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Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

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simrun255
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Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by simrun255 » Wed Feb 11, 2015 2:58 pm

I just thought i would post this information for those British Citizens who are married to someone from india or any Non EU partners. I tried to apply for a schengen visa for my wife as we wanted to go to paris for the weekend. I was going to apply under EU/EEA spouse where the visa is free and you just pay TLS their admin fee. Even though my indian marriage certificate is in English and on my wifes UK spouse visa it has my name in it, they didnt want to accept the marriage certificate as proof that we are married. I had to get the apostille stamp from India cost me about £45 for an agency to do it plus £40 in DHL fees there and back.

The indian embassy wont certify the marriage certificate unless it has apostille stamp on it from Ministry of external affairs. I just submitted the marriage certificate with the apostle stamp on it to TLS.

I dont know what those people who get married in those countries which are not in the apostille convention would have to do.

ban.s
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by ban.s » Wed Feb 11, 2015 3:37 pm

They'll need to produce a document that has been legalised.

Raagman
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by Raagman » Tue Mar 31, 2015 4:49 pm

To simrun255,
I had exactly the same problem. Can you kindly recommend the agency you used to get the apostille stamp from India?
Thanks, R

Gnanasekar
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by Gnanasekar » Thu Apr 02, 2015 3:16 pm

@simrun255

I'm in the same situation as mentioned. Received British passport and spouse still on non-Eu passport and will be at least for a year. Please provide details on the agency used.

kiranchinnu
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by kiranchinnu » Wed Apr 15, 2015 2:30 pm

Hi OP ,

Can you please share the agency details you have used ? I am also in same limbo at the moment

Thanks in advance .
Information provided is general guidance and does not constitute legal advice.

Donutz
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by Donutz » Wed Apr 15, 2015 3:50 pm

You are all getting screwed by the French, or at the very least they are being needlessly difficult about this.

1- TLS is optional, you can apply directly at the embassy with zero costs of any kind, an appointment must be given within 2 weeks of the request (article 9.2 of the Schengen code on visa).

2- Applications under freedom of movement (Directive 2004/38/EC) need to proof that they a) are family (such as by mariage), b) ID themselves C) travel/join eachother in an other EU/EEA nation then the one the EU national is a citizen of. You can use ANY means to do so. Though fancy stamps makes things a lot easier, but the directive does not explicitly require this, the embassy can make certain that you are legally and genuinly married by other means.

The EU Handbook states the follwing:
"3.6. Supporting documents
In order to prove that the applicant has the right to be issued with an entry visa under the Directive, he must establish that he is a
beneficiary of the Directive. This is done by presenting documents relevant for the purposes of the three questions referred to above, i.e. proving that:
• there is an EU citizen from whom the visa applicant can derive any rights;
• the visa applicant is a family member (e.g. a marriage certificate, birthcertificate, proof of dependency, serious health grounds,
durability of partnerships ...) and his identity (passport); and
• the visa applicant accompanies or joins an EU citizen (e.g. a proof that the EU
citizen already resides in the host Member State or a confirmation that the EU
citizen will travel to the host Member State).

It is an established principle of EU law in the area of free movement that visa applicants have
the right of choice of the documentary evidence by which they wish to prove that they are
covered by the Directive (i.e. of the family link, dependency ...) . Member States may,
however, ask for specific documents (e.g. a marriage certificate as the means of proving the
existence of marriage), but should not refuse other means of proof.


For further information in relation to the documentation, see Commission Communication
COM (2009) 313 final 22.

3.7. Burden of proof
The burden of proof applicable in the framework of the visa application under the Directive is
twofold:
Firstly, it is up to the visa applicant to prove that he is a beneficiary of the Directive. He must
be able to provide documentary evidence foreseen above as he must be able to present evidence to support his claim.

