Job Market for Credit Analysts

Dear Seniors specially those working in the financial services, how is the market going for credit analysts? any idea. I have more than five years of credit related experience.. will be applying for TIER I in July..

Adnan,

I have also just got a Tier 1 Visa and am in the financial/ banking sector. Though this forum has millions of posts and topics related to IT, I too have not been able to get any help mfor job search. Let me know if you come across anything interesting.

Gaurav

gaurav.y.singh wrote:Adnan,

I have also just got a Tier 1 Visa and am in the financial/ banking sector. Though this forum has millions of posts and topics related to IT, I too have not been able to get any help mfor job search. Let me know if you come across anything interesting.

Gaurav

If I may ask what kind of help are you looking for regarding your job search?..

This forum might not be able to give you a list of openings but if you provide a bit more insight to what you are seeking for then members might suggest/advise and in return they might pick up a thing or two for themselves..good luck!!

Aspirant99,

First of all, I want to thank you for the excellent tips that you have given in another post for Job Seekers, based on your Job seach in the UK.

Now coming back to my comment earlier on job search for Non IT chaps, unfortunately, and unluckily, there isn't much on this forum, (Or even on Trackit). IT and other technical fields are a different ballgame- For example, if you know Data warehousing in India, you know Data warehousing in the UK. So the focus of the IT guys is always on how to overcome their communication skills, get better hits on their CVs etc etc and this is reflected in the discussions on this forum.

In our case, say in banking, or in financial services, communication skills and other things are not a concern. but what you do in India is COMPLETELY different from what you will do in the UK. The laws are different, the regulations are different, the development of financial markets is at different stages etc etc. So the focus of people with such work experinces in other countries would be to get guidance on
1. How to modify/ customise your skills
2. What are the areas that require general skills and whether those fields can be used to build up your career back to the position that you are currently in/ or aspire to be in
3. Are there unique opportunities, like private equity or investment banks that are focussing on emerging markets like India, that will value our India experience. If there are, how to find these unique opportunities.

If you have any knowledge/ information to share, or know about experinces of such people, it will be great to learn about them.

Gaurav

gaurav.y.singh wrote:Aspirant99,

First of all, I want to thank you for the excellent tips that you have given in another post for Job Seekers, based on your Job seach in the UK.

Now coming back to my comment earlier on job search for Non IT chaps, unfortunately, and unluckily, there isn't much on this forum, (Or even on Trackit). IT and other technical fields are a different ballgame- For example, if you know Data warehousing in India, you know Data warehousing in the UK. So the focus of the IT guys is always on how to overcome their communication skills, get better hits on their CVs etc etc and this is reflected in the discussions on this forum.

In our case, say in banking, or in financial services, communication skills and other things are not a concern. but what you do in India is COMPLETELY different from what you will do in the UK. The laws are different, the regulations are different, the development of financial markets is at different stages etc etc. So the focus of people with such work experinces in other countries would be to get guidance on
1. How to modify/ customise your skills
2. What are the areas that require general skills and whether those fields can be used to build up your career back to the position that you are currently in/ or aspire to be in
3. Are there unique opportunities, like private equity or investment banks that are focussing on emerging markets like India, that will value our India experience. If there are, how to find these unique opportunities.

If you have any knowledge/ information to share, or know about experinces of such people, it will be great to learn about them.

Gaurav

Agreed, that the scenario for non-IT is a bit tight as compared to IT and the candidates in non-IT have to do a bit more research for opportunities and openings.However, I disagree that someone who is working in a non-IT field outside UK will have no clue or will find it "completely" different than the one working in the same field in the UK. Yes, there might be few or more than few additional changes/enhancements to the day to day scenarios but the basic framework to work stays the same. For eg: If someone has to open a bank account in India then he/she has to provide the proofs/documents/evidences of him being a resident, identity, housing etc the same way one would have to in UK. Though the documents asked in UK would be different than the documents that would be asked from a customer in India, but the process will still stay the same.

