Tier 1(Entrepreneur) Visa refused URGENT HELP NEEDED

Fair enough on the cash flow issues and the issue is not whether it is legal or not.

You could still have filed the FPS and payslips on time but delayed the actual payment.

While this may not be your case, you can appreciate how this method could be used by someone to "create" another 4 months of employment. Obviously, in your case, you are not dependant on that so it can be reasonably assumed you did not do it for that. But the CW and the rules can't try to do that level of nuance.

On the missing payslips, as mentioned before, you can continue to insist it was delivered. But that, even if it was not, 245AA(b)(i) should have been used.
245AA (b) If the applicant has submitted the specified documents and:
(i) some of the documents within a sequence have been omitted (for example, if one page from a bank statement is missing) and the documents marking the beginning and end of that sequence have been provided; or
You can and should claim the payslips were a sequence.
245AA (d)(iii)(1) is also usable as the information was available in the FPS
(d) If the applicant has submitted a specified document:
(iii) which does not contain all of the specified information, but the missing information is verifiable from:
(1) other documents submitted with the application; or

Dear members
Got ihs refund on Monday 29.10
Got all documents back 29.10
And got refusal letter again .
Caseworker still standing on the same points
Investment should be clearly seen
Job creation still they are not accepting late salary payments.
So my solicitor offered me 2 options
1) to apply for tier 2 (However I believe I cannot do so) as it’s my 2nd application
2) prepare for JR
I’m a bit confused now I’m ready to go for PAP and then for JR .However my solicitor recommends me to move to tier 2.

Vechnii wrote: ↑

Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:56 pm

Dear members
Got ihs refund on Monday 29.10
Got all documents back 29.10
And got refusal letter again .
Caseworker still standing on the same points
Investment should be clearly seen
Job creation still they are not accepting late salary payments.
So my solicitor offered me 2 options
1) to apply for tier 2 (However I believe I cannot do so) as it’s my 2nd application
2) prepare for JR
I’m a bit confused now I’m ready to go for PAP and then for JR .However my solicitor recommends me to move to tier 2.

Sorry to hear about that.

Not sure how your solicitor is offering the Tier 2 option. To my understanding you can't do that.
That would leave JR as the only option.

Dear marcnath
With refusal letter I received enforcement letter which states that if I have different reasons to stay then I can make a new application (that is quite unclear)
I’m still thinking that my case is strong but I can’t understand why HO refused my explanations why they did not put on case in investments that I’m the only person who got shares and I’m the only person who transferred money during that period.
Why they did not accept late salary payments as it’s not clear for them for which months to use that .However from my point of view they can’t just pass those payments like they’ve never been in payslips.

Vechnii wrote: ↑

Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:15 pm

Dear marcnath
With refusal letter I received enforcement letter which states that if I have different reasons to stay then I can make a new application (that is quite unclear)
I’m still thinking that my case is strong but I can’t understand why HO refused my explanations why they did not put on case in investments that I’m the only person who got shares and I’m the only person who transferred money during that period.
Why they did not accept late salary payments as it’s not clear for them for which months to use that .However from my point of view they can’t just pass those payments like they’ve never been in payslips.

When you file for JR, you should also inform HO of the fact and that would be your reason to stay.

While you may have a good case on the investment, the job creation, in my opinion, is much weaker.

The main evidence HO depends on is the FPS and you have only one FPS for all the four months, as I understand.

marcnath wrote: ↑

Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:52 pm

When you file for JR, you should also inform HO of the fact and that would be your reason to stay.

While you may have a good case on the investment, the job creation, in my opinion, is much weaker.

The main evidence HO depends on is the FPS and you have only one FPS for all the four months, as I understand.

Regarding the job creation:
I’ve got 9 months with more then 130 hours per month in these months one payslips has late salary payment all of them had: payslips,RTI and FPS
4 months were 112 hours as per calculations of HO
They had payslips,RTI and FPS
Plus 2 months are missing but were sent with initial case.however rti and FPS were there and HO knows it.
Case worker stated that as it’s unclear how to divide late salary payment they did not counted it at all.The letter of accountant which was sent to HO as explanations for AR on second was ignored.

Dear Marcnath
I’ve carefully checked refusal letter and found some wierd explanations of refusal:
HO say that on balance of probability it’s unclear either xxx shares issued during period relate to my personal investment.
In relation to my personal statement and a letter from the accountant which explains how it can be seen in accounts . Caseworker states that irrespective of these points it does not confirm whether this is my personal shareholding or that of another investor.
However in both personal and accountant letter it’s said my name against investments.

Another point which I believe is totally wrong :
Caseworker states that immigration rules to be satisfied it must be clear shown in the accounts, as well as immigration rules clearly show HOW the investment need to be demonstrated in accounts.

Unfortunately for you, the law has this very broad "balance of probabilities" provision that is tough to dispute. Someone should challenge HO as to whether such a clause in itself is fair. I personally think that should never be allowed.

Having said that, I am sorry to say that it was not very difficult for you to have met the requirements. Especially given that it was a second application, every single thing should have been double or triple checked.