If he fails to provide such evidence, the consulate can conclude that the applicant is not
entitled to the specific treatment under the Directive. Additional documents may not be required regarding the purpose of travel and means of subsistence (e.g. proof of accommodation, proof of cost of travelling),which is reflected in the exemption for family members of EU citizens from filling in the following fields of the visa application form: (...)"
As for direct access, to avoid TLS (service costs):
"4.4. Direct access
Maintaining the possibility for visa applicants to lodge their applications directly at the consulate instead of via an external service provider implies that there should be a genuine choice between these two possibilities.

Even if direct access does not have to be organised under identical or similar conditions to those for access to the service provider, the conditions should not make direct access impossible in practice. Even if it is acceptable to have a different waiting time for obtaining an appointment in the case of direct access, the waiting time should not be so long that it would render direct access impossible in practice.

The different options available for lodging a visa application should be presented plainly to the public, including clear information both on the choice and the cost of the additional services of the external service provider (see Part I, point 4.1)."
Source, handbooks found on the EU website: http://ec.europa.eu/dgs/home-affairs/wh ... dex_en.htm

You may wish to take this up with the EU Ombudsman, Solvit. See the bottom of this page:
http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/tr ... dex_en.htm

nawaz
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by nawaz » Thu Apr 16, 2015 1:42 pm

I recently went through this to apply for a Schengen visa (Italy) for my wife who is not a British citizen yet. I am however a naturalized British citizen. There were no visa appointments available from the Italian consulate in London for atleast two months! Searching around online, it seems that it was a general problem and not something specific to this time of the year. This makes me think that the consulate is forcing people to go through their commercial partner VFS.

In order for the visa applicant to prove that he/she is related to the EU citizen, VFS asks for a marriage certificate. If this marriage certificate is issued outside of Europe (Pakistan in our case), they require the applicant to have it certified by the embassy of the country that issued the certificate even if the certificate is in English. In our case too, the Pakistani embassy does not certify marriage certificates unless these are first certified by Ministry of Foreign Affairs in Pakistan! Again it seems that VFS has stacked the requirements against particular demographics, so they have to pay the visa fee.

cs95tdg
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by cs95tdg » Thu Apr 16, 2015 2:17 pm

Having just read this, thought I'd mention my experience (even though it was not as a spouse of a BC) when applying for a Schengen visa for France last November. I requested a appointment directly at the consulate, however was told that the next consulate appointment would be over a month away (the reason given for this was that the French consulate only allocate 2 direct consulate appointments a week and therefore those get booked quite early). However they were able to give me a TLS appointment for the next day, without much trouble.

While the TLS staff do highlight you don't need to apply through them (paying an additional processing fee) the non-monetary cost of going for a direct consulate appointment seems to be a rather long wait for an appointment, which not everyone can afford.

nawaz
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by nawaz » Thu Apr 16, 2015 3:18 pm

I will try to look through some of the links for handbooks posted above but was wondering if having the marriage certificate attested/legalized from the embassy of the country mentioned as a requirement in any of EU handbooks or is it just a VFS requirement?

Donutz
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by Donutz » Thu Apr 16, 2015 4:40 pm

@Cs95tdg: the legal maximum waiting time is 2 weeks, telling people they need to wait a month is a violation of the Schengen rules!

@nawaz: it's a requirwment set by some embassies. Legalisation might be requested but if you can show that a mariage is legal then the embassy had no obligation to demand legalisation. Ofcourse they can say "we are not convinced that your marriage is a legal one without those legalisation stamps"... Other embassies might be more easy. The EU directive gives plenty of freedom here (they MAY ask for legalisation etc.) , if the embasdy has the persons best intrest in mind they would ofcourse act according to individual cirmumstances. If a staffer is convinced you are married and that it would be a waste of a lot if time and money to arrange some stamps, a practical staffer would forget about asking for such things. For the applicant would be acting practical by providing legalized documents even if an embassy may not find them of any additional value in judging on the application.

nawaz
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by nawaz » Thu Apr 16, 2015 7:48 pm

Thank you Donutz. You are right in that EU visa rules do not set down rigid rules to show that the applicant is related to the EU citizen. For example, I am reading the last paragraph on page 6 of this,

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/Lex ... FIN:EN:PDF

which suggests that the "evidence of family link" is required but does not seem to specify what constitutes this evidence. Thus I feel that VFS should offer applicants with an opportunity to provide alternative evidence rather than setting the requirement in stone that they appear to do. On the other hand, the list of documents required by the Italian consulate given here,

http://www.conslondra.esteri.it/Consola ... tional.htm

asks for proof of relationship (marriage certificate) and a copy without mentioning any requirement of legalization/attestation. This is what we had done i.e. presented the original marriage certificate (which is in English) and a copy at VFS but were asked for a copy attested by the Pakistani embassy in UK.