The key word would be a lack of UK experience might be considered more in a non-IT field(specially in banking , finance etc) than in an IT field. But again this should not be a deterrant to one's effort in seeking an opportunity in the UK.

For your queries IMO the following can be a starting point if you haven't done that already:

As I have very liitle knowledge about the core banking field that you are in but i would suggest that upskilling yourself as per your area of expertise is very important whether be it IT or non-IT. In your case surfing the web, looking at job postings on the websites to get a feel what the employers in the UK are looking for and upskilling yourself in those areas would be a good start. Also, if you can get hold of CVs from someone who might be working in your domain in the UK and update your CV similarly will do a lot of good. Ofcourse you should have a thorough knowledge of what you are writing on your CV. I did the same for some of the technologies that are currently in demand and upskilled myself on that.

And for communication skills I think it is imperative in whatever field you are so you cannot undermine that at all and have to continuosly hone it to have a succesful crack at the interview and further on when you are at the job...

I hope anyone on this forum who would have some specific knowledge in your area would also come up and help out...Good luck!!

aspirant99 wrote:

gaurav.y.singh wrote:Aspirant99,


In our case, say in banking, or in financial services, communication skills and other things are not a concern. but what you do in India is COMPLETELY different from what you will do in the UK. The laws are different, the regulations are different, the development of financial markets is at different stages etc etc.

Gaurav

However, I disagree that someone who is working in a non-IT field outside UK will have no clue or will find it "completely" different than the one working in the same field in the UK. Yes, there might be few or more than few additional changes/enhancements to the day to day scenarios but the basic framework to work stays the same. For eg: If someone has to open a bank account in India then he/she has to provide the proofs/documents/evidences of him being a resident, identity, housing etc the same way one would have to in UK. Though the documents asked in UK would be different than the documents that would be asked from a customer in India, but the process will still stay the same.

Dear Aspirant99,

Thank you for your advice. There is no question of getiing 'deterred' or discouraged by anything, and atleast I don't have the bourgeois, middle class mentality of 'security' and comfort. If I have made up my mind to move to the UK, let hell come on the way and I'm prepapred.

I like your general suggestions and anyone in any field ought to do so- scan jobs, list the number of cometencies that are common to most jobs in your area, customise your cv without lying or making up things etc etc.

Hope others will come with more specific experinces or tips on how they cracked the job market.

Gaurav
P.S.- FYI- Unfortunately, banking is much more than opening accounts. That's the retail part of it and is more of customer service than banking. For example, If you're structuring debt for companies, yes, it is COMPLETELY different from how it is done in the UK. The UK is more developed has other debt instruments than the ones commonly used in India. So the ideal concept of 'logical thinking' does not necessarily apply to other sectors of the economy than IT which may have developed over time in response to a lot of micro and macro variables like History, Society, Psychology, Dominance of the country in the World, it's tilt towards capitalism/ socialism, development of other industries etc etc. 'Enhancing' and 'framework' are IT parlances that are for IT and technology but may not necessarily make sense for say banking or finance, unless you want to become an accountant.

gaurav.y.singh wrote:
If I have made up my mind to move to the UK, let hell come on the way and I'm prepapred.

.

Good to hear that..all the best!!

gaurav.y.singh wrote: P.S.- FYI- Unfortunately, banking is much more than opening accounts. That's the retail part of it and is more of customer service than banking. For example, If you're structuring debt for companies, yes, it is COMPLETELY different from how it is done in the UK. The UK is more developed has other debt instruments than the ones commonly used in India. So the ideal concept of 'logical thinking' does not necessarily apply to other sectors of the economy than IT which may have developed over time in response to a lot of micro and macro variables like History, Society, Psychology, Dominance of the country in the World, it's tilt towards capitalism/ socialism, development of other industries etc etc. 'Enhancing' and 'framework' are IT parlances that are for IT and technology but may not necessarily make sense for say banking or finance, unless you want to become an accountant.

