Foreign Birth Registration

Sulla · Post by **Sulla** » Wed Jun 05, 2019 4:15 am

May 2018 applicants and date FBR applications received / added. All received dates 2018.

Jacqui309 – received May 15th / Pending
Emma86 – received May 30th (Added to FBR November 20th 2018)

June 2018 applicants and date FBR applications received / added. All received dates 2018.

Ben321 – received mid-June / Pending
Cindy – received June 14th / Pending
156Nathan – received June 16h (Added to FBR November 14th 2018)

July 2018 applicants and date FBR applications received / added. All received dates 2018.

Brawn – received July 2nd (Added to FBR March 13th 2019)
Jpauls – received July 12th (Added to FBR November 13th 2018)
BostonCeltics – received July 20th (Added to FBR November 15th 2018)
James_mcfc – received July 25th (Added to FBR November 27th 2018)
Rbs3 – received July 27th (Added to FBR March 26th 2019)
Rdslight – received July 31st (Added to FBR – unknown / Certificate received June 3rd 2019)
Richard – received July 31st (added to FBR December 12th 2019)

August 2018 applicants and date FBR applications received / added. All received dates 2018.

Sean – received August 2nd (Added to FBR December 19th 2018)
Spav – received August 3rd (Added to FBR December 11th 2018)
Amcbamcb – received August 8th (Added to FBR May 17th 2019)
Hol292 – received August 10th / Pending
Sulla – received August 14th (Added to FBR November 28th 2018)
LeifRNR – received August 14th / Pending
Laurie – received August 15th / Pending
Michael – received August 21st / Pending
Upliam _ received August 22nd / Pending
USczkat – received August 23rd / Pending
Pumps100 – received August 29th / Pending
MaddeningBike – received August 30th / Pending
Nydccub – received August 31st / Pending

I have given up on specifying nationalities / place of application. I am well aware that I have probably neglected to mention some people. Apologies in advance for that. Please indicate your timeline and I will include your data. So far, I have only done May – August 2018, expanding the earlier list to give a better idea of waiting times involved. I know there are quite a few September / October applicants. I will get to it.

Sulla · Post by **Sulla** » Wed Jun 05, 2019 4:22 am

Correction to my post above. The editing time had expired. Richard was added to the FBR on December 12th 2018, not 2019.

Michael123 · Post by **Michael123** » Wed Jun 05, 2019 4:25 am

Sulla wrote: ↑
Wed Jun 05, 2019 4:15 am
May 2018 applicants and date FBR applications received / added. All received dates 2018.

Jacqui309 – received May 15th / Pending
Emma86 – received May 30th (Added to FBR November 20th 2018)

June 2018 applicants and date FBR applications received / added. All received dates 2018.

Ben321 – received mid-June / Pending
Cindy – received June 14th / Pending
156Nathan – received June 16h (Added to FBR November 14th 2018)

July 2018 applicants and date FBR applications received / added. All received dates 2018.

Brawn – received July 2nd (Added to FBR March 13th 2019)
Jpauls – received July 12th (Added to FBR November 13th 2018)
BostonCeltics – received July 20th (Added to FBR November 15th 2018)
James_mcfc – received July 25th (Added to FBR November 27th 2018)
Rbs3 – received July 27th (Added to FBR March 26th 2019)
Rdslight – received July 31st (Added to FBR – unknown / Certificate received June 3rd 2019)
Richard – received July 31st (added to FBR December 12th 2019)

August 2018 applicants and date FBR applications received / added. All received dates 2018.

Sean – received August 2nd (Added to FBR December 19th 2018)
Spav – received August 3rd (Added to FBR December 11th 2018)
Amcbamcb – received August 8th (Added to FBR May 17th 2019)
Hol292 – received August 10th / Pending
Sulla – received August 14th (Added to FBR November 28th 2018)
LeifRNR – received August 14th / Pending
Laurie – received August 15th / Pending
Michael – received August 21st / Pending
Upliam _ received August 22nd / Pending
USczkat – received August 23rd / Pending
Pumps100 – received August 29th / Pending
MaddeningBike – received August 30th / Pending
Nydccub – received August 31st / Pending

I have given up on specifying nationalities / place of application. I am well aware that I have probably neglected to mention some people. Apologies in advance for that. Please indicate your timeline and I will include your data. So far, I have only done May – August 2018, expanding the earlier list to give a better idea of waiting times involved. I know there are quite a few September / October applicants. I will get to it.