As I said before, you may have a reasonable case on JR for investment but I can't say the same of the employment evidence.

Good luck with your JR.

Dear Marcnath
I’m preparing PAP and grounds for JR now.I’ve asked separate accountant to check my accounts if they comply with the accounting rules in particular FRS 102 and company at 2006 an if it was possible to identify my investments from the accounts In particular value of shares on the date of purchase and got reply today saying that it is obvious from the accounts that I did the investment and he could not understand why the case worker did not see it.
Do you think it would be a good idea to attach the letter from separate accounting company with their reply?

Vechnii wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 14, 2018 10:17 am

Dear Marcnath
I’m preparing PAP and grounds for JR now.I’ve asked separate accountant to check my accounts if they comply with the accounting rules in particular FRS 102 and company at 2006 an if it was possible to identify my investments from the accounts In particular value of shares on the date of purchase and got reply today saying that it is obvious from the accounts that I did the investment and he could not understand why the case worker did not see it.
Do you think it would be a good idea to attach the letter from separate accounting company with their reply?

There are no restrictions on what you can include in a PAP so adding anything that helps is good

Thank You Marcnath for your reply.
It’s quiet wierd today we received a call from HO saying they want to come and inspect the company .I have no idea with the reason for that. It’s two Tier 1 entrepreneurs in our company however one has got his visa and did not apply for extension and mine was refused and my solicitor just sent them email saying we are going to sue them and PAP would be forwarded them later this week.
Do you know what’s the reason for their coming?

Vechnii wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 14, 2018 12:37 pm

Thank You Marcnath for your reply.
It’s quiet wierd today we received a call from HO saying they want to come and inspect the company .I have no idea with the reason for that. It’s two Tier 1 entrepreneurs in our company however one has got his visa and did not apply for extension and mine was refused and my solicitor just sent them email saying we are going to sue them and PAP would be forwarded them later this week.
Do you know what’s the reason for their coming?

I do not know the reason for them coming.
Unlikely it is because of the email.
More likely it is to check that you are not working there given that you have lost your rights to work.
I hope you have taken yourself from payroll.

Hi Marcnath
Thank you for your reply I’m not on payroll since May when I got refusal for first application.So there is no issues with that.However I cannot understand if I need to be presented in the office or not.

Vechnii wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:21 am

Hi Marcnath
Thank you for your reply I’m not on payroll since May when I got refusal for first application.So there is no issues with that.However I cannot understand if I need to be presented in the office or not.

If they informed you they are visiting, why would you not want to be there ?

I want to be in the office but I do not want them to claim that I’m working illegally as I’m not working now.

Vechnii wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 15, 2018 9:00 pm

I want to be in the office but I do not want them to claim that I’m working illegally as I’m not working now.

There is nothing in the rules that prevent you from being a Director, only from you being employed.

Today I received from bank a letter that they are closing my accounts as I’m staying now illegally as they say.So HO office doing everything not to allow me to stay in the UK even that I’m going for JR is not the purpose for them.

As per new rules for banks they should check their clients every year and as my visa finished in September last year and I’ve got a refusal HO sent notification to Barclays as I understood to close my accounts.My solicitor suggested me to write them a letter as my JR going forward.However accounts closure will cause massive effect on my living in the UK while JR is pending so I have no idea what to do apart moving my funds back to home country and trying to sort it out here.As per my understanding while JR pending I’m allowed to stay in the country.Another thing is that those transfer would cause loses in currency conversion and who should compensate me those losts if I win .

Vechnii wrote: ↑

Sun Nov 18, 2018 1:30 pm

As per new rules for banks they should check their clients every year and as my visa finished in September last year and I’ve got a refusal HO sent notification to Barclays as I understood to close my accounts.My solicitor suggested me to write them a letter as my JR going forward.However accounts closure will cause massive effect on my living in the UK while JR is pending so I have no idea what to do apart moving my funds back to home country and trying to sort it out here.As per my understanding while JR pending I’m allowed to stay in the country.Another thing is that those transfer would cause loses in currency conversion and who should compensate me those losts if I win .

It is tough and while I understand the government using it to fight illegal immigration, it is a badly thought through rule. Cases such as yours should have been exempted.

I assume your business account can continue. So you can try to use that.

Not sure which country you are in, but you can try and open GBP accounts in your home country and at least save on exchange costs

