South African Partner - British Child Holiday Visa

Hi,

My Fiancée and I are planning on visiting Spain shortly after we get married (9th August). We have a British child, who will be travelling with us.

We are currently trying to work out what visa's we need. The plan is to drive, crossing at Calais (16th August) and then proceeding to Spain, to eventually end up in Tarifa for a week's sailing. Then to drive back to Calais to cross back to UK on the 31st August.

Am I right in assuming that my Fiancée is able to make use of the rights in Directive 2004/38/EC, and as such does not need a visa, as long as correct paperwork is provided at border crossings and she is travelling with my daughter and myself? If this is the case she would not have to prove where we are staying either?

I hope this is the case. As we would like to camp on the trip.

Many Thanks

Dan

Theoretically yes, in practice things might be different as most of the plebs between you and the Continent are unware of the implications of this directive, so your missus might not even get on the boat.

If u do this take a printout of the directive in as many languages as you can plus your marriage certificate.

Are you planning to have the FLR visa by then or will she travel on her fiancee visa? That might make things more fraught in the explaining to IO people department.

Personally, I'd go for a formal Schengen visa, and have a holiday not a battle with bureaucracy......

Hi,

Not sure what a FLR visa is? She has Indefinite Leave to Remain in the UK. (Forgot to mention that)

If we were to get a Schengen visa, do you think we would have to prove where we are staying? So at least a partial acknowledgement of Directive 2004/38/EC.

Thanks Again

Dan

So she already has ILR? How did she get that as a matter of interest? Working visa?

FLR is the visa u get after u marry, Further Leave to Remain, valid for two years, but it sounds like u dont need this if ur fiancee has ILR an her own merits.

As the wife of a EEA citizen there is no need to prove accomodation etc, but again, some arsey type at the consulates ask for it, read here. Also visa should be free but again, same arsiness applies.

There are tricks tho - book a hotel in advance and cancel it before u leave - should be no charge unless u leave it till last minute.

Hi,

She has ILR, because her father's dad is British. I am not sure her father may have a british passport.

Once we are back from hol's she is going to apply for a British passport. She has already passed the test etc.

What concerns me is that we will be applying for the Visa in advance of being married. (The link did not work, by the way.) So she will not formally be my wife at the time of application.

Thanks Again,

Dan

Just to be clear, am I right in thinking as we will be travelling with my Daughter, and she is an EU citizen, it doe not matter if we are married or not?

Your fiancee will have to apply for a visa even according to the directive.

"Family members who are not nationals of a Member State shall only be required to have an entry visa in accordance with Regulation (EC) No 539/2001 or, where appropriate, with national law. For the purposes of this Directive, possession of the valid residence card referred to in Article 10 shall exempt such family members from the visa requirement."

539/2001 has South Africa in it's list of countries requiring a visa so as she has not got a residence card (ILR does not count..) she will require a visa.

danward79 wrote:What concerns me is that we will be applying for the Visa in advance of being married. (The link did not work, by the way.) So she will not formally be my wife at the time of application.

Unless your daughter is also her daughter, she will have to get a normal, paid for, schengen visa. It only becomes free, and less intrusive in terms of proofs asked for etc, once you are married.

As she has ILR she can naturalise as soon as she marries you if she wishes (provided she meets the other requirements).

mym wrote:

danward79 wrote:What concerns me is that we will be applying for the Visa in advance of being married. (The link did not work, by the way.) So she will not formally be my wife at the time of application.

Unless your daughter is also her daughter, she will have to get a normal, paid for, schengen visa. It only becomes free, and less intrusive in terms of proofs asked for etc, once you are married.

I'm not sure that being a parent of a young EU citizen helps. The application form suggests family members are spouses, children or dependent ascendants. By dependent ascendants I'm presuming it means a dependent parent (or maybe even grand parent).

Hi everyone,

Thanks for all the responses.

Sorry I was not so clear at the begining, my Daughter is OUR Daughter!

From what you are all saying I think it will be best to just get a full schengen visa.

This directive is turning out to be a bit wishy washy, IMHO.

Can't wait till we're married and have her British passport, should make life a whole lot easier!

Dan

How long has she had ILR? She might well be able to get BC now, and not rely on u for it, which I always better I think.

Over 8 years, she is in the process of getting BC, she has passed the test and is awaiting to be nationalised etc.

danward79 wrote:This directive is turning out to be a bit wishy washy, IMHO.

It's not, but if you are not covered by it, you are not covered.

(you are covered as a "durable relationship" in fact, because you've been together a while and have a child, but durable relationships count as 'extended family' so need to be proved more thoroughly than a marriage would)

mym wrote:

danward79 wrote:This directive is turning out to be a bit wishy washy, IMHO.

It's not, but if you are not covered by it, you are not covered.

(you are covered as a "durable relationship" in fact, because you've been together a while and have a child, but durable relationships count as 'extended family' so need to be proved more thoroughly than a marriage would)

Mym, does that mean my proveable four years plus living together with my Russian gf means she shouldn't need a visa?

We've no plans to go anywhere, but we have lots of friends in Germany and we've put off further trips there was of the Schengen/Directive mightmare seen in this sub-forum - every day there's some disaster!

Might just try and see, flights to Lubeck are cheap even now!

She did have a WP for Germany - now expired if that helps...