ESC

Click the "allow" button if you want to receive important news and updates from immigrationboards.com


Immigrationboards.com: Immigration, work visa and work permit discussion board

Welcome to immigrationboards.com!

Login Register Do not show

Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Forum to discuss all things Blarney | Ireland immigration

Moderators: Casa, JAJ, ca.funke, Amber, Zimba, vinny, Obie, EUsmileWEallsmile, batleykhan, geriatrix, John, ChetanOjha, archigabe, push, Administrator

Dub23
Newly Registered
Posts: 29
Joined: Tue Aug 04, 2020 12:40 pm
Ireland

Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by Dub23 » Wed Oct 21, 2020 2:43 pm

Hi All,

In the timelines thread there is a Second Letter step.

I am looking to get some insights on the content of this letter. From the comments in the timelines thread there seems to be various different versions of this letter that goes out to applicants.

I submitted my application in June 2020 and when I got my passport back, 2 months later, I also got a receipt of payment and also an application reference number. Does this count as the Second Letter?

What was stated/ mentioned in your Second Letter?

Thanks

Vorona
- thin ice -
Posts: 471
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 6:34 pm
Ireland

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by Vorona » Wed Oct 21, 2020 3:23 pm

In most cases it is just a general notice of further development of the application. Here's how to understand if it's a first letter or a second:

If you haven't received any letters before, it will be your first letter. If you have, it will be the second :mrgreen:

littlerr
Diamond Member
Posts: 1778
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2018 12:14 pm
China

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by littlerr » Wed Oct 21, 2020 3:50 pm

It is not the actual ‘second’ letter. It is short for ‘second-stage letter’. The letter will clearly say that ‘your application has been moved to the second stage’.

It used to be your second letter too, but nowadays more and more people would receive more than 2 letters before their applications can be moved to second stage, so some of them have interpreted it incorrectly.

Dub23
Newly Registered
Posts: 29
Joined: Tue Aug 04, 2020 12:40 pm
Ireland

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by Dub23 » Wed Oct 21, 2020 7:35 pm

Thanks for the replies. :-)

SamH
Newly Registered
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 12:18 pm
Australia

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by SamH » Tue Dec 22, 2020 12:34 pm

Hi Dub23,

I see you've received your second/second-stage letter.

Would you mind letting us know what it said - did it specifically say "second stage" of the process?

Just interested as my (straightforward, based on marriage to an Irish citizen) application was submitted in March, and I haven't had a second letter as yet.

Perhaps your application is even more straightforward?!

Cheers

CroUK
BANNED
Posts: 29
Joined: Fri Oct 16, 2020 5:03 pm
Pitcairn Island

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by CroUK » Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:16 pm

Maybe you should follow this thread.

ireland/citizenship-application-process ... 73543.html

sugeie
Junior Member
Posts: 60
Joined: Thu Feb 27, 2020 6:28 am
Ghana

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by sugeie » Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:43 pm

littlerr wrote:
Wed Oct 21, 2020 3:50 pm
It is not the actual ‘second’ letter. It is short for ‘second-stage letter’. The letter will clearly say that ‘your application has been moved to the second stage’.

It used to be your second letter too, but nowadays more and more people would receive more than 2 letters before their applications can be moved to second stage, so some of them have interpreted it incorrectly.
Ill just chime in here. like everyone said, the second letter is actually the letter letting you know your application has progressed to the second stage. however not every second stage letter says explicitly that it has progressed to the second stage. I and my sister made applications as the same time, we both got our second stage letters. Our letters were virtually identical in stating that our applications were now being processed with a view to establishing whether you meet statutory conditions for granting of naturalisation and will be submitted to the minister for decision. The only sentence in hers that wasn't in mine was that
"Your application has now been initially accessed and has proceeded to the second stage of processing" .So while i was wasn't explicitly told my application has progressed to the second stage, the letter basically described the process to me.