Not that it matters too much, my cousin Donna competed her online application one week before me and we sent applications in together in the same package. If you wanted to add her name “Donna” recieved email confirmation 8/21/18, that might help.

Pumps100 · Post by **Pumps100** » Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:54 am

Sulla said:

"Pumps100, you said that you anticipate waiting about another 3 weeks having applied on August 29th? I assume you are basing this off the experiences of Rdslight and Rbs3. Though I hope you are right, I would caution you against being so optimistic. "

Fair point well made. I'm extrapolating from a very small dataset excluding no errors or need for any clarifications. At the end of the day it will be what it is. As August 2018 received applicants start to come through it will perhaps provide a firmer indication for prediction (barring summer holidays or any need for clarification)

The process is the process. I do think that DFA should have built into their process a simple first step - in that when submissions are first received the original documents should be checked for sufficiency/responsiveness - and if so, the original docs then returned to the applicant. Then the submission goes forward with the copies into normal processing. It is not rocket science.

Ian

Sulla · Post by **Sulla** » Wed Jun 05, 2019 8:55 am

Pumps100 wrote: ↑
Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:54 am
The process is the process. I do think that DFA should have built into their process a simple first step - in that when submissions are first received the original documents should be checked for sufficiency/responsiveness - and if so, the original docs then returned to the applicant. Then the submission goes forward with the copies into normal processing. It is not rocket science.

I think many of us would like to know what the FBR section actually does with the information and documents provided to them by way of checking and verification. Unfortunately, we just don't know. I agree totally with the view that there should be an initial stage for document assessment, followed by a return of those documents. However, this will add expense to the process as it will double the postage costs.

From my perspective, this is what they do as part of the process. I base this on my experiences with the two CBI processes I have been through in my life and my knowledge of the forthcoming Israeli citizenship by descent (law of return) process which I am planning to begin in the fall.

1) Initial check that all information on the application form is correct and conforms to supporting documents
2) Evaluation of inconsistencies in documents and possible requests for more documents or clarifications
3) Online authentication checks of the certificates against available searchable databases. In England & Wales, Ireland and Scotland these can allow viewing of scans of original certificates. Use of alternative databases for other countries. This may only be done on a random sample of certificates.
4) Assessment of entitlement to citizenship
5) Possible criminal background check based on name, date of birth, address and identification information provided. Checks of outstanding civil judgments are also possible. Ireland certainly checks criminal background for naturalization candidates - via the DOJ. Israel checks criminal background for law of return applicants. All CBI schemes check both criminal and civil background. However, given the low cost of FBR, these checks are probably either cursory or non-existent. It may only be done in a few cases.
6) Granting of citizenship and printing of certificates
7) Postage of certificates and document set back to applicants.

I really don't think there is anything else involved. It's debatable whether they check criminal background, but I think they must even if only at an extremely basic level. Think of the fallout of granting citizenship to known serious criminals. However, it is also possible that such an assessment is done only at the passport issuance stage.

Michael123 · Post by **Michael123** » Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:13 pm

Sulla wrote: ↑
Wed Jun 05, 2019 8:55 am

Pumps100 wrote: ↑
Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:54 am
The process is the process. I do think that DFA should have built into their process a simple first step - in that when submissions are first received the original documents should be checked for sufficiency/responsiveness - and if so, the original docs then returned to the applicant. Then the submission goes forward with the copies into normal processing. It is not rocket science.
I think many of us would like to know what the FBR section actually does with the information and documents provided to them by way of checking and verification. Unfortunately, we just don't know. I agree totally with the view that there should be an initial stage for document assessment, followed by a return of those documents. However, this will add expense to the process as it will double the postage costs.