I still have my apprehensions in agreeing to this entirely but again you would have a better understanding than me in this area ...And i thought "enhancing" and framework(not the technical meaning but what i meant was a skeleton of work or scope of work) were generic to all the fields...and again my example of opening an account was just an example of the lowest level...all said i wish all the best to you and hope people with a knowledge in this area will be able to help and also enlighten me ...good luck!!

To get more specific responses please let the forum know about your years of experience, roles you are looking for, any preferred location,, any salary constraints etc...

To all those seeking jobs in the BFSI domain, let me shed some light on the generic markets conditions in the UK to help you with your decision making.

As we all know, IT skills and technology knowledge is a practical skillset gained over years of experience. While there are only Masters and some generic Bachelors courses in IT (and not Information Management) the opposite is very true for working in the BFSI. What I mean here is you cannot have a Masters in SAP but you can have a Masters in Investments or Financial Analysis which is enough to help you secure a job.

The UK is a Financial HUB and the biggest attraction in the UK for foreign students is either doing a Bachelors or Masters or MBA and securing a top notch role in the BFSI domain. Given there are over 300 odd colleges with such courses across levels, not all can get their dream jobs and then resort to picking a standard Banking or Finance role to just enter the market. This has been happening for quite some time now and there are numerous reports on the news about major graduate unemployment. Banking and Investment Houses are being persuaded to up their graduate intake and they are doing so by lowering salaries, increasing probation periods and growing organically to save costs.

So why am I saying all this? Well, and again, unlike the IT domain where specific skills are transferable anywhere in the world, BFSI skills are specific to the geography where you work and there is a lot to learn to just compete in the market.
To this you add all those Masters and MBA grads from Tier 2/3/4 colleges in the UK who get a 2 year Skilled Visa after graduation and enter the job market as well. Also note that the UK is not totally out of recession and while profits are slowly increasing the jobs in this domain are not.

So, while its great to have courage to just come here thinking there are a few things to learn, the competition in the BFSI domain is fierce, and for a person not local to the rules of the game in the UK, no experience whatsoever in the BFSI world of Europe and with a degree from anywhere other than Europe - such people have an impossible task of cutting through all this competition to secure a decent job.

My 2 cents on one major difference of how the student community in the UK affects IT and non IT roles especially the BFSI domain and thus literally makes entry into this area non-existent for people outside of Europe. The presence of sufficient local talent to compete for BFSI jobs is a major reason why most skilled migrants tend to from areas other than from Banking, Financial Services and Insurance - of course, if you have 10 years experience managing a Hedge Fund within Europe though physically located elsewhere, then none of the above holds good for you. My write-up is for the average person, assuming a Tier 1 visa is obtained to make more money and have a better life outside of their Home country and are in the age group of 28-34

Regards
KP

Listen KP,

Like many others, I'm sick of your constant rants in all the posts on 'don't come here, there are no jobs blah blah bla....'


Please don't give me a reality check, for most of us, including me, KNOW the reality very well! Unfortunately, I'm more complicated than going to a developed country to make money. I've wanted to go to England since the first time I read Enid Blyton in class I or II. And then Shakespeare and Wodehouse and James Herriot etc etc later on. Not to mention the intrigue for a country which has had such a huge effect in charting the course of India's history. So, the reasons for me going to England (and I'm purposely not saying UK) is for different than what they may be for you or the IT techie types.


Secondly, please, for god's sake please, don't use these goddamn techie terms like 'BFSI domain' for Banking and Finance. There is a world beyond your 'IT' and it is much more vibrant and beautiful and live. Don't put me in the category of the software coolies doing alll the dirty work of the Westerners that they don't want to do. And that, my friend KP, is why IT guys are in demand in developed countries, similar to why accounting is in demand (because both are bland and boring) so don't please yourself y using terms and explanations like 'IT skills and technology knowledge is a practical skillset gained over years of experience'

Lastly, I am from Banking and Finance, (which I repeat is NOT BFSI domain), and I am not only aware of my limitations, but also my strengths. What is courage for you is a normal calculated risk for me. So here's what I'm going to do (And I'm telling you this so that you don't go around telling people about BFSI domain and courage in the future)-

- Use contacts that I've made here in India and try to talk my way through a job in private equity or venture funds, selling my India experince
- Get a CFA certification (Level I) by December of 2010, just before I move to the UK.
- Keep applying for jobs
- If I think I am going nowhere, I will start doing any kind of job, including marketing, sales, or even at a supermarket for 20k a year or even £5 an hour, if it comes to that, to keep myself going.
-Lastly, apply for MBA next year form a top university(I've given GMAT and have got 730). That will give me another 3 years in England (1 year course plus 2 years PSW)and a UK degree.