Dub23
Newly Registered
Posts: 29
Joined: Tue Aug 04, 2020 12:40 pm
Ireland

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by Dub23 » Tue Dec 22, 2020 5:31 pm

SamH wrote:
Tue Dec 22, 2020 12:34 pm
Hi Dub23,

I see you've received your second/second-stage letter.

Would you mind letting us know what it said - did it specifically say "second stage" of the process?

Just interested as my (straightforward, based on marriage to an Irish citizen) application was submitted in March, and I haven't had a second letter as yet.

Perhaps your application is even more straightforward?!

Cheers
Hi Sam,

Here are the first three paragraphs:

“I am directed by the Minister for Justice to refer to your application for naturalisation.

Your application is being processed with a view to establishing whether you meet the statutory conditions for the granting of naturalisation and will be submitted to the Minister for decision as expeditiously as possible as soon as our enquiries are complete and all required documents has been compiled.

In general, it takes approximately 12 months for a straightforward application to be processed from the date it is received to the date a decision is made.”

I hope this helps.

SamH
Newly Registered
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 12:18 pm
Australia

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by SamH » Wed Dec 23, 2020 9:56 am

Many thanks Dub23 and sugeie!

The process sounds perfectly clear and consistent :roll:

Vorona
- thin ice -
Posts: 471
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 6:34 pm
Ireland

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by Vorona » Thu Dec 24, 2020 5:31 pm

Got my second letter yesterday.
Here's the content:

https://ibb.co/2N4w9ZH

Julio_Tebenado
Newly Registered
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri Nov 06, 2020 3:01 pm
Cuba

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by Julio_Tebenado » Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:33 pm

Vorona wrote:
Thu Dec 24, 2020 5:31 pm
Got my second letter yesterday.
Here's the content:

https://ibb.co/2N4w9ZH
I believed I haven't received the second letter at all, but from your scan I see that it's actually exactly what I received together with my passport when it was returned after the submission of my application.

Vorona
- thin ice -
Posts: 471
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 6:34 pm
Ireland

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by Vorona » Mon Dec 28, 2020 8:19 pm

Julio_Tebenado wrote:
Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:33 pm
I believed I haven't received the second letter at all, but from your scan I see that it's actually exactly what I received together with my passport when it was returned after the submission of my application.
You've probably received a wrong letter. My first one is just an acknowledgement of the application being received. You might get the same letter again as the second letter. It seems like there's no strict order and letters may differ from case to case.

I understood from my second letter that inquiries to check my criminal background are to be made. If I don't get a request for more documents, then the application will be be submitted to the Minister and I will be informed about the outcome.

Martin74
Newly Registered
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2020 10:56 am
Germany

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by Martin74 » Tue Dec 29, 2020 6:41 am

Vorona wrote:
Mon Dec 28, 2020 8:19 pm
by Vorona » Mon Dec 28, 2020 8:19 pm

Julio_Tebenado wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:33 pm
I believed I haven't received the second letter at all, but from your scan I see that it's actually exactly what I received together with my passport when it was returned after the submission of my application.
You've probably received a wrong letter. My first one is just an acknowledgement of the application being received. You might get the same letter again as the second letter. It seems like there's no strict order and letters may differ from case to case.

I understood from my second letter that inquiries to check my criminal background are to be made. If I don't get a request for more documents, then the application will be be submitted to the Minister and I will be informed about the outcome.
Exactly the same thing happened to me. The second letter I’ve received four months after the first one, is the same as the acknowledgement letter which was sent to me when my passports were returned, except the sentence that says that they’re returnig my passports. The same template was used twice and it is that one Vorona received recently.

I emailed them asking if this possibly was a mistake, here is the answer:
Dear Martin
Thank you for your email. Please note we do not require any further
documentation from you currently. Your application has well advanced in the
process.