From my perspective, this is what they do as part of the process. I base this on my experiences with the two CBI processes I have been through in my life and my knowledge of the forthcoming Israeli citizenship by descent (law of return) process which I am planning to begin in the fall.

1) Initial check that all information on the application form is correct and conforms to supporting documents
2) Evaluation of inconsistencies in documents and possible requests for more documents or clarifications
3) Online authentication checks of the certificates against available searchable databases. In England & Wales, Ireland and Scotland these can allow viewing of scans of original certificates. Use of alternative databases for other countries. This may only be done on a random sample of certificates.
4) Assessment of entitlement to citizenship
5) Possible criminal background check based on name, date of birth, address and identification information provided. Checks of outstanding civil judgments are also possible. Ireland certainly checks criminal background for naturalization candidates - via the DOJ. Israel checks criminal background for law of return applicants. All CBI schemes check both criminal and civil background. However, given the low cost of FBR, these checks are probably either cursory or non-existent. It may only be done in a few cases.
6) Granting of citizenship and printing of certificates
7) Postage of certificates and document set back to applicants.

I really don't think there is anything else involved. It's debatable whether they check criminal background, but I think they must even if only at an extremely basic level. Think of the fallout of granting citizenship to known serious criminals. However, it is also possible that such an assessment is done only at the passport issuance stage.

There is not a criminal check. I had asked this previously during a call to Dublin and offered to send my criminal record (no record) if it would speed up the process, as I have access to criminal history records. My original thought for this was that in my state, any person with a license for a firearm will have the firearm license information shown on a criminal record check and being concerned how this would effect my application where handguns are not allowed.

I also called the offices where the birth, death and marriage certificates where issued that are associated with my application to see if Dublin had contacted these offices to verify my certificates that I had submitted, all offices said they have never been contacted to verify anyone’s certificates.

nydccub · Post by **nydccub** » Wed Jun 05, 2019 2:50 pm

I wonder why DFA doesn't require Apostille certificates for all vital records submitted in the FBR application. Doing so would streamline the process by eliminating the need for record authentication.

For those that don’t know, the Apostille Convention is an international treaty specifying that state-issued records issued in one signatory country can be certified for legal purposes in all the other signatory countries. Apostille certificates confirm the authenticity of documents. Ireland signed onto the treaty in 1999 (the UK and US entered in 1965 and 1981, respectively). In total, 119 countries have signed onto the treaty.

I can't speak for other countries, but in America, Apostille certificates can be obtained by the State that issued the documents being certified. Apostille certificates are signed by the Secretary of the State that issued them, are affixed with the seal of the State, and contain a certificate number that can be used to authenticate the Apostille certificates.

I obtained Apostille certificates from the States of New York and Connecticut, and the District of Columbia, for all the relevant American records linking me to my Irish ancestor. They were very straight forward to obtain; I got them in person in New York City and DC, and through the mail from Connecticut. Though they weren’t required in the FBR application, I thought it would reduce the possibility of DFA needing clarification on the records I was submitting.

If DFA are as bogged down as they claim they are, they shouldn’t be wasting time authenticating records when an Apostille certificate can do it for them.

chrisinpm · Post by **chrisinpm** » Wed Jun 05, 2019 5:23 pm

Hello all,

I discovered this site and decided to register and post my own dates of application for FBR.

I sent my application on 21 March from the New York City metro area. I received an email on 28 March 2019 stating that my application had been received and that it would take up to six months to process... though based on posts here, I'm guessing that estimated date is nonsense.

If anyone has any guesses as to what the real processing time would be, I'm all ears.

Michael123 · Post by **Michael123** » Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:01 pm

chrisinpm wrote: ↑
Wed Jun 05, 2019 5:23 pm
Hello all,

I discovered this site and decided to register and post my own dates of application for FBR.

I sent my application on 21 March from the New York City metro area. I received an email on 28 March 2019 stating that my application had been received and that it would take up to six months to process... though based on posts here, I'm guessing that estimated date is nonsense.