SO, As you can see, getting a job is just one part of my strategy.
Therefore, with all due respect, I would request you to not to poke your nose where not needed and PLEASE STICK TO THE QUESTIONS BEING ASKED BY MEMBERS IN THESE FORUMS, WITHOUT GIVING ADVICES ON COURAGE AND WHAT THE SITUATION IN THE UK IS.

Gaurav
P.S.- And you know what- I think I'm far better, in aptitude, in attitude, in experience, in communication than those millions of graduates coming into the finance sector every year, including the whites. I'm that confident/ arrogant/ unaware/ aware/ of myself.

gaurav.y.singh wrote:Listen KP,

Like many others, I'm sick of your constant rants in all the posts on 'don't come here, there are no jobs blah blah bla....'


Please don't give me a reality check, for most of us, including me, KNOW the reality very well! Unfortunately, I'm more complicated than going to a developed country to make money. I've wanted to go to England since the first time I read Enid Blyton in class I or II. And then Shakespeare and Wodehouse and James Herriot etc etc later on. Not to mention the intrigue for a country which has had such a huge effect in charting the course of India's history. So, the reasons for me going to England (and I'm purposely not saying UK) is for different than what they may be for you or the IT techie types.


Secondly, please, for god's sake please, don't use these goddamn techie terms like 'BFSI domain' for Banking and Finance. There is a world beyond your 'IT' and it is much more vibrant and beautiful and live. Don't put me in the category of the software coolies doing alll the dirty work of the Westerners that they don't want to do. And that, my friend KP, is why IT guys are in demand in developed countries, similar to why accounting is in demand (because both are bland and boring) so don't please yourself y using terms and explanations like 'IT skills and technology knowledge is a practical skillset gained over years of experience'

Lastly, I am from Banking and Finance, (which I repeat is NOT BFSI domain), and I am not only aware of my limitations, but also my strengths. What is courage for you is a normal calculated risk for me. So here's what I'm going to do (And I'm telling you this so that you don't go around telling people about BFSI domain and courage in the future)-

- Use contacts that I've made here in India and try to talk my way through a job in private equity or venture funds, selling my India experince
- Get a CFA certification (Level I) by December of 2010, just before I move to the UK.
- Keep applying for jobs
- If I think I am going nowhere, I will start doing any kind of job, including marketing, sales, or even at a supermarket for 20k a year or even £5 an hour, if it comes to that, to keep myself going.
-Lastly, apply for MBA next year form a top university(I've given GMAT and have got 730). That will give me another 3 years in England (1 year course plus 2 years PSW)and a UK degree.

SO, As you can see, getting a job is just one part of my strategy.
Therefore, with all due respect, I would request you to not to poke your nose where not needed and PLEASE STICK TO THE QUESTIONS BEING ASKED BY MEMBERS IN THESE FORUMS, WITHOUT GIVING ADVICES ON COURAGE AND WHAT THE SITUATION IN THE UK IS.

Gaurav
P.S.- And you know what- I think I'm far better, in aptitude, in attitude, in experience, in communication than those millions of graduates coming into the finance sector every year, including the whites. I'm that confident/ arrogant/ unaware/ aware/ of myself.

Easy fella!!...If you go on like this you will be killing your chances to get any help from this forum or from anyone else in the future(which i think will not be a very wise way to go about things at any point of your career or life)...We have to and should respect opinions(good or bad ..does not matter)..you take what you want to and leave what you don't like...