Regards

Citizenship Helpdesk
Team 4

Citizenship Info
Mail-In Query
Btw, I thought, requesting the Garda vetting is the first thing they do when the appllication process starts? Not that I’m any hurry at all being an EU citizen but the non consistency in the process is quite annoying :wink:

johnpromise01
Member
Posts: 226
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2019 10:39 am
Ireland

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by johnpromise01 » Tue Dec 29, 2020 9:12 am

Vorona wrote:
Mon Dec 28, 2020 8:19 pm
Julio_Tebenado wrote:
Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:33 pm
I believed I haven't received the second letter at all, but from your scan I see that it's actually exactly what I received together with my passport when it was returned after the submission of my application.
You've probably received a wrong letter. My first one is just an acknowledgement of the application being received. You might get the same letter again as the second letter. It seems like there's no strict order and letters may differ from case to case.

I understood from my second letter that inquiries to check my criminal background are to be made. If I don't get a request for more documents, then the application will be be submitted to the Minister and I will be informed about the outcome.
I received my second letter in June and the letter clearly stated: ''Your application has now been initially assessed and has proceeded to the second stage of processing''

Vorona
- thin ice -
Posts: 471
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 6:34 pm
Ireland

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by Vorona » Tue Dec 29, 2020 2:59 pm

Criminal background checks are conducted during the second stage of processing.
The wording may differ, some letters will contain a phrase about second stage, some don't. It's normal, people are sent both variants.
I applied on the basis of residency, however sent my application to the CMU1 because my husband is Irish. Both letters came from CMU1.

zigandzag
Newly Registered
Posts: 13
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2021 12:56 pm
Australia

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by zigandzag » Thu Jan 07, 2021 1:08 pm

@Vorona
You say you applied via the 5 year standard non-EEA route despite being married to an Irish citizen.
I will do the same and thanks to you will send in my application to CMU1 so. That's OK right?

Sorry to hijack but you could answer below I'd really appreciate it.

Did you leave section 12 blank....? (Irish associations?)

I've also read from a NASC or Migrant Council FAQ pdf that when a spouse of Irish citizen applies via the standard 5-year route, the applicant should fill in 13.1 and 13.2 as NO, and then leave 13.3/4/5 blank.
Is that what you did?

I just can't get access to a lot of marriage docs now what with Covid etc. and so just want to apply on my own bat....but was there any issue from INIS as to why you didn't apply via the spouse route?

Thanks in advance.

Vorona
- thin ice -
Posts: 471
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 6:34 pm
Ireland

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by Vorona » Thu Jan 07, 2021 1:45 pm

Hi Zigandzag. That's right. I have applied on the basis of having enough residency, but sent my application to the CMU1. However I do not recommend to do that unless your application is based on marriage. I probably misunderstood the guidelines because I thought it was for anyone who is married to Irish citizens. They may have made an exception and accepted it since a lot of document were provided.

I put "Not applicable" into Irish association and replied "No" to questions 13.1 and 13.2, but filled out details about marriage and gave them certified copies of marriage certificate and my husband's FBR certificate.

There wasn't any issue. It didn't matter to me as I was qualified to apply on the basis of both marriage and residency.

zigandzag
Newly Registered
Posts: 13
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2021 12:56 pm
Australia

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by zigandzag » Thu Jan 07, 2021 2:13 pm

Thanks. So it really should be send it to CMU2 so. They should change the wording heh.

Also, that 13.3/4/5 part is confusing, isn't it, but as I say, it seems you don't have to fill it in if not a spousal application. https://www.newcommunities.ie/assets/fi ... july_4.pdf (p40)

No flags by doing it that way anyway I hope. It's just easier to get all the documentation for one. :-)

SamH
Newly Registered
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 12:18 pm
Australia

Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

Post by SamH » Thu Jan 07, 2021 3:12 pm

Hi all,

Received a "second" letter today (dated 19/11/2020, which was crossed out and hand-dated 5/1/2021), with what I thought was a strange request - a copy of my spouse's passport.

