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Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

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Emu1990
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Emu1990 » Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:04 pm

Hello guys .I want to apply to FOI before going for JR .. my question is what information I gona get from FOI .. like in January they sent me a email that my application has being submitted to minister for decision but I don't trust their email ..Does FOI record tells u that ur application has being submitted..if it does than I will wait few months before going for JR.

polarcub
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by polarcub » Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:42 pm

Their email updates are not official. It's just a copy and paste response, it doesn't mean anything. Some people have received this response, did an FOI, only to find their application is still processing and no one has touched it to move it forward to the next stage in months (and in some cases 1+ years). There are many threads on this.

My understanding is that an FOI tells you what they have 'actually' done with your application and where it's sitting in the process (i.e. still processing, waiting for documents, waiting for clearance, waiting for minister to sign of etc). Does any one who got an FOI have anything to add to this?
Emu1990 wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:04 pm
Hello guys .I want to apply to FOI before going for JR .. my question is what information I gona get from FOI .. like in January they sent me a email that my application has being submitted to minister for decision but I don't trust their email ..Does FOI record tells u that ur application has being submitted..if it does than I will wait few months before going for JR.

polarcub
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by polarcub » Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:54 pm

This is one thread where someone outlines what they found in their FOI report: ireland/citizenship-application-process ... 73543.html

Emu1990
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Emu1990 » Wed Feb 10, 2021 8:34 pm

polarcub wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:54 pm
This is one thread where someone outlines what they found in their FOI report: ireland/citizenship-application-process ... 73543.html
@polarcub thank u .. I am applying for FOI tomarrow..

polarcub
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by polarcub » Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:45 pm

Make sure to specify in your application request that the FOI documents be sent to you via email not post.
Emu1990 wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 8:34 pm
polarcub wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:54 pm
This is one thread where someone outlines what they found in their FOI report: ireland/citizenship-application-process ... 73543.html
@polarcub thank u .. I am applying for FOI tomarrow..

Emu1990
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Posts: 36
Joined: Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:30 pm
Ireland

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Emu1990 » Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:28 pm

polarcub wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:45 pm
Make sure to specify in your application request that the FOI documents be sent to you via email not post.
Emu1990 wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 8:34 pm
polarcub wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:54 pm
This is one thread where someone outlines what they found in their FOI report: ireland/citizenship-application-process ... 73543.html
@polarcub thank u .. I am applying for FOI tomarrow..


Why not post ?

Shelter
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Pakistan

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Shelter » Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:00 pm

I applied for FOI 5 weeks ago today I made an enquiry about it

This reply I got


Dear,



I wish to acknowledge receipt of your email below. I have been in contact with the decision maker who has informed me that you are automatically entitled to appeal to this Department for a review of your request on the legal basis that the initial request was refused once the specified time for responding to it has expired. The review is a full and new consideration of the matter carried out by a more senior member of staff of this Department.

Should you want to make such an appeal, you can do so in writing, you should state that you are appealing because an initial decision was not sent to you within the time permitted.

I apologise for any inconvenience caused by this delay.

Regards


Transparency Coordination


Any idea guys ??

Vorona
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Vorona » Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:07 pm

Shelter wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:00 pm
Any idea guys ??
If you explain properly what happened.
Shelter wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:00 pm
I applied for FOI 5 weeks ago today I made an enquiry about it

Shelter
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Posts: 65
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Pakistan

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Shelter » Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:16 pm

Vorona wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:07 pm
Shelter wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:00 pm
Any idea guys ??
If you explain properly what happened.
Shelter wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:00 pm
I applied for FOI 5 weeks ago today I made an enquiry about it
I applied for FOI for my citizenship application last month... I should get ROI records back in 4 weeks ..but I dint get anything so I emailed them today to ask about it ..they sent me this email replay ...

Dear ,



I wish to acknowledge receipt of your email below. I have been in contact with the decision maker who has informed that you are automatically entitled to appeal to this Department for a review of your request on the legal basis that the initial request was refused once the specified time for responding to it has expired. The review is a full and new consideration of the matter carried out by a more senior member of staff of this Department.