Hating IT guys will not help either..Aggression can be disastorous if not controlled..I have gone through hell and back and what I have learnt is even the best in the business can hurt themselves if they show uncontrolled aggression so the key is "CONTROLLED AGGRESSION"...

I do not want to be a moral police here but respecting individuals is what you should work on .

Also, I thought you only asked for the market scenario and KP advised you on that.It might not be be suiting you and probably not what you want to hear but it is your choice not to take it if you don't like it...

You claim to be far better in aptitude, attitude, experience compared to others but reading this post of yours(if you read with a calm head) what do you think?... does it showcase the same what you claimed for?

It seems you have your plans sorted out so work on it and save your breath & energy to achieve it...

Today being the end of the week.. crack up some beer bro!!....Good luck!!

Ha ha ha! Point taken aspirant99

Its just that I have seen this condescending attitude of KP in many posts so I thougth it time (like others who have done earlier) to put a check on it.
When I asked 'for any help on job search for people in banking and finance' the last thing I want to hear is 'Don't come here and the scene is bad' and implying that you will be stupid to come here.

For god sake, if the scene was not bad, I would not be here asking for advices and tips on searching for jobs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sincerely,

Gaurav

Mr Singh,

Any reason why you are so aggressive? Trust me, it will never help your cause when you are out here. If this aggressiveness shows up at work or within your own community, your DREAM of enjoying the ENGLISH life will be short lived. Try not to make things personal - my post was meant as a mere overview of how things are, and given your LIMITED knowledge of the ground realities in the UK or England or whatever, I gave my views.
But then, it's always great when ignorant ones make me flex my muscles so early in the morning so here goes -

gaurav.y.singh wrote:Listen KP,

Like many others, I'm sick of your constant rants in all the posts on 'don't come here, there are no jobs blah blah bla....'

Rant??? No Jobs??? Think you havent read my posts. I am one of the VERY few who actually says there are jobs for good people with relevant experience so dont accuse me just for the sake of it. Besides, my detailed post was to lay the scene of how things are in the UK - and you really need to have a view of that before embarking on a journey out here.
Also, check the meaning of the word RANT - you are far out buddy

gaurav.y.singh wrote: Please don't give me a reality check, for most of us, including me, KNOW the reality very well! Unfortunately, I'm more complicated than going to a developed country to make money. I've wanted to go to England since the first time I read Enid Blyton in class I or II. And then Shakespeare and Wodehouse and James Herriot etc etc later on. Not to mention the intrigue for a country which has had such a huge effect in charting the course of India's history. So, the reasons for me going to England (and I'm purposely not saying UK) is for different than what they may be for you or the IT techie types.

This is a good one. The England you know from your childhood school poems aint here. For you to even use this as an example throws a lot of doubt on what you expect when you come here.
The England of today has a lot of problems, immigrants from all over the world out here, the local populace surviving on state benefits and infrastructure in a lot of cities taking a beating - so get REAL and leave your poems behind.
Further, I never generalized YOU so you dont do that either. What do you know about me and why I am here in the UK? For that matter all the other techie types. IF you didnt know the real truth - its mostly the Banking and Finance types that come to the UK for money because this profession will earn more than double of what WE techie types will

And no, you DONT know the reality out here unless you have been here in person and spent more than 4-5 years working and earning your way in this economy.

gaurav.y.singh wrote: Secondly, please, for god's sake please, don't use these goddamn techie terms like 'BFSI domain' for Banking and Finance. There is a world beyond your 'IT' and it is much more vibrant and beautiful and live. Don't put me in the category of the software coolies doing alll the dirty work of the Westerners that they don't want to do. And that, my friend KP, is why IT guys are in demand in developed countries, similar to why accounting is in demand (because both are bland and boring) so don't please yourself y using terms and explanations like 'IT skills and technology knowledge is a practical skillset gained over years of experience'

I agree BFSI is used mainly by the Servics industry a lot but a lot of MBA grad pools use the BFSI term and I used it in my post using the Banking and Finance industry as a key player
Also, just as I did not ASSUME when I made my remarks its best you dont ASSUME things about the IT World as well. Statements like this only further show you in poor light. You may need to grow up a little more before coming here

gaurav.y.singh wrote: Lastly, I am from Banking and Finance, (which I repeat is NOT BFSI domain), and I am not only aware of my limitations, but also my strengths. What is courage for you is a normal calculated risk for me.

