's,

Need help again please if anyone knows where to write an email or any postal address regarding my ILR (LR)? Does anyone have any email or postal address for UKVI?

Please advise.

Many thanks in advance.

Kindest regards.

Obie
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by Obie » Sat Jul 08, 2017 10:38 am

What has your solicitor done to explain to the Home office that their action is unlawful. Has he sent pre-action protocol?
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

hrak1978
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Posts: 314
Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:21 pm

Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by hrak1978 » Sat Jul 08, 2017 10:45 am

He did Obie sir yesterday, but some of my friends who have gone through this and they kept on saying that I have broken 3C after applying for ILR (LR) during the appeal and withdraw the appeal as well. So i should not work.

Please advise regarding this? Did i break 3C? I am extremely tensed and going to worse situation. Your advise will be really grateful.

Obie
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by Obie » Sat Jul 08, 2017 11:03 am

So long as they are going in the wrong direction, there will be no remedy and home office will take advantage of their ignorance.

There is no section 3C rights. Section 3C applies to people who had leave. You did not have leave as you were residing under European law.

Mentioning section 3C to home office is a clear indication that the person mentioning it don't know what they are doing and appears to have led to this situation.

You right to work derives from EU law and the UK policies to give effect to it and clearly not from section 3C.

It is a shame that those representing you, did not appreciate that.
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

hrak1978
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Posts: 314
Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:21 pm

Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by hrak1978 » Sat Jul 08, 2017 11:17 am

Dear Obie,

Much appreciated for the explanation it has given me air to breath. I am layman in this field, I don't have any experience in this field that's why i was asking about it. And you are absolutely correct there are many people out there who are giving wrong information about which they don't know.

My solicitor have sent the pre action protocol. I was asking for the address of UKVI from my solicitor where i have sent my ILR (LR) but he was extremely busy and told me later on.

Any email or postal address if you can suggest please so that i can send an email too, what do you advise regarding this?

Much appreciated again sir.

Your guidance is like an Spam for me.

Obie
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by Obie » Sat Jul 08, 2017 11:26 am

One can only hope that your solicitor did not mention Section 3C, otherwise you are likely to receive another refusal.

It should be posted to Middlesex, or the PAP email.
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

hrak1978
Member of Standing
Posts: 314
Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:21 pm

Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by hrak1978 » Mon Jul 10, 2017 5:11 pm

Hi Obie and other Senior members,

I just came back from my solicitor and saw the pre action protocol documents which he sent to HO and he told me that he knew that clearly as he should not mention section 3c. So its a relief for me too.

Secondly can i post my ECS result here which my employer have done it so that you can have a look. As you advise perfectly clear and accurate until for that i am extremely grateful to you.

I have also spoken to HO help line and explained my situation and she told me that i should contact European HO help line as my right to work relating to EU law which Mr Obie told me previously and ask for the letter so i phoned the help line and she gave me an email where i have to request a COA. She said you will get it hopefully in 3 to 5 working days.

Please advise should i send an email to them?

Many thanks.

hrak1978
Member of Standing
Posts: 314
Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:21 pm

Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by hrak1978 » Thu Jul 13, 2017 10:34 am

Dear Senior guru's,

I think Obie sir is busy. I have one question can anyone from senior member send me any official link regarding right to work derived from EU directly if you read the whole thread? My solicitor is asking for too much money for appeal against my termination in the company.
I can't afford that so trying to write an appeal as i got only 4 days left to appeal against my termination.

I will be really grateful for that.

Much appreciated.

Regards,

Obie
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by Obie » Fri Jul 14, 2017 11:20 am

I am not sure why your solicitor has not pursued this matter fully. if you lose your job, i wonder how you can pay his legal fees.

I doubt that the ILR application will succeed, as the same test applied to EU regulation PR is applicable to ILR under the long residence.

I am really not sure what is happening in your case.

I understand that UKVI are taking long to issue COA, but when challenged they have issued it within days, if a threat of JR is made against them.

If you are dismissed, which will be unfortunate, the only option will be a claim for unlawful dismissal.
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

hrak1978
Member of Standing
Posts: 314
Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:21 pm

Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by hrak1978 » Fri Jul 14, 2017 7:41 pm

Dear Obie,

The ECS was negative because what happened is UKVI mentioned the same case ref on ILR application which was on EEA PR. So they conducted 2 ECS both came as negative.

I phoned today to HO and told them the whole story he advised to use royal mail tracking number for ECS. This is the one when i submitted my ILR application and he said it will definitely show your current status.

My employer have conducted ECS and hopefully result will come in next week. I spoke to my manager he said he will hold the dismissal letter until the outcome of ECS so fingers cross.

Please advise as you are saying 'i doubt that the ILR application will succeed'. Can you please elaborate?

Many thanks.

Obie
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by Obie » Fri Jul 14, 2017 7:57 pm

Well the explanation given does not make much sense to me, as ECS checks are not done by royal mail tracker. It is done with your Home Office details, or you name, nationality and date of birth. Therefore the notion that the postal tracker you used caused issues is for the birds.

RE ILR: The policy says they can only take period spent under the regulation, if those period was spent under EU law terms. Therefore the permit alone will not suffice. You will need to demonstrate you were a dependent family member, if you need ILR.

I hope that make sense.
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

hrak1978
Member of Standing
Posts: 314
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by hrak1978 » Fri Jul 14, 2017 11:26 pm

Home Office adviser told me after putting me on hold. He spoke to his senior member on the floor. He informed with bold words YES royal mail tracking number does work 100%.
Later after an hour I phoned one of my friend who has gone through this situation. He told me the same thing that he uses royal mail tracking number on ECS and it worked.

So lets see how my ECS goes. I think by maximum tuesday i will get a reply.

hrak1978
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by hrak1978 » Mon Jul 24, 2017 8:39 pm

Hi Obie

Does UKVI issue acknowledgement letter after submitting ILR(LR)?

Or any solution please?

Obie
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by Obie » Mon Jul 24, 2017 8:51 pm

I am not sure i have anything to add, beyond that which i have already written.

If you apply for anything, i would have thought you will get an acknowledgement or biometric.

As i said, your ILR application confer no right to work as you never had a Section 3C right.
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

hrak1978
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Re: URGENT HELP NEEDED(ILR LR, EEA PR AND RIGHT TO WORK)

Post by hrak1978 » Mon Jul 24, 2017 11:00 pm

Dear Obie

You mean i do have the right to work as it was derived from EU law directly? Please can you send me any official guideline or link to mention all this so that i can detailed it in my appeal.

Also i want to update i got biometric letter on 27th april which i enrolled on the same day but never received any acknowledgement after that.

Please if you can help regarding the link.

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