Archive » United Kingdom » Idea: Using fake name for mass-marketing your CV
| Author | Post |
|---|---|
| native_workers_ruin Junior Member Member # 3324 | Posted May 08, 2002 01:22 PM Hello all! Is it good or bad idea to use temporary fake name for purposes of mass-marketing one's CV to the world? The objective is to avoid your real name being treated in inhumane ways and indignified in the process of automated bulk processing and storage by uncaring employment agencies. Nobody wants his precious personal data to be abused, unrespected and uncared. Additional purpose is to go by any secret blacklistings you could've been unknowingly drawn onto, without being even informed about. The question is, will it be perceived wrong, or improfessional, or unethical by employers, provided that I declare it sincerely in my CV that the included name is a pseudonym and that my real name will be disclosed upon personal contact? I came up with the above idea of using nyms as an afterthought to the following articles: [1] Most UK Recruitment Agents are a sad joke!! -> http://www.workpermit.com/ubb/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=001457 [2] Agencies and 2 week shelf life of a candidate: -> http://www.contractoruk.co.uk/news250402b.html [3] Response from agency consultant: |
| native_workers_ruin Junior Member Member # 3324 | Posted May 08, 2002 03:10 PM P.S. Also the very important purpose is to keep control over the information pathways which your personal information gets broadcasted over the world through. For example, if some agency sells or outsources, or exchanges (like a last whore) databases that contain your profile, you will know exactly who and where did it, thank to your specific nick name you've used only with them. Plus, if an agency does some irresponsible harm to your reputation, or persists on holding your old, embarrassingly uncorrected version of CV for future inquiries from overcurious recruiters wishing to inspect and compare your history, you'll be able to give up your troubled on-line identity and make up new one. |
| mystikal Member Member # 2457 | Posted May 08, 2002 04:51 PM Dont shoot yourself in the foot.You want recruiters to contact you just to find out your real identity?Misinformation is one quick way to get yourself black listed. |
| native_workers_ruin Junior Member Member # 3324 | Posted May 08, 2002 06:08 PM quote: I'm sure that this soulless system will get me blacklisted sooner or later anyway, at any slight mistake. There are so many things one can do wrong in eyes of recruiters that it is almost impossible not to do one of them. One has to prepare to this possibility. For example, many times I had to express some sharp words of critics against my recruitment agency. Now I'm afraid that I'm blacklisted. But I want to act sincerely, and fear shall not prevent me from telling what I think. Often I simply have no choice as to keep on saying nice words and receiving nothing, or to say something critical and change things for better. In return, I risk blacklisting, which is a necessary risk to succeed. Global communication makes it possible that once I get blacklisted at one recruiter, I will become so globally and forever. It's only one single inscription, and one may be banned forever! Other example: I missed my air departure by several minutes and therefore came 2 hours later to appointed interview. Very bad, indeed. Of course, I have failed this interview. Shall I, however, agree to any blacklisting for such an accident, and accept that I will be world-wide prevented from employment for my whole life? Can I exclude possibility of this? How to explain the fact that I didn't manage to find a job via Internet for a whole year, if not by eventuality that I've been blacklisted? Is there [B}really[/B] not a single vacancy for me out there in the whole 6-billions-people world??? Hard to believe. I'd rather look for different explanations, like some blacklisting, or, alterantively, some innate imperfection within the system and method of Internet recruiting. It's at least ten times easier to find a job from a newspaper advertisement than from Internet!!! If not my solution, then what else? Shall people submit themselves completely at recruiters' chimeric humours? Agencies have thousands of candidates and therefore they feel free to play with them like with cheap dolls. There is a big assymmetry in relation recruiter-candidate. Do you suggest staying unprepared and prone? Which of the both is REALLY like a shoot in one's own foot: to prevent it or to allow it? Maybe you think that one may survive in world's databases after undertaking some massive, long-lasting, aggressive job hunting activity, and still be on good terms with all agencies? After all, agencies don't disclose employer identities to cadidates until closer contact, so why shouldn't it be reciprocal? Thank you for your opinion and intention to help. Please, precise how would you envision effective strategy. |