Yes agreed - My use of BFSI was for all those who working in the world of Banking, Finance and Insurance. So before you take our your gun and start firing I might as well make this clear.

gaurav.y.singh wrote: So here's what I'm going to do (And I'm telling you this so that you don't go around telling people about BFSI domain and courage in the future)-

- Use contacts that I've made here in India and try to talk my way through a job in private equity or venture funds, selling my India experince
- Get a CFA certification (Level I) by December of 2010, just before I move to the UK.
- Keep applying for jobs
- If I think I am going nowhere, I will start doing any kind of job, including marketing, sales, or even at a supermarket for 20k a year or even £5 an hour, if it comes to that, to keep myself going.
-Lastly, apply for MBA next year form a top university(I've given GMAT and have got 730). That will give me another 3 years in England (1 year course plus 2 years PSW)and a UK degree.

Good to know you have a plan but
1. Indian Contacts to get work here? Well you sound like a big man so Im sure you have even bigger contacts
2. Many many people here have certifications which is a major issue in the UK and I have clearly explained earlier as well. Companies tend to send their own for trainings and push for certifications
3. Yes, keep applying. Odds are better the more you apply, no doubt.
4. 730 is a very good score, I dont doubt your chances of getting into a good school though I know, in India, the general feel is GMAT is much easier than CAT and scores from the Sub Continent are always in the high 700 range
5. Getting any job in todays world is very difficult because EVERYONE wants any job just to make ends meet. And being really over qualified does not help as well. But then, its good to dream so all the best
6. Good plan - You come here on Tier 1, then change your Visa to Student's visa, complete your MBA and then apply for the PSW visa. Get your reasons straight when you apply for the PSW visa because you had the Tier 1 and then decided to study. Im guessing you have worked all this out being the genius you are.
And just so you know - if settling down in England is the dream then its better you do the MBA and then hunt for jobs. A decent MBA will easily get you a job role and from there its up to you to work it out.

gaurav.y.singh wrote: SO, As you can see, getting a job is just one part of my strategy.
Therefore, with all due respect, I would request you to not to poke your nose where not needed and PLEASE STICK TO THE QUESTIONS BEING ASKED BY MEMBERS IN THESE FORUMS, WITHOUT GIVING ADVICES ON COURAGE AND WHAT THE SITUATION IN THE UK IS.
Gaurav

I am a member on this forum not only for YOU. Job being just one part of your strategy to conquer England may be great for you but once you are here please do update us on how you really find life and the situation out here.

gaurav.y.singh wrote: P.S.- And you know what- I think I'm far better, in aptitude, in attitude, in experience, in communication than those millions of graduates coming into the finance sector every year, including the whites. I'm that confident/ arrogant/ unaware/ aware/ of myself.

Indeed you think you are and you know you are. Confidence is one thing and OVER confidence is another. You have the latter and coupled with your arrogance I wish you the very best. Who knows, you may very well be successful initially with your brashness but once you sober down, understand life for what it is, maybe start a family and have some responsibilities, you may realize a thing or two.

And an important tip when you interview - consultants, agents and then the Company HRs have a way of sniffing out certain 'profile's so unless you calm down you will, many a time, wonder why you never got the job when you did so very well all the way through.

All the best Mr Singh
KP

gaurav.y.singh wrote:I have seen this condescending attitude of KP in many posts so I thougth it time (like others who have done earlier) to put a check on it.

Usually meant for the ones out here who think all they need to do is come out here and they will get a job in 1 month not realizing all the hidden costs, the plight of the market now because of the increased competition.

