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Uk citizen moving to ireland with non eu spouse (split)

Forum to discuss all things Blarney | Ireland immigration

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kikijon1
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Uk citizen moving to ireland with non eu spouse (split)

Post by kikijon1 » Thu Jun 29, 2017 5:10 pm

(moderator note)- split from thread:
ireland/uk-citizen-moving-to-ireland-wi ... 45681.html

Hi, I see this is an old thread so my apologies for resurrecting it. My question is very similar to the old 2009 question.

I am a British citizen, my wife is Indonesian and we are going to attempt the SS route, My wife has just got a Schengen visa for a spouse of an EU citizen, can we go to Rep Ireland straight away or what? as I have read that it can be done, but I'm not sure if that only applies to people already in another country for some time with EU residence permits.

Thanks in Advance

Wanderer
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Ireland

Re: Uk citizen moving to ireland with non eu spouse (split)

Post by Wanderer » Thu Jun 29, 2017 11:16 pm

Ireland isn't in the Schengen zone. Exactly what visa does she have?
An chéad stad eile Stáisiún Uí Chonghaile....

kikijon1
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Re: Uk citizen moving to ireland with non eu spouse (split)

Post by kikijon1 » Fri Jun 30, 2017 2:09 pm

It's a Schengen visa. First port of call is France.

I kind of guessed it wouldn't be possible.

Wanderer
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Ireland

Re: Uk citizen moving to ireland with non eu spouse (split)

Post by Wanderer » Fri Jun 30, 2017 2:15 pm

kikijon1 wrote:It's a Schengen visa. First port of call is France.

I kind of guessed it wouldn't be possible.
If you are a British Citizen in UK, I can't how you can be considered as an EU citizen under immigration law as you don't appear to exercising a treaty right.
An chéad stad eile Stáisiún Uí Chonghaile....

kikijon1
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Re: Uk citizen moving to ireland with non eu spouse (split)

Post by kikijon1 » Fri Jun 30, 2017 3:50 pm

Sorry, I didn't mention it, but I haven't been back to the UK for 4 years now, we were in France 5 years ago with the spouse visa for an EU citizen as I had some work in Compiegne , but at that time we decided to go back to Indonesia as I also had work there. Now my wife has renewed her Schengen visa.

shpirtshqipe
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Re: Uk citizen moving to ireland with non eu spouse (split)

Post by shpirtshqipe » Fri Jun 30, 2017 5:01 pm

1. You need to move your centre of life to Ireland.

2. Your wife will need to apply for a Short Stay C visa. Ireland isn't part of Schengen.

3. Once she's in Ireland, you can apply for the residence card EU1.

4. As for the SS route back to the UK, no one really knows for certain what the future entails but I suspect it'll get even tougher.

So I guess be prepared to stay in Ireland until your wife gets her citizenship then move back to the UK.

Obviously you can do the exact same thing as aforementioned in France if that suits you.

Your other option would of course be crossing the border to Northern Ireland with your wife at your own risk and apply for your spouse to remain in the U.K subject to domestic law since you're a British Citizen which as you probably already know chances are slim for success.

kikijon1
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Re: Uk citizen moving to ireland with non eu spouse (split)

Post by kikijon1 » Sat Jul 01, 2017 12:18 am

Thank you for that info. We had thought about France or Holland but, as I went through this site I realised Ireland could be a good option, our 3 children would be able to cope with the language easier rather than have to learn a new one for school etc. They already speak 2 languages fluently and learning a 3rd.

I will now look into the visa process for Ireland.

JAJ
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Re: Uk citizen moving to ireland with non eu spouse (split)

Post by JAJ » Sat Jul 01, 2017 12:18 pm

kikijon1 wrote:Thank you for that info. We had thought about France or Holland but, as I went through this site I realised Ireland could be a good option, our 3 children would be able to cope with the language easier rather than have to learn a new one for school etc. They already speak 2 languages fluently and learning a 3rd.

I will now look into the visa process for Ireland.
Irish Naturalisation and Immigration Service
http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Pages/services

It's 5 years for citizenship in the Republic of Ireland (3 years for spouses of Irish citizens). As I understand it, your wife would likely lose her Indonesian citizenship if she became an Irish citizen- although this may not be a problem.

What's the objective here? It is to ultimately settle in the United Kingdom or Republic of Ireland? If the U.K.- are you sure you do not meet the requirements to sponsor for a spouse visa? If the intention is to live in the Republic of Ireland for a while and then use the SS route to get a United Kingdom visa under the EEA rules, then this option may disappear as part of the U.K. withdrawal from the European Union. Or would the intention be to get Irish citizenship and see what the options are from that point?
This is not intended to be legal or professional advice in any jurisdiction.

kikijon1
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Re: Uk citizen moving to ireland with non eu spouse (split)

Post by kikijon1 » Sun Jul 02, 2017 2:49 am

I actually don't mind if I settle in Ireland or the UK, my great grandfather was from County Tyrone. And as a kid I visited relatives in Ireland. We made an application for a spouse visa about 7 years ago, they said some documents were not presented and refused it, even my local MP wrote and asked them to review the situation, the reply was we make another application and include the missing documents. Actually the documents were given but lost between the agent and embassy. Maybe even overlooked by the visa officer!

The thought of having to pay 1450 for a visa that has a good chance of being refused, 600 NHS charge, about 170 for an IELTS test, 1200 to an agent, a 3 month or longer wait, seems rather excessive. Also from what I understand I would have to go back to the UK and secure a job earning 18,600 per year, not an easy task these days, not like the mid 90s when I was on 100 pound a day.

So the price of the UK visa application which is a gamble, although the HO say each application is taken on its merit, they do look at previous refusals and take them into account. I would, to be honest rather use the 3k to rent an Apt in some part of Europe whilst taking menial work until a time comes that we could cross into the UK.

JAJ
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Re: Uk citizen moving to ireland with non eu spouse (split)

Post by JAJ » Sun Jul 02, 2017 8:55 pm

Regarding the previous application, it may be worth doing a Subject Access Request to the Home Office to see what's on file. Also- it's not clear why you would want to use an agent if choosing this route again? It is normally feasible to self-prepare applications.

If planning to use EEA rules to sponsor for a United Kingdom visa, you'll need to keep in touch with U.K. immigration rules post-29.03.2019. This indicates the current proposal but could change over time.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/status-of-e ... ed-to-know

In addition- you should look carefully at whether a short term residence period (6 months) etc. will be sufficient for a Surinder Singh application back to the United Kingdom. As I understand it- if the Home Office are of the view that such residence is for the primary purpose of settlement to the U.K. then there is a risk of refusal.
https://www.gov.uk/family-permit/surinder-singh
(discussion) https://www.freemovement.org.uk/surinde ... ion-route/
This is not intended to be legal or professional advice in any jurisdiction.

kikijon1
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Re: Uk citizen moving to ireland with non eu spouse (split)

Post by kikijon1 » Mon Jul 03, 2017 11:14 am

Thanks for all the info and useful links JAJ, that has helped a lot.

If we go to Ireland or some other part of Europe we have already planned that it could be a long haul, It's also a lot-lot closer to the UK. The reason we thought about going with an agent, or company that specialises in guiding one through the visa process is that we have heard they have a high success rate.

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