Should you want to make such an appeal, you can do so in writing, you should state that you are appealing because an initial decision was not sent to you within the time permitted.

I apologise for any inconvenience caused by this delay.

Regards



Transparency Coordination

Vorona
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Vorona » Mon Feb 22, 2021 7:17 pm

Shelter wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:16 pm
I applied for FOI for my citizenship application last month... I should get ROI records back in 4 weeks ..but I dint get anything so I emailed them today to ask about it ..they sent me this email replay ...
Did you get a response saying that your request has been denied?
If not, then just wait. Everything is slow during COVID, your file will be sent to you as soon as possible.

It looks like the person who replied with the above was under impression that you think that your request was refused and advised your to file a complaint.
Just wait.

Shelter
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Pakistan

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Shelter » Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:26 pm

Vorona wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 7:17 pm
Shelter wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:16 pm
I applied for FOI for my citizenship application last month... I should get ROI records back in 4 weeks ..but I dint get anything so I emailed them today to ask about it ..they sent me this email replay ...
Did you get a response saying that your request has been denied?
If not, then just wait. Everything is slow during COVID, your file will be sent to you as soon as possible.

It looks like the person who replied with the above was under impression that you think that your request was refused and advised your to file a complaint.
Just wait.
Ok thanks vorona ... I will wait 2 weeks more ...

Akeel
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Akeel » Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:37 pm

polarcub wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 1:23 am
No problem!

On a related note: I've noticed people have different theories about how long one should wait before going through the courts to force a decision - I've seen everything thrown out 4, 3, 2, 1.5 (years) etc... This all seems like a personal preference as opposed to what the courts favour. From my understanding you can take your case to court once your application has exceeded the amount of time the department has advised. At the moment they are telling everyone it'll take 1 year (except for the people who applied during the pandemic). Therefore theoretically, after 1 year you can start the process.

For the people who have gone through the courts - have your lawyers made any comments regarding how long one should wait before making a case?
Hi, my solicitor told me he is only going for judicial review after 2 years of waiting. He already got 11 people decisions within 6 weeks of process.

polarcub
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by polarcub » Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:58 pm

This means that someone was assigned to make a decision on your request within the time frame they gave you. That person did not respond, so it's assumed that the decision did not go through. So you have ONE option - ask them to review the decision as to why you did not get a decision by the decision maker.

**if you requested the documents to be sent to you via post, that may be why your request wasn't handled. If that was the case, tell them you want everything sent to you via email instead.
Shelter wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:00 pm
I applied for FOI 5 weeks ago today I made an enquiry about it

This reply I got


Dear,



I wish to acknowledge receipt of your email below. I have been in contact with the decision maker who has informed me that you are automatically entitled to appeal to this Department for a review of your request on the legal basis that the initial request was refused once the specified time for responding to it has expired. The review is a full and new consideration of the matter carried out by a more senior member of staff of this Department.

Should you want to make such an appeal, you can do so in writing, you should state that you are appealing because an initial decision was not sent to you within the time permitted.

I apologise for any inconvenience caused by this delay.

Regards


Transparency Coordination


Any idea guys ??

polarcub
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by polarcub » Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:59 pm

Thanks for sharing. The 11 people they got an approval? And have you started your JR?
Akeel wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:37 pm
polarcub wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 1:23 am
No problem!

On a related note: I've noticed people have different theories about how long one should wait before going through the courts to force a decision - I've seen everything thrown out 4, 3, 2, 1.5 (years) etc... This all seems like a personal preference as opposed to what the courts favour. From my understanding you can take your case to court once your application has exceeded the amount of time the department has advised. At the moment they are telling everyone it'll take 1 year (except for the people who applied during the pandemic). Therefore theoretically, after 1 year you can start the process.

For the people who have gone through the courts - have your lawyers made any comments regarding how long one should wait before making a case?
Hi, my solicitor told me he is only going for judicial review after 2 years of waiting. He already got 11 people decisions within 6 weeks of process.

polarcub
Member
Posts: 104
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 4:20 am
Mood:
Ireland

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by polarcub » Tue Feb 23, 2021 12:01 am

Post will likely get refused or will be heavily delayed.

