Archive » United Kingdom » Review of refusal
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| kishorebhosale Member Member # 7445 | Posted March 04, 2004 03:37 PM Does HSMP rejection lead to any kind of record with the HO. What if the application is Out side UK application? is it only immigration records held by HO or anything else? Also what is the application is In UK application ? Is there any rejection stamp like that US rejection stamp? |
| JayGee Member Member # 7446 | Posted March 04, 2004 04:55 PM Firstly, I believe that an adverse result is retained on record with HO. Why I am not sure but I can only imagine if you wish to apply for another visa that will allow leave for settlement. Secondly, since you are not sending your passport with the application I reckon that the big rejection stamp you are talking of won't/should'nt appear in it. |
| Kayalami Member Member # 5984 | Posted March 04, 2004 06:16 PM AS you know HSMP application is two stage. 1. Application for acceptance on HSMP programme. 2. Application for HSMP visa for those outside the UK or variation of leave for those in the UK. Both 1 and 2 are classed as an application for an immigration status so a refusal will be recorded in the HO database and be used for future decision making. In the case of the former there is no mark on your ppt as it is not submitted unless you are an in country applicant. In the case of the latter UK diplomatic posts will stamp a small square with a handwritten reference number on your ppt and cross it out in ink horizontally denoting a refusal. In country applicants who are on another visa e.g. student/ WP do not get that visa invalidated but those who were depending on HSMP to remain in the UK are required to leave. Your DOB, Nationality etc are also captured in the HO database - ECO decisions get forwarded to London. Visa forms always ask if you have applied for and been refused a visa etc - it is best to be truthful. -------------------- ---audi alteram partem--- |
| hsmphopeful Member Member # 7477 | Posted March 05, 2004 06:30 AM Dear Kayalami, A very important question indeed. Do you think nr. 1 in your list (HSMP application - not EC application) is categorised as visa application? As far as I understand, from reading the immigration rules and other official sources, the visa is the entry clearance, and you apply for entry clearance only in the second step. In my understanding HSMP approval letter is a basis on which EC may or may not be granted by ECO, so it is itself not a visa application. So it would not be a lie if someone refused _HSMP approval letter_ says "no" to the "have you been refused a visa to the uk" question? |
| zamzam Junior Member Member # 7701 | Posted March 05, 2004 01:32 PM hsmphopeful! best wishes for the neaxt time.what was your case number in initial refusal? |
| Joseph01 Member Member # 7141 | Posted March 05, 2004 01:44 PM Babar Malik / hsmphopeful The award of experience points for experience depends on the type of job function and the level of the job within the company. It's hard to know what HSMP's specific criteria really are. That's why it is important for your letter from the company should provide a detailed description of the job and responsibilities using specific examples rather than just stating the the job is "senior level." Hsmphopeful, if you can get such descriptions from your non-UK employers as well as the UK employer, you have a shot at 50 points. Remember the 1-year rule. Joseph |
| hsmphopeful Member Member # 7477 | Posted March 05, 2004 01:48 PM Thanks Joseph. The funny thing is that I have been told there is no HSMP(Rev) form although it is named in the guide. To appeal one has to simply write to the HSMP Team, enclose additional evidence if applicable and ask the decision to be reviewed. Will keep the forum posted. |
| Joseph01 Member Member # 7141 | Posted March 05, 2004 01:51 PM Babar Malik In your case you will only get 25 points assuming you are under 28. You need 4 years to get 35 or 50 points. Joseph |
| Kayalami Member Member # 5984 | Posted March 05, 2004 02:27 PM quote: IMHO no it is not a visa application.