If anyone has any guesses as to what the real processing time would be, I'm all ears.

I was told not to expect anything before September, which would make my total time 13 months at minimum.

Sulla · Post by **Sulla** » Wed Jun 05, 2019 11:14 pm

Michael123 wrote: ↑
Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:13 pm
There is not a criminal check.

Thanks for clearing that up. I am not stunned at the lack of a check given the cost involved. I imagine something must be undertaken at the passport stage. I certainly hope it is.

Michael123 wrote: ↑
Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:13 pm
I also called the offices where the birth, death and marriage certificates where issued that are associated with my application to see if Dublin had contacted these offices to verify my certificates that I had submitted, all offices said they have never been contacted to verify anyone’s certificates.

I don't want to believe that the DFA don't verify any certificates they are given. Online databases make this easy to do in the UK and Ireland. Is it possible that they could have verified using such a database for Massachusetts? That way the offices might not know if verification was done as there was no direct contact involved.

Sulla · Post by **Sulla** » Wed Jun 05, 2019 11:34 pm

chrisinpm wrote: ↑
Wed Jun 05, 2019 5:23 pm
I sent my application on 21 March from the New York City metro area.
If anyone has any guesses as to what the real processing time would be, I'm all ears.

Probably around 10 months from the date of confirmed receipt to FBR addition. A further month to allow for printing and postage of the certificate back to you. A further 2 months (if you apply straight away) for passport issuance.

Circa 13 months all in. Obviously, there is a lot of variation in the FBR process timescales for each person. These are just ballpark estimates.

Sulla · Post by **Sulla** » Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:00 am

nydccub wrote: ↑
Wed Jun 05, 2019 2:50 pm
I wonder why DFA doesn't require Apostille certificates for all vital records submitted in the FBR application. Doing so would streamline the process by eliminating the need for record authentication.

I agree wholeheartedly with what you have to say about Apostilization of documents. It seems a logical thing to request. However, I can also think of some possible reasons why this has not been implemented by the DFA.

1) They don't authenticate the certificates, beyond simply taking a look at them. Therefore, no time would be saved. I am a bit uncomfortable believing this, but it is possible based upon what Michael found out.

2) Not every country is a signatory to the convention. If fact 40% of nations are not - including Canada. This may seriously complicate applications from non-signatory jurisdictions.

3) The additional cost burden imposed would make the FBR process substantially more expensive. I know that in the UK the price is GBP 30 per document for apostilling services. I have done this several times for other citizenship processes and I reused some of these documents in my FBR application. Already we have some applicants who are less than delighted at the Euro 278 cost of FBR. If we force people to get documents apostilled (in addition to the application fee and charges for original certificates) then overall the cost would increase by some margin.

4) Apostilization of documents will add inconvenience for applicants and lengthen the time necessary to source all of the required materials needed to apply.

Sulla · Post by **Sulla** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 9:51 am

I just took receipt of a package containing my new Irish passport, FBR certificate and other supporting documents. It arrived at the embassy in Beijing on Tuesday June 4th and at my Chinese address on Wednesday June 5th . I got it sent on to Thailand by fast courier the same day.

I am pretty happy with it as it has 60 visa usable pages, compared to the 42 you get for about the same price with the supposed 50 page jumbo UK passport. When you move around a lot, these can get used up quickly. I also received 2 passport photos that were unused back with the package.

From application to delivery in China took 2 months and 8 days.

I will linger in Pattaya and Hua Hin for another couple of weeks since I have a 30 day stamp. After that I will head down to Kuala Lumpur. I have my annual medical to do there as well as a W8-BEN waiting to be sent off that was delivered to my Malaysian condo.

LesMalouinettes · Post by **LesMalouinettes** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:13 am

Sulla wrote: ↑
Fri Jun 07, 2019 9:51 am
I just took receipt of a package containing my new Irish passport, FBR certificate and other supporting documents. It arrived at the embassy in Beijing on Tuesday June 4th and at my Chinese address on Wednesday June 5th . I got it sent on to Thailand by fast courier the same day.