If you already sent in the application and ticked the "send by post" checkbox, you can just just email them and tell them you now prefer email.


Emu1990 wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:28 pm
polarcub wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:45 pm
Make sure to specify in your application request that the FOI documents be sent to you via email not post.
Emu1990 wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 8:34 pm
polarcub wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:54 pm
This is one thread where someone outlines what they found in their FOI report: ireland/citizenship-application-process ... 73543.html
@polarcub thank u .. I am applying for FOI tomarrow..


Why not post ?

Vorona
- thin ice -
Posts: 501
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 6:34 pm
Ireland

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Vorona » Tue Feb 23, 2021 12:12 am

Shelter wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:26 pm
Ok thanks vorona ... I will wait 2 weeks more ...
No problem.
You may have to wait longer. When I requested a copy of my file last year (it was not for a citizenship, but the process is pretty much the same) I received an acknowledgement that my request was received advising me that due to COVID there will be unexpected delays and that the processing time can be extended up to 60 calendar days.

They must acknowledge your request and give you an average of current waiting time.

Shelter
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Posts: 65
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Pakistan

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Shelter » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:14 am

Yeah average time is within 4 weeks and in some cases could be 5 weeks

Emu1990
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Posts: 36
Joined: Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:30 pm
Ireland

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Emu1990 » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:21 am

polarcub wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 12:01 am
Post will likely get refused or will be heavily delayed.

If you already sent in the application and ticked the "send by post" checkbox, you can just just email them and tell them you now prefer email.


Emu1990 wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:28 pm
polarcub wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:45 pm
Make sure to specify in your application request that the FOI documents be sent to you via email not post.
Emu1990 wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 8:34 pm


@polarcub thank u .. I am applying for FOI tomarrow..


Why not post ?
@polarcub I already applied and requested via email..

Akeel
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Posts: 14
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Pakistan

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Akeel » Wed Feb 24, 2021 10:07 pm

polarcub wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:59 pm
Thanks for sharing. The 11 people they got an approval? And have you started your JR?
Akeel wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:37 pm
polarcub wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 1:23 am
No problem!

On a related note: I've noticed people have different theories about how long one should wait before going through the courts to force a decision - I've seen everything thrown out 4, 3, 2, 1.5 (years) etc... This all seems like a personal preference as opposed to what the courts favour. From my understanding you can take your case to court once your application has exceeded the amount of time the department has advised. At the moment they are telling everyone it'll take 1 year (except for the people who applied during the pandemic). Therefore theoretically, after 1 year you can start the process.

For the people who have gone through the courts - have your lawyers made any comments regarding how long one should wait before making a case?
Hi, my solicitor told me he is only going for judicial review after 2 years of waiting. He already got 11 people decisions within 6 weeks of process.
Yes I did first my solicitor send a notice for decision within 14 days if they didn't gave a decision then he will go for JR.

johnpromise01
Member
Posts: 232
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Ireland

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by johnpromise01 » Thu Feb 25, 2021 11:18 am

Akeel wrote:
Wed Feb 24, 2021 10:07 pm
polarcub wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:59 pm
Thanks for sharing. The 11 people they got an approval? And have you started your JR?
Akeel wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:37 pm
polarcub wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 1:23 am
No problem!

On a related note: I've noticed people have different theories about how long one should wait before going through the courts to force a decision - I've seen everything thrown out 4, 3, 2, 1.5 (years) etc... This all seems like a personal preference as opposed to what the courts favour. From my understanding you can take your case to court once your application has exceeded the amount of time the department has advised. At the moment they are telling everyone it'll take 1 year (except for the people who applied during the pandemic). Therefore theoretically, after 1 year you can start the process.

For the people who have gone through the courts - have your lawyers made any comments regarding how long one should wait before making a case?
Hi, my solicitor told me he is only going for judicial review after 2 years of waiting. He already got 11 people decisions within 6 weeks of process.
Yes I did first my solicitor send a notice for decision within 14 days if they didn't gave a decision then he will go for JR.