| native_workers_ruin Junior Member Member # 3324 | Posted May 08, 2002 06:24 PM After all, I wouldn't misinform them, only selectively and openly underinform, with clearly defined goal on mind. And only for the stage of public posting, not personal contact. It wouldn't be intended to mislead anybody, to escape any responsibility, but to prevent manipulating me behind my knowledge. Also notice: artists massively use nick names in professional life. Madonna, Marilyn Monroe... It is universally accepted. Some writers' nick names even suggest opposite gender. Businessmen do so too, in form of ``Doing Business As'' method. Why professionalists in other areas of expertise, such as I.T., should be helpless and submissive? Why not use one's IRC nick name in new economy business relations? |
| Deleted Member Member # 128 | Posted May 08, 2002 07:01 PM It is very difficult to get a job through the internet when you're not there for a person-to-person interview. A year's wait is rather typical, that's exactly what it took me to find a job in the U.S. the first time I worked outside my native country (Mexico). Per my recent experience recruiting for my team, using a pseudonym might give the impression that you have something to hide. Sad to say but impressions do count and I’d rather go for a candidate with similar skills but more openness. Having said that, here’s my opinion of how to improve your chances: * Don’t apply for jobs for which you’re not a good match. They’ll just put your CV in the bin (I’ve done that myself countless times). * Highlight the fact that sponsorship for a work permit would be required. Offering to pay the lawyer fees and/or stating that you have an agency such as workpermit.com already lined up for processing it, will certainly boost your application. * Forget those boring, often corny, personal statements in your CV like “I’m a very reliable person, etc.”. Nobody believes them. * Include a section at the top detailing your skills, level of expertise (beginner’s, intermediate, expert), time of experience, and when last used. This will help the recruiter to immediately focus in what you’re good at. Just make sure you don’t list in here those skills you have no commercial experience in; you may list those under Training. Nothing I hate more than candidates who claim to know something they haven’t even worked with. * Do customise your CV for the job you’re applying to, so that it emphasises the skills and experience that are relevant. Tips like these might get you through the application stage. The job interview is another matter... |
| native_workers_ruin Junior Member Member # 3324 | Posted May 08, 2002 07:11 PM Thank you, Héctor, for these precious words of advice! |
| herman Member Member # 12 | Posted May 08, 2002 07:48 PM Thanks for the tips, Hector! So you mention being up front about the workpermit issue. I know many cover letters have the sort of fluff you describe "I'm a reliable person; I proactively assisted the processes of my last client...", should the cover letter say how workpermit.com can get me the work permit at no trouble to the employer? Previously I had just sent my details with no mention to sponsorship, and when the recruiter contacted me and asked, I explained the situation in detail. Furthermore, since Jobserve only allows for like 500 characters of cover letter text, deciding what to put in there can be rather important, as you might have to sacrifice some stuff... [ May 08, 2002: Message edited by: herman ] |
| blade Junior Member Member # 284 | Posted May 09, 2002 01:30 AM All good advice...Except if you dont have 24 Ucas points, a first class degree from a redbrick university and a distinction in your Msc and finally 5 years work experience I wouldnt state that a work permit is needed.Wait until you have been given the job or are at the interview stage then you can look them in the eye and break it down.Saying you require a work permit up front just places you in the "too difficult" folder. |
| Deleted Member Member # 128 | Posted May 09, 2002 07:16 PM Herman, I would put the information regarding workpermit.com in the CV. When I’m recruiting I often peruse the cover letter just to know how the candidate found out about the company, and then discard it and keep the CV only. Blade, While there might be situations in which being upfront about the work permit issue might damage your chances, the reality is that, in the current market, there are enough applicants to choose from to fill a vacancy. If I were not willing to sponsor work permits and I interviewed you and you waited until then to told me that you needed sponsorship, I would carry on with the interview out of politeness but I’d know right there that I won’t hire you. On the other hand, if you’re upfront about it and your CV looks really good, I would file you under “if no local is found” or would press for the company to give you a chance regardless of the permit issue. [ May 09, 2002: Message edited by: Héctor ] |
| blade Junior Member Member # 284 | Posted May 09, 2002 10:03 PM Hector, You are one in a million.The key thing is all about timing.I did not say do not mention you need a work permit,rather the stage at which it is mentioned.In the ideal world this would be at first contact i.e. the agency unfortunately most agencies do not wish to know. When dealing directly with a company most companies use application forms where clearly the work permit requirement should be stated. If the change in attitude towards foreigners is not encouraged by the government or the private sector it will always be difficult.
