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what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Use this section for any queries concerning the EU Settlement Scheme, for applicants holding pre-settled and settled status.

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goodpartner
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what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by goodpartner » Tue Jul 09, 2019 7:53 am

Hello everybody, I have resident card Of Family member of EU citizen. Also, I hold pre-settled status but it can be checked online only. My question is, if our residence EU card will be invalid after December 2020, new cards will be given automatically? or we need to apply for them?


Thank you.

kamoe
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by kamoe » Tue Jul 09, 2019 9:39 am

goodpartner wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 7:53 am
My question is, if our residence EU card will be invalid after December 2020, new cards will be given automatically? or we need to apply for them?
Since there is absolutely no information officially available, no one here would be able to give you a definite answer that can be considered 100% accurate.

The only thing you (or anyone else) can do, is raise the issue with your MP, for them to raise it with the Home Secretary, asking how this is planned.

Since circumstances change, my guess is that this is very unlikely to be implemented as an automatic process, and people would have to apply (demonstrating their family relationship is still valid; and providing updated address, passport number, etc.)
My posts express what I believe are the facts, based on the best of my knowledge, about the topics discussed in this forum. They do not constitute immigration advice.

goodpartner
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by goodpartner » Tue Jul 09, 2019 11:01 pm

So, the answer to the question is NOBODY KNOWS. I just wanted to find out how earlier in advance it is possible to apply for the card in that case. Though, it is not thought through i think. My guess they want to make it be online only system, don’t know how they handle airlines in that case. Or they will leave RC in place. I can imagine if everybody applies what the crap it will be.

kamoe
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by kamoe » Wed Jul 10, 2019 7:12 am

goodpartner wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 11:01 pm
So, the answer to the question is NOBODY KNOWS.
Yeap.
I just wanted to find out how earlier in advance it is possible to apply for the card in that case. Though, it is not thought through i think.
Same here, and because it is likely not even in the planning, best to wait a bit before start inquiring seriously next year. I think a good call is, if there is no info by Spring 2020, start contacting MPs.
My guess they want to make it be online only system, don’t know how they handle airlines in that case.
For non-EU family members, they can't. They need to issue physical documents. Aso, if they wanted to make it online only they would not have already issued EUSS biometric cards to people who already did not have EEA biometric cards. The process and format are there, they just thought it was not necessary, for now, to issue a card to people who already have cards (which is understandable). But come Dec 2020 they'll roll it out to everyone non-EU. For EU people, yes, there seem to be no plans for a physical card.
Or they will leave RC in place.
RC is part of EU regulations, so if Brexit happens one day, this needs to be scrapped.
I can imagine if everybody applies what the crap it will be.
People have been applying for RCs for years, and EUSS biometric cards since March, and although there have been problems, seems like most people are getting their documents issued. There is a learning curve whenever you put in place new processes; the more people apply, the more the system gets better. I think it is wise they have chosen a phased approach, both in implementing the EUSS in general and in issuing biometric cards, so they don't receive an avalanche of applications at once/don't have to process unnecessary cards at once. I don't think it would be crap.
My posts express what I believe are the facts, based on the best of my knowledge, about the topics discussed in this forum. They do not constitute immigration advice.

sfljiaf
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by sfljiaf » Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:05 am

kamoe wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 7:12 am
For non-EU family members, they can't. They need to issue physical documents. Aso, if they wanted to make it online only they would not have already issued EU Settlement Scheme biometric cards to people who already did not have EEA biometric cards. The process and format are there, they just thought it was not necessary, for now, to issue a card to people who already have cards (which is understandable). But come Dec 2020 they'll roll it out to everyone non-EU. For EU people, yes, there seem to be no plans for a physical card.
I don't think they *strictly* need to issue physical documents. Plenty of countries have electronic visa systems now that are essentially a database linking your passport number to your immigration status. And airlines are able to check these systems. For instance, the ESTA system in the US and lots of Australian visas work this way. That said, I don't think the UK has any such system yet, so more likely they will just keep issuing BRPs.
kamoe wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 9:39 am
Since circumstances change, my guess is that this is very unlikely to be implemented as an automatic process, and people would have to apply (demonstrating their family relationship is still valid; and providing updated address, passport number, etc.)
Hm, that's an interesting point. I was under the impression that once someone is granted pre-settled status, it's essentially five years limited leave to remain, and that wouldn't be cancelled even if circumstances change. I thought you would only need to provide evidence of the relationship again once you apply for settled status (or extend pre-settled status) after the five years. Getting a new card in 2020 I imagined would be a similar process to a lost BRP (not BRC!), as you still have the status, you just need a new document as proof of that status. BUT I may well be wrong on that.