quote: IMHO it would not be a lie to say such. -------------------- ---audi alteram partem--- |
| hsmphopeful Member Member # 7477 | Posted March 05, 2004 02:35 PM Kayalami, 1. Good! |
| kishorebhosale Member Member # 7445 | Posted March 05, 2004 03:29 PM Kaya, The HO does'nt seems to be fair. Just because the application is in UK any rejection will have to be mentioned in the visa application form EVERY time I apply for a visa to any country. And on the other side if such app made outside UK enjoy the privilege of not mentioning such, then what is the use of HO recording such information in their database when they are not going to refer that in future app. |
| hsmphopeful Member Member # 7477 | Posted March 05, 2004 03:32 PM Dear kishorebhosale Is this your opinion or statement of fact? |
| kishorebhosale Member Member # 7445 | Posted March 05, 2004 03:35 PM ******************************************* Joseph Wrote: Hsmphopeful, if you can get such descriptions from your non-UK employers as well as the UK employer, you have a shot at 50 points. Remember the 1-year rule. hsmphopeful, I believed your application is outside UK application. So where is this UK employer in the screen. |
| kishorebhosale Member Member # 7445 | Posted March 05, 2004 03:41 PM In my view I think its right for a candidate being refused for HSMP to state for 'No rejction' for subsequent app. By that means In UK applicant should not be asked for their passport at first place unless they issue a positive approval thereby having no rejection stamp on the PPT. |
| Dip Member Member # 4428 | Posted March 05, 2004 04:01 PM Bhosale saheb, Rejection of HSMP is not the same as rejection of a VISA. Rgds |
| kishorebhosale Member Member # 7445 | Posted March 05, 2004 04:22 PM Dip bhaiya You did'nt get my point. Both 1)In UK applicant and 2) Out UK applicant have applied for HSMP. if both are rejected for HSMP, still 1) has to drag that rejection point every time he applies for a visa. I just gave my opinion the system for in UK app. should had been like that to be Fair. |
| Kayalami Member Member # 5984 | Posted March 05, 2004 04:57 PM kish, There appears to be some confusion on this: A. In country applicant applies for HSMP. Such an application also counts as one for a variation of leave. Possible outcomes are: 1. HSMP application approved and variation of leave approved i.e. ppt endorsed with HSMP visa. 2. HSMP application approved but the variation of leave (immigration part of application) refused. This would be based on the person being in a category which is not allowed to switch to HSMP e.g. visitor or being an overstayer or an asylum seeker. The HSMP team in the case of asylum seekers may grant HSMP visa if asylum claim withdrawn. Other persons would be told to go home and apply for HSMP visa. 3. HSMP application refused and no variation of leave on HSMP basis granted (which is fair enough). If person had another UK visa e.g. WP or student visa then he/she remains on it subject to them being at the relevant job/ education institution. If they are not in school/ at the job their visa will also get cancelled and they will be required to leave the UK. Likewise if the refusal comes after the initial WP/ Student visa e.g. has expired then the person will be asked to leave the U.K.
1. HSMP application refused. 2. HSMP application approved but EC not approved. 3. HSMP application approved and EC approved. Person in situation 2 applying for EC after this would say yes to refusal of visa Q. Person in situation 1 would say no to refusal of visa Q. Hope that helps. -------------------- ---audi alteram partem--- |
| hsmphopeful Member Member # 7477 | Posted March 05, 2004 05:06 PM Dear Kayalami, Once again thanks for clarification - I am glad I did think the same. By the way, just in case you may be interested, The Institute of Legal Executives www.ilex.org.uk offers a Professional Single Subject Higher Diploma in Immigration Law, which you with your understanding should have no problems studying for and passing. They offer distance learning via www.ilex-tutorial.ac.uk. I have the course guide for this diploma and it is very interesting (although it does not cover HSMP approval criteria - only the immigration rules part of it). The Diploma is examined at a degree level and may be used towards further studies in law... |
| Dip Member Member # 4428 | Posted March 05, 2004 05:09 PM Hsmphopeful I am glad you got your answers. Bhosale Saheb - Are you sure its "Bhaiya" and not "Behena" Rgds |
| kishorebhosale Member Member # 7445 | Posted March 05, 2004 05:13 PM 3. HSMP application refused and no variation of leave on HSMP basis granted (which is fair enough). This is what I was pointing at! |
| kishorebhosale Member Member # 7445 | Posted March 05, 2004 05:15 PM |
| Joseph01 Member Member # 7141 | Posted March 07, 2004 01:12 AM kishorebhosale quote: You are right, hsmphopeful IS outside the UK. But he also worked in the UK for less than a year in 2000 while on WP. Joseph |
| Kayalami Member Member # 5984 | Posted March 07, 2004 01:16 PM kish - you've lost me? In both cases the issue of HSMP application/stage1 to (HSMP Team in Doncaster, UK) refusal does not have nor will it need to come up/ be mentioned in future visa applications. A passport must be submitted for 'in country' applications because the HSMP Team also stamp your ppt with new HSMP Visa saving you having to post your ppt out to them again or to go to Croydon et al for stamping - this also enables them to verify your current UK immigration status. -------------------- ---audi alteram partem--- |
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