I am going to complain to VFS and ask for reimbursement of the visa fee that they charged us. Lets see how it goes.

cs95tdg
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by cs95tdg » Thu Apr 16, 2015 7:59 pm

Donutz wrote:@Cs95tdg: the legal maximum waiting time is 2 weeks, telling people they need to wait a month is a violation of the Schengen rules!
I wasn't aware of this at the time, given my travel plans I went for the TLS appointment. Thanks for sharing, it's good to know in the event someone else goes through this in the future. I got the impression that the consulates are now more reluctant to take direct applications, especially with the very small number of direct appointments they said they were offering every week. Thankfully I won't need to apply again as they did grant me a 2 year circulation visa this time around.

anjath
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by anjath » Sat May 30, 2015 4:25 pm

Hello All,
I am in a similar situation now. I have got British citizenship through Naturalization and my wife is currently on residing ILR. We have got plans to visit France. The documents that i have got at the moment are .
1. Marriage certificate issued from India in English.
2. Travel itenary & hotel bookings.
3. Bank statement is addressed to both of us( a joint account)
4. My employers letter (She is not working).
5. Her passport have got my name in Spouse column.

We had travelled to Paris before(4 yrs ago) and at that time these documents was good enough and even got a 1 yr visa at that time. Now having read about the new requirements about the attestation by the external affairs ministry etc, i am confused. If a marriage certificate is in english, and as i have used that in the past for french visa, additionally having my name in her passport, should we need to have more documentation?
Her name was also present in my indian passport, but since the naturalization, i had surrendered my passport.

Any valid suggestion on this topic is much appreciated and will be helpful for me.

Thanks
Anjath

msrmsr
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by msrmsr » Wed Jan 20, 2016 8:30 pm

I have applied last week for weekend trip to Paris

This was with my wife's application as well.

I only provided the marriage certificate and they did not ask for any certified copy.

My last schengen visa was for a year so I assume I would get at least an year and my wife if lucky would get 3 or 6 months#

:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: Surprise surprise when I got the passport - both of us had a 5 year multiple entry visa !!!!!
Took a bit of time to grasp this.

Anyways its fantastic no more spending hard earned £££ on Visa fees. :wink:

Europe here I come.

thanks everyone on here for directly and indirectly providing guidance.

lulu218
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by lulu218 » Mon Apr 04, 2016 8:33 am

simrun255 wrote:I just thought i would post this information for those British Citizens who are married to someone from india or any Non EU partners. I tried to apply for a schengen visa for my wife as we wanted to go to paris for the weekend. I was going to apply under EU/EEA spouse where the visa is free and you just pay TLS their admin fee. Even though my indian marriage certificate is in English and on my wifes UK spouse visa it has my name in it, they didnt want to accept the marriage certificate as proof that we are married. I had to get the apostille stamp from India cost me about £45 for an agency to do it plus £40 in DHL fees there and back.

The indian embassy wont certify the marriage certificate unless it has apostille stamp on it from Ministry of external affairs. I just submitted the marriage certificate with the apostle stamp on it to TLS.