And even then, I give a practical view - but guess guys like you prefer not hearing the truth for what it is and I wont bother justifying myself.

All the best
KP

Good to see you getting red in the face and reacting like this, you virtual techie warrior who loves to 'flex his muscles' online.

I wish all the others who are sick and tired of your 'truths' would be ale to see you like this.

From Merriam

Rant: transitive verb
: to utter in a bombastic declamatory fashion

From http://thinkexist.com/dictionary/meaning/rant/

Rant: High-sounding language, without importance or dignity of thought; boisterous, empty declamation; bombast; as, the rant of fanatics

BFSI: I repeat, for god's sake, BFSI, is NOT Banking, Financial Services and Insurance Industry. It is a techie term for the services they provide to these industries.

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Banking, Financial Services and Insurance (also known as BFSI) is an industry name. This term is commonly used by IT/ITES/BPO companies to refer to the services they offer to companies in these domains. Banking may include core banking, retail, private, corporate, investment, cards and the like. Financial Services may include stock-broking, payment gateways, mutual funds etc. Insurance covers both life and non-life. A lot of data processing, application testing and software development activities are outsourced to companies that specialise in this

Meh......

I know that you don't care like you don't care while writing your 'truths'

If you had cared or known anything, you would know that none of the authors I mentioned wrote poems.

Just for your information, and to save you from embarassment, in case you ever meet someone civilised, the great poets of England were
Wordsworth, Coleridge, John Keats, Percy Bysshe Shelley, and Lord Byron- and many more. I've just named the romantics because they were my favourites.

I know now you're wondering what the bloody heck are 'romantics'- You can google/ wiki that.

gaurav.y.singh wrote:the great poets of England were
Wordsworth, Coleridge, John Keats, Percy Bysshe Shelley, and Lord Byron- and many more. I've just named the romantics because they were my favourites.

Well better dont delay your arrival.
They are all eagerly waiting to meet you so hope that's there in your strategic plan as well

Enough of this now, wish you all the best - you surely are a gifted one and we need you here

KP

gaurav.y.singh wrote: If you had cared or known anything, you would know that none of the authors I mentioned wrote poems.

I thought William Shakespeare wrote poems(known as sonnets)..PG wodehouse wrote prose poems..didn't they? Damn if didn't then i am scrwed coz i just gifted my gal a couple of books saying these are an exclusive print of the poems written by Shakespeare.. ....

Shakespeare wrote sonnets, meaning songs, not poems.

But that's a fine thing to do- To gift someone a book on Shakespeare's sonnets. Well done!

Gaurav

gaurav.y.singh wrote:Shakespeare wrote sonnets, meaning songs, not poems.

But that's a fine thing to do- To gift someone a book on Shakespeare's sonnets. Well done!

Gaurav

Thank god I might survive after all!!

BTW from Wiki:

"The sonnet is one of several forms of lyric poetry originating in Europe..."

Anyways the point is-- let's not preach each other and let us share information if we have any or lets just carry on with our lives and try to make it better!!...All the best and pls do share if you think there is something relevant to share and which might prove your point as well ....

Thanks for that and other advices as well. I would still insist on calling a sonnet a sonnet and not a poem.

gaurav.y.singh wrote:Thanks for that and other advices as well. I would still insist on calling a sonnet a sonnet and not a poem.

Upto you mate!!

and don't worry about the finesse of language- It shouldn't matter as long as your gal enjoys the sonnets. Too many times I have seen guys trying to impress girls by gifting them books and poetry (and sonnets) to impress them without realising that they are not even interested nor have the ability to enjoy them. I'm sure that's not the case with you.

gaurav.y.singh wrote:and don't worry about the finesse of language- It shouldn't matter as long as your gal enjoys the sonnets. Too many times I have seen guys trying to impress girls by gifting them books and poetry (and sonnets) to impress them without realising that they are not even interested nor have the ability to enjoy them. I'm sure that's not the case with you.

Yeah rite!!..I get bored by it but again she likes it and that leaves me no choice...worldwide phenomena