Congratulations Sulla! I'm so happy for you!! I hope you do something nice to celebrate finally getting it <3

champers · Post by **champers** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 12:27 pm

My son is applying through descent through my Irish born mother.

One of the required supporting documents is a copy of her CURRENT passport or driving licence. My mother is 87 years old and has understandably let these both expire. Has this sort of issue been a problem for anyone else or can I hope that the authorities will take a pragmatic view and accept a scanned copy of her expired documents?

Many thanks.

BrexitEscapee · Post by **BrexitEscapee** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 1:11 pm

champers wrote: ↑
Fri Jun 07, 2019 12:27 pm
My son is applying through descent through my Irish born mother.

One of the required supporting documents is a copy of her CURRENT passport or driving licence. My mother is 87 years old and has understandably let these both expire. Has this sort of issue been a problem for anyone else or can I hope that the authorities will take a pragmatic view and accept a scanned copy of her expired documents?

Many thanks.

I haven't seen this question asked before on this forum, so I can't give you a definite answer. The ID requirement is basically asking for a piece of paper that has been issued by the state which uniquely identifies an individual. In my case, it was my Grandfather's death certificate. I therefore think there's a reasonable chance they would take a pragmatic view of an expired passport or driver's license if that's all she currently has, because that document still uniquely identifies her.

However, as I'm sure you'll be thinking: is it worth taking the risk? Once you've applied, you're going to be in a waiting period of several months without feedback, and it won't be a good feeling if you've got a nagging doubt at the back of your mind. If it was me, I'd phone first - earlier posts in this thread give contact numbers. If they say no, then you'll have to get your mother to apply for a new passport or ID card.

Sulla · Post by **Sulla** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 1:39 pm

champers wrote: ↑
Fri Jun 07, 2019 12:27 pm
My son is applying through descent through my Irish born mother.

One of the required supporting documents is a copy of her CURRENT passport or driving licence. My mother is 87 years old and has understandably let these both expire. Has this sort of issue been a problem for anyone else or can I hope that the authorities will take a pragmatic view and accept a scanned copy of her expired documents?

Many thanks.

You will need to source current, government issued photo ID for any living individuals whom you are claiming descent through.

In the old thread, this did come up and involved elderly parents. In at least one case, a UK bus pass was used as an alternative to a passport or drivers licence. You should contact the DFA directly or an embassy / consulate to seek direction on this. One thing is certain - affidavits explaining the lack of photo ID are definitely not accepted. People used to do that to deal with circumstances like estrangement, but the DFA called time on it.

Lenny1463 · Post by **Lenny1463** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 1:51 pm

Hi everyone, quick post with my timeline so far. This is my first post.
31 January 2019- Online application completed.
2nd Feb 2019- All documents posted recorded delivery to Dublin.
6th Feb 2019- Confirmation emailed received for my documents safe arrival in Dublin to begin processing.

I have since moved house from Northern Ireland to England and was really worried that this would have an effect on my application, and also didnt want my documents and FBR cert to be returned to my old address if I was successful in being added to the register. So I called the FBR team a couple of months ago and spoke to a guy named Frodo who assured me it wasnt a problem and took down my new address and updated it on their system. I hope that he was right. I know the application process says it should take 6 months but by reading posts here I am going to aim off for around a year or so at current processing times. Patiently waiting!

Michael123 · Post by **Michael123** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:08 pm

Today is the day! Myself and my cousin both recieved this...

Congratulations you are now an Irish Citizen. Your recent application for Foreign Birth Registration has been successful and your certificate is currently awaiting printing.
Your original documentation and your certificate will either be sent to you by registered post in 2-3 weeks or our mission will be in touch with you directly to arrange collection/delivery. If there is a delay in you receiving your documentation you should contact the office listed at the top of your application form.