I dont know what those people who get married in those countries which are not in the apostille convention would have to do.
Hi, thanks for the info, can you give us the contact details for the agencies that you used please? I need an apostille on my wifes indian marriage certificate too : (

Cayos
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by Cayos » Thu Apr 07, 2016 1:55 pm

Hello Lulu,

You may not have to get your Indian marriage certificate apostilled, it depends on the certificate and the Schengen country you are going apply at. For example, the French Consulate in London will accept your Indian marriage certificate as long as it is in English and if it is not a religious marriage (as opposed to the state marriage). But even in case of some religious marriages the French Consulate may still accept the certificates, however, you won't know that until you actually lodge your visa application.

lulu218
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by lulu218 » Thu Apr 07, 2016 2:52 pm

Cayos wrote:Hello Lulu,

You may not have to get your Indian marriage certificate apostilled, it depends on the certificate and the Schengen country you are going apply at. For example, the French Consulate in London will accept your Indian marriage certificate as long as it is in English and if it is not a religious marriage (as opposed to the state marriage). But even in case of some religious marriages the French Consulate may still accept the certificates, however, you won't know that until you actually lodge your visa application.
thanks for your help Cayos, you're a star.

However I dont wanna risk booking flights and hotels as supporting documents for the schengen visa, and then they turn around and say, we want an apostille stamp.

maybe im over complicating things, but hey ho.

Cayos
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by Cayos » Tue Apr 12, 2016 11:20 am

lulu218 wrote:
Cayos wrote:Hello Lulu,

You may not have to get your Indian marriage certificate apostilled, it depends on the certificate and the Schengen country you are going apply at. For example, the French Consulate in London will accept your Indian marriage certificate as long as it is in English and if it is not a religious marriage (as opposed to the state marriage). But even in case of some religious marriages the French Consulate may still accept the certificates, however, you won't know that until you actually lodge your visa application.
thanks for your help Cayos, you're a star.

However I dont wanna risk booking flights and hotels as supporting documents for the schengen visa, and then they turn around and say, we want an apostille stamp.

maybe im over complicating things, but hey ho.
That totally makes sense, I mean not booking the tickets but some Schengen countries, again, France, e.g., require them in order to grant you the visa. However, if your destination is Germany, for example, then the tickets and hotel confirmation are not needed. And Germany doesn't have any particular requirements for marriage certificates. I mean, it must be in English or German and if it is not, just get it officially translated and notarised and it should be fine. And to be on the safe side, you can email a scanned copy of the translation and certification to the German Visa Centre in London to confirm that the Consulate will be happy with it before you lodge your application.

muzammil_edu
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by muzammil_edu » Fri Nov 10, 2017 10:56 pm

Hi All,

I have a same problem. Can someone please kindly share the agency where I can get the apostle stamp from India for my religious marriage document.

Thanks

solomonsunder
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by solomonsunder » Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:44 am

muzammil_edu wrote:
Fri Nov 10, 2017 10:56 pm
Hi All,

I have a same problem. Can someone please kindly share the agency where I can get the apostle stamp from India for my religious marriage document.

Thanks
Just go to VFS. It is through them now in India. Though it might be easier and cheaper if you got your state government attestation by yourself. VFS will charge extra for the state thing and it will take longer as well.

iamsahil
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by iamsahil » Thu May 10, 2018 9:40 pm

Guys,
I am applying for FRANCE visa for my spouse (I already have one). We both are on Indian Passport on Tier 2 General visa. We have an ENGLISH language & court stamped /certified marriage copy (std. Indian procedure). Do I still need to get my marriage certificate certified by the relevant Embassy ? Thanks

Caravel88
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Re: Schengen visa-Indian Marriage Certificate

Post by Caravel88 » Fri May 11, 2018 9:10 am

If applying for a short stay tourism visa:

https://fr.tlscontact.com/gb/lon/page.p ... ism_less90

If “married and unemployed”:

- Official translation of the marriage certificate.
- Civil marriage certificate translated into English or French if applicable and certified by the relevant Embassy.
iamsahil wrote:
Thu May 10, 2018 9:40 pm
Guys,
I am applying for FRANCE visa for my spouse (I already have one). We both are on Indian Passport on Tier 2 General visa. We have an ENGLISH language & court stamped /certified marriage copy (std. Indian procedure). Do I still need to get my marriage certificate certified by the relevant Embassy ? Thanks

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