How long do you wait before your solicitor initiate JR?

polarcub
Member
Posts: 104
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2020 4:20 am
Mood:
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by polarcub » Fri Feb 26, 2021 2:18 am

How much are your legal fees? and how long ago did you submit your citizenship application?
Akeel wrote:
Wed Feb 24, 2021 10:07 pm
polarcub wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:59 pm
Thanks for sharing. The 11 people they got an approval? And have you started your JR?
Akeel wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:37 pm
polarcub wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 1:23 am
No problem!

On a related note: I've noticed people have different theories about how long one should wait before going through the courts to force a decision - I've seen everything thrown out 4, 3, 2, 1.5 (years) etc... This all seems like a personal preference as opposed to what the courts favour. From my understanding you can take your case to court once your application has exceeded the amount of time the department has advised. At the moment they are telling everyone it'll take 1 year (except for the people who applied during the pandemic). Therefore theoretically, after 1 year you can start the process.

For the people who have gone through the courts - have your lawyers made any comments regarding how long one should wait before making a case?
Hi, my solicitor told me he is only going for judicial review after 2 years of waiting. He already got 11 people decisions within 6 weeks of process.
Yes I did first my solicitor send a notice for decision within 14 days if they didn't gave a decision then he will go for JR.

Akeel
Newly Registered
Posts: 14
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2021 9:10 pm
Pakistan

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Akeel » Fri Feb 26, 2021 7:37 pm

johnpromise01 wrote:
Thu Feb 25, 2021 11:18 am
Akeel wrote:
Wed Feb 24, 2021 10:07 pm
polarcub wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:59 pm
Thanks for sharing. The 11 people they got an approval? And have you started your JR?
Akeel wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:37 pm

Hi, my solicitor told me he is only going for judicial review after 2 years of waiting. He already got 11 people decisions within 6 weeks of process.
Yes I did first my solicitor send a notice for decision within 14 days if they didn't gave a decision then he will go for JR.

How long do you wait before your solicitor initiate JR?
I applied in August 2018 second stage letter may 2019 but still waiting....

Shelter
Junior Member
Posts: 65
Joined: Sun May 24, 2020 11:32 am
Pakistan

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Shelter » Mon Mar 01, 2021 4:45 pm

I got my FOI records today..there is nothing much in it ..most of documents are which I sent them with my application and my email communication with the department ..last thing they did with my application they requested garda vetting on 18th November 2020 and it came back 8th December 2020 .. they have done three time garda vetting since I submitted my application ...I don't know what they waiting for now ..and there is no record about submitted to minister so that's mean email reply I got in January was a lie .. anyway to be honest can't do much about it ..so I have to wait ..

Vorona
- thin ice -
Posts: 501
Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 6:34 pm
Ireland

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Vorona » Mon Mar 01, 2021 5:36 pm

Shelter wrote:
Mon Mar 01, 2021 4:45 pm
they have done three time garda vetting since I submitted my application
How strange. Did you see any requests made to the police in Pakistan or were all three requests made to Garda Siochana only? And what are the time gaps between those requests roughly?

I will probably request mine as well later on, just to see what they have done.

Shelter
Junior Member
Posts: 65
Joined: Sun May 24, 2020 11:32 am
Pakistan

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Shelter » Mon Mar 01, 2021 6:14 pm

Vorona wrote:
Mon Mar 01, 2021 5:36 pm
Shelter wrote:
Mon Mar 01, 2021 4:45 pm
they have done three time garda vetting since I submitted my application
How strange. Did you see any requests made to the police in Pakistan or were all three requests made to Garda Siochana only? And what are the time gaps between those requests roughly?

I will probably request mine as well later on, just to see what they have done.
No they didn't request anything from pakistan's police and why would they 13 years I am here. they should check my rocord here in ireland

First garda vetting 18 Oct 2018 2nd 24th sep 2019 and the last one 18th Nov 2020 ..and no issue with any of the garda vetting ..

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