Thank You Marcnath for your help.
I’ve finally sent PAP and preparing JR.
During preparation of grounds for PAP I found several points which are mentioned in the rules.
1. Investment
Immigration Rules Paragraph 45 by itself says :
45. The applicant must provide their business accounts and accompanying evidence of their investment, which must meet the following requirements
However in my case all accompanying evidence was totally ignored.
I’ve done huge research on my accounts with accountant we checked every paragraph and every word and it’s clearly seen my investments in share capital amount and value on the date of purchase.Nevertheless my explanations and explanations from the accountant were ignored.
I’ve checked accounting rules for accounts such as FRS 102 and Company’s Act how accounts should be produced and what they should include.I believe that lack of knowledge how to work with those documents was the reason of refusal.However as accounts are required for granting visa as per Immigration Rules the caseworker should know how to get any information from the documents and at least the common sense should be presented by the reviewer.
On my second matter it’s even more obvious.
Payslips were presented with all required information and job creation was in accordance with employment rules such as Minimum National Wage and Working Time Regulation.
It was discussed before that HO uses figure of 130 hours per month which is totally unlawful as it was not in the the rules.Moreover as the rules require 30 hours per week but not more 5 months in a year would not qualify as 130 hours per month as they have less working days and it would be less than 52/12=4.33 weeks per month.Even though the formula is presented in working time regulations how to calculate weekly average in certain period and it shows that any deferred payments should not be ignored.Hence deferred payment for one of my workers should be used in their calculations. And it gives a figure of 32 per week in a year time.
However all that evidence was ignored on both AR.
Anyway I’ve changed the solicitors and prepared PAP and expect to go to court against the HO as treating entrepreneurs as a criminals due to lack of knowledge or experience is really nonsense.
Thank you to everyone who read my topic and maybe waiting my writings.Its really hard to understand that in the UK you can be treated like that even if you are genuine entrepreneur.
I know that most of “mistakes” could’ve been avoided by better preparation of documents for easier understanding of the HO.However I believe that if the documents which are required for visa are legal and there was no any mistake there should not be any partial readings .

Thanks God I finally received the letter confirming my visa is granted.
Thank you guys for help and especially to @marcnath
My time scale:
25.09.2017 first application
04.10.2017 biometrics
16.10.2017 complex letter
17.05.2018 refusal letter due to lack of evidence and some missing documents from my side
Prepared new application with solicitors
31.05.2018 new application through super premium
20.06.2018(26.06.2018 we received it) refusal letter with 2 reasons:
1) investment not properly shown in the accounts
2) job creation
All that matters written above in my previous posts
09.07.2018 AR sent
06.08.2018 new decision as previously it was used wrong paragraph of Immigration Rules ,but refusal was still maintained.
15.08.2018 second AR filed
29.10.2018 refusal for second AR
At that time I was really depressed and was not happy with solicitors so I changed them.
01.12.2018 PAP was sent to HO
25.12.2018 refusal for PAP
24.01.2019 we’ve applied for JR as several documents were ignored by the case worker.
15.02.2019 Consent order received
Then during 2,5 months we were negotiating it with Legal Department
10.05.2019 CO was filed by court
24.05.2019 all the documents were sent to HO with extra supporting documents
07.06.2019 we received email saying all the docs with passports would be sent on 10.06.2019
11.06.2019 we received our passports
Waiting BRP tomorrow

Finally I want to say :Never give up if you believe that truth is on your side
It cost me a fortune during whole period and it was mentally hard but thanks God all sorted now.I got huge support from my family and friends otherwise I could not handle it.

Hi Vechnii,

Just happen to read your post. Glad to learn that your visa is granted after the long fight. Congratulations!

Also thanks for the timeline of your activities posted which is a good reference for other applicants (like me!)

I can see your first application in Sep2017, going through second application, two ARs, PAP, JR all the way to May/Jun2019 before the visa is finally granted.

May I check, during this period (as the original visa expired already), is the residence condition remains unchanged (for examples, NHS entitlement, and right of work for dependant)?

I think the principle is, on visa renewal rejection if the appeal or new application is filed within certain period, while it is pending processing/decision from UKVI, the residence condition remains unchanged. Would like to confirm the understanding with your real case.

And the period (Sep2017-Jun2019) will be counted as a valid staying period (say for the 5 years required ILR application) right?

Thanks a lot in advance.

Vechnii wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:30 pm

Thanks God I finally received the letter confirming my visa is granted.
Thank you guys for help and especially to @marcnath
My time scale:
25.09.2017 first application
04.10.2017 biometrics
16.10.2017 complex letter
17.05.2018 refusal letter due to lack of evidence and some missing documents from my side
Prepared new application with solicitors
31.05.2018 new application through super premium
20.06.2018(26.06.2018 we received it) refusal letter with 2 reasons:
1) investment not properly shown in the accounts
2) job creation
All that matters written above in my previous posts
09.07.2018 AR sent
06.08.2018 new decision as previously it was used wrong paragraph of Immigration Rules ,but refusal was still maintained.
15.08.2018 second AR filed
29.10.2018 refusal for second AR
At that time I was really depressed and was not happy with solicitors so I changed them.
01.12.2018 PAP was sent to HO
25.12.2018 refusal for PAP
24.01.2019 we’ve applied for JR as several documents were ignored by the case worker.
15.02.2019 Consent order received
Then during 2,5 months we were negotiating it with Legal Department
10.05.2019 CO was filed by court
24.05.2019 all the documents were sent to HO with extra supporting documents
07.06.2019 we received email saying all the docs with passports would be sent on 10.06.2019
11.06.2019 we received our passports
Waiting BRP tomorrow

Finally I want to say :Never give up if you believe that truth is on your side
It cost me a fortune during whole period and it was mentally hard but thanks God all sorted now.I got huge support from my family and friends otherwise I could not handle it.