You of all people should understand why a job seeker would not openly disclose this until they make firm contact with the company be it directly in an interview or otherwise. [ May 09, 2002: Message edited by: blade ] [ May 09, 2002: Message edited by: blade ] |
| Tekie Member Member # 906 | Posted May 09, 2002 11:23 PM Well, Hector on the ethical side of it and also being upfront surely promotes one chances of being a good candidate and most of the Employers do go for it. But the question here is not of the employer selecting you rather the stage before it. First of all the jobseeker has to get through the Recruiting agency's screening net n they r an ignorant LOT. Just the mention of the Work permit n your CV is bined right away(they call it keeping on file, I wonder whether they have a look at it any other time!!!)
[ May 09, 2002: Message edited by: Tekie ] [ May 09, 2002: Message edited by: Tekie ] |
| Deleted Member Member # 128 | Posted May 10, 2002 05:00 PM I did have several agencies that asked me whether we would consider people who needed a work permit. When I said yes, they proceeded to send me a few of such CVs they had on file, so they do keep them. This may sound harsh but it’s the truth: if I’m not willing to go through the “trouble” of sponsoring, I don’t care how exceptional a candidate you are, I won’t hire you. Be upfront about it and spare yourself the disappointment. [ May 10, 2002: Message edited by: Héctor ] [ May 10, 2002: Message edited by: Héctor ] |
| bubba Junior Member Member # 2926 | Posted May 11, 2002 02:28 AM HECTOR!!! THE CRUEL JOKE IS THAT YEARS AGO U WERE ONE OF THOSE IN NEED OF A WORK PERMIT. HAVING GOT ONE NOW THAT UR IN A POSITION TO BIN AWAY THOSE WHO NEED WORK PERMITS I AM QUITE ASHAMED OF THAT ATTITUDE. REMEMBER JUST COZ U WANT TO SAVE UR JOB DOESNT MEAN U DENY OTHERS THE CHANCE. AGREE IT HAS BECOME RATHER TOUGH GETTING ONE BUT SURELY IF THERE ARE TALENTED PPL AROUND IN NEED OF WORK PERMITS, THEN THEY SHD BE GIVEN CONSIDERATION. |
| native_workers_ruin Junior Member Member # 3324 | Posted May 11, 2002 05:46 AM quote: Indeed, they don't delete us. Nobody who's wise enough clears any data in a literal meaning. Wise people keep them... in folders named like bin, deleted or workpermit (for this purpose). ;-(. Difference between deleting and keeping on file is psychological, not mechanical.
quote: I come from a postcommunist country, so maybe I'm undereducated about capitalism, but I've thought that men of business should be flexible and that, in order to make profit, they should make it their superior criterion. And here I read that criterion of profit gets downplaced by criterion of candidate's work permit. For me, it's hard to imagine that ignoring non-permit candidates could be anyone's bigger priority than making profit. Such statement crosses the verge of rationalism.
quote: bubba, this is business, not charity. They must make profit and avoid losses. All the resentment you feel, you should rather put on British government and British nations, for making and approving such anti-free market regulations. On the other hand, British businesses could be less submissive to State too, since it is also their interest being harmed here. bubba, please, turn off Caps Lock while writing. [ May 11, 2002: Message edited by: native_workers_ruin ] |
| native_workers_ruin Junior Member Member # 3324 | Posted May 11, 2002 06:23 AM Héctor, Why businesses are so resistant to hiring web developers for remote work through Internet? This would eliminate all the mess with work restrictions and they'd gain access to global, skilled labour at a fraction of price. Two-three years ago, one might say it is to early for this. But it isn't anymore! All necessary tools are cheap and at hand. [ May 11, 2002: Message edited by: native_workers_ruin ] |
| Deleted Member Member # 128 | Posted May 11, 2002 11:23 AM I just told the truth. I’m a work-permit holder myself and I’m happy considering any candidate but I’m bound by what my boss/company says. I’m in no way afraid of losing my job or interested in protecting it by not giving other work-permit seekers a chance. Having worked in 3 countries already, I’m very secure about what I do. If I didn’t find a suitable local candidate, I would push my company to hire someone from overseas but, in the current economic climate, I was able to find several suitable, local candidates and thus I hired one of them. If shortage of skilled candidates should make recruitment very difficult, I’m positive my company will considering sponsoring permits. For the time being, this is not the case. native_workers_ruin, I’m not involved in web development at all, so I won’t comment about it. |
Contact Us | workpermit.com | New discussion board
(c) workpermit.com 2001-2004