Then realised that I hadn't included a copy with my original application based on marriage to an Irish citizen submitted in March - and had a look at the application form to see where it was requested.

The only place in the form I could find it was in the introductory notes:

4. If your application is based on marriage to or being the civil partner of an Irish citizen:
Note, you must be married / in a civil partnership to the Irish citizen for not less than 3 years, and
be living together at the date of making an application and have the required residency in the
island of Ireland (see below).
    Documentary proof of Irish spouse’s/civil partner’s entitlement to Irish citizenship
    (certified copy of Irish spouse’s/civil partner’s birth certificate if born in Ireland / certified
    copy of foreign birth register entry / spouse’s or civil partner’s parent’s birth certificate if
    latter was born in Ireland / certified copy of naturalisation certificate / certified copy of
    passport page with photograph
    ).

    I thought that an Irish birth certificate would be enough to fulfil this requirement, but obviously not.

    Just thought I'd pass this on for anyone who's getting their application ready.

    I suppose it's also good that there's "movement" in the processing department...!

    Cheers

    Shakey
    Newbie
    Posts: 41
    Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2016 1:42 pm

    Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

    Post by Shakey » Thu Jan 07, 2021 6:22 pm

    I had a similar request to "show evidence of your mothers entitlement to Irish citizenship"

    I had sent her passport bio page and her FBR certificate as well as all relevant birth/marriage death certificates. Not entirely sure what further proof they want!

    Vorona
    - thin ice -
    Posts: 471
    Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 6:34 pm
    Ireland

    Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

    Post by Vorona » Fri Jan 08, 2021 6:29 pm

    zigandzag wrote:
    Thu Jan 07, 2021 2:13 pm
    Thanks. So it really should be send it to CMU2 so. They should change the wording heh.

    Also, that 13.3/4/5 part is confusing, isn't it, but as I say, it seems you don't have to fill it in if not a spousal application. https://www.newcommunities.ie/assets/fi ... july_4.pdf (p40)
    Yes, CMU2 is the correct section.

    As for questions 13.3, 13.4 and 13.5, fill them in if you're married to an Irish person, and answer "No" to question 13.1 if you want to apply on basis of having enough residency. Otherwise, if you answer "Yes" you will have to give them all relevant documents. However I advise you to obtain your marriage certificate and your husband/wife's proof of Irish citizenship before applying, because it's possible that you will be asked to provide them later anyway.

    Pretty-good unofficial guideline, I didn't know it existed.

    chad
    Newly Registered
    Posts: 7
    Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2021 5:33 pm
    Ireland

    Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

    Post by chad » Tue Jan 12, 2021 5:43 pm

    Hi Vorona, when did you send your application? how long did it take them to send this lettter?

    raja.brit
    Member of Standing
    Posts: 309
    Joined: Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:26 pm
    Jamaica

    Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

    Post by raja.brit » Tue Jan 12, 2021 5:45 pm

    chad wrote:
    Tue Jan 12, 2021 5:43 pm
    Hi Vorona, when did you send your application? how long did it take them to send this lettter?
    ireland/2020-citizenship-applications-t ... l#p1980180

    chad
    Newly Registered
    Posts: 7
    Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2021 5:33 pm
    Ireland

    Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

    Post by chad » Tue Jan 12, 2021 5:45 pm

    Hi, how long did it take to get the second stage letter? Have you received anything since June after the second stage letter? Thanks

    raja.brit
    Member of Standing
    Posts: 309
    Joined: Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:26 pm
    Jamaica

    Re: Citizenship Applications - Content of Second Letter

    Post by raja.brit » Tue Jan 12, 2021 5:52 pm

    chad wrote:
    Tue Jan 12, 2021 5:45 pm
    Hi, how long did it take to get the second stage letter? Have you received anything since June after the second stage letter? Thanks
    Did you even look at Vorona's timeline she has posted in the link I shared which answers your questions?

    Locked
    cron