Is mise le meas
FBR Team
Please do not reply to this email as it is auto-generated

Rbs3 · Post by **Rbs3** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:16 pm

champers wrote: ↑
Fri Jun 07, 2019 12:27 pm
My son is applying through descent through my Irish born mother.

One of the required supporting documents is a copy of her CURRENT passport or driving licence. My mother is 87 years old and has understandably let these both expire. Has this sort of issue been a problem for anyone else or can I hope that the authorities will take a pragmatic view and accept a scanned copy of her expired documents?

Many thanks.

Hello
I raised a similar query before applying (about a year ago). My dad’s passport expired in 2010. I asked if this would do, or whether I can provide other documentation as an alternative (he didn’t have a driving licence). They said that if the passport was a year or so out of date, they would accept that, but since his was 8+ years out of date it was not acceptable. And they insist on a state issued photo ID like a passport or driving licence. So we renewed his passport before applying. I would definitely phone and check.

Lee2521 · Post by **Lee2521** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:22 pm

champers wrote: ↑
Fri Jun 07, 2019 12:27 pm
My son is applying through descent through my Irish born mother.

One of the required supporting documents is a copy of her CURRENT passport or driving licence. My mother is 87 years old and has understandably let these both expire. Has this sort of issue been a problem for anyone else or can I hope that the authorities will take a pragmatic view and accept a scanned copy of her expired documents?

Many thanks.

Hi Champers
I would say e-mail the Irish embassy of London they're very good with replying in a couple of days also with answers .

irishembassylondon@dfa.ie

Good luck

Hol292 · Post by **Hol292** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:26 pm

Michael123 wrote: ↑
Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:08 pm
Today is the day! Myself and my cousin both recieved this...

Congratulations you are now an Irish Citizen. Your recent application for Foreign Birth Registration has been successful and your certificate is currently awaiting printing.
Your original documentation and your certificate will either be sent to you by registered post in 2-3 weeks or our mission will be in touch with you directly to arrange collection/delivery. If there is a delay in you receiving your documentation you should contact the office listed at the top of your application form.

Is mise le meas
FBR Team
Please do not reply to this email as it is auto-generated

Fantastic news Michael!!! You must be so relieved to get that email. Especially when you were told end of September at one point! Hope your documents are back with you quickly. And fingers crossed that means the August applications are being processed now. Enjoy planning your celebratory trip to Ireland!

nydccub · Post by **nydccub** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 3:30 pm

Michael123 wrote: ↑
Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:08 pm
Today is the day! Myself and my cousin both recieved this...

Congratulations you are now an Irish Citizen. Your recent application for Foreign Birth Registration has been successful and your certificate is currently awaiting printing.
Your original documentation and your certificate will either be sent to you by registered post in 2-3 weeks or our mission will be in touch with you directly to arrange collection/delivery. If there is a delay in you receiving your documentation you should contact the office listed at the top of your application form.

Is mise le meas
FBR Team
Please do not reply to this email as it is auto-generated

CONGRATULATIONS! I hope this means the rest of the August '18 applicants will be added soon!

Michael123 · Post by **Michael123** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 4:34 pm

Thank you.

Myself and my cousin are excited beyond belief.
I have 2 other cousins still pending, one is the above mentioned cousin’s sister who applied about 2 weeks after us and my cousin Liam (UpLiam) and his application was recieved the day following ours.

2 down and 2 to go!

Any current timeframes for passports?

Kellie18 · Post by **Kellie18** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 5:33 pm

Michael123 wrote: ↑
Fri Jun 07, 2019 4:34 pm
Thank you.

Myself and my cousin are excited beyond belief.
I have 2 other cousins still pending, one is the above mentioned cousin’s sister who applied about 2 weeks after us and my cousin Liam (UpLiam) and his application was recieved the day following ours.

2 down and 2 to go!

Any current timeframes for passports?

Congrats Micheal!
I’m not sure but I’m a UK applicant and applied on 9th Feb and still haven’t received my passport. So going on nearly 4 months since they have had my application. So annoying when I already had 8 months for the FBR. They are still saying 72 working days for UK applicants. So the waiting continues for me at least!

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