goodpartner
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by goodpartner » Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:12 am

On the website of eu settlement scheme, after I read I thought it will be online, or they just issue it for those who have pre-settled, settled status.
I don’t think they will check anything else, because a person has already a right to remain!

sfljiaf
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by sfljiaf » Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:17 am

goodpartner wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:12 am
On the website of eu settlement scheme, after I read I thought it will be online, or they just issue it for those who have pre-settled, settled status.
I don’t think they will check anything else, because a person has already a right to remain!
With pre-settled status this is not 100% clear. With the old EEA residence card, if you got divorced / your relationship ended, your right to remain in the UK would end with it. With pre-settled status, it never explicitly addresses this; to me the wording used in some places would imply that you would still have the 5 year limited leave to remain, but again it is never stated explicitly. So it could be that upon renewing the card they check this again.

kamoe
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by kamoe » Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:18 am

sfljiaf wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:05 am
Plenty of countries have electronic visa systems now that are essentially a database linking your passport number to your immigration status. And airlines are able to check these systems.
Thing is, it is not only airlines who would need to check this. Employers and landlords/letting agencies/mortgage lenders... As you say, there is no adequate system in place for that, so the likeliest scenario is they keep issuing cards.
Hm, that's an interesting point. I was under the impression that once someone is granted pre-settled status, it's essentially five years limited leave to remain, and that wouldn't be cancelled even if circumstances change. I thought you would only need to provide evidence of the relationship again once you apply for settled status (or extend pre-settled status) after the five years. Getting a new card in 2020 I imagined would be a similar process to a lost BRP (not BRC!), as you still have the status, you just need a new document as proof of that status. BUT I may well be wrong on that.
Also good point, I was thinking more along the lines of a lost BRC. Again, as you say, who knows.

One thing though is that at least people would need to confirm their address. Can't see the HO simply doing the thing automatically and sending out new biometric cards to addresses without making first they are up-to date.
My posts express what I believe are the facts, based on the best of my knowledge, about the topics discussed in this forum. They do not constitute immigration advice.

sfljiaf
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by sfljiaf » Wed Jul 10, 2019 1:47 pm

kamoe wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:18 am
Thing is, it is not only airlines who would need to check this. Employers and landlords/letting agencies/mortgage lenders... As you say, there is no adequate system in place for that, so the likeliest scenario is they keep issuing cards.
That part applies to EU citizens as well though post-Brexit, and an online system for that is already in place: https://view-and-prove-your-rights.home ... ment/start
kamoe wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:18 am
Also good point, I was thinking more along the lines of a lost BRC. Again, as you say, who knows.

One thing though is that at least people would need to confirm their address. Can't see the HO simply doing the thing automatically and sending out new biometric cards to addresses without making first they are up-to date.
The only reason I'm thinking BRP-like process is more likely is that the whole point of the settlement scheme is to re-create EEA rights in domestic law. So it would seem logical that the process will be that of all other domestic UK immigration matters. But, admittedly, that's pure speculation on my part. I really wish they did communicate this all more clearly.

goodpartner
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by goodpartner » Wed Jul 10, 2019 6:46 pm

I called and asked EU resolution scheme about that, They told me all residence cards will be valid IF THEY ARE LINKED TO PRE-SETTLED STATUS(IF it was used when you were applying for PRE-SETTLED status) but those who did not apply for eu settlement scheme, their cards will be invalid.

sfljiaf
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by sfljiaf » Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:00 pm

goodpartner wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 6:46 pm
I called and asked EU resolution scheme about that, They told me all residence cards will be valid IF THEY ARE LINKED TO PRE-SETTLED STATUS(IF it was used when you were applying for PRE-SETTLED status) but those who did not apply for eu settlement scheme, their cards will be invalid.
Huh, interesting. That of course contradicts what's written on the website, but it would make sense. Why print new BRPs when people already have their BRCs. Thanks for sharing!

kamoe
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by kamoe » Thu Jul 11, 2019 9:18 am

sfljiaf wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:00 pm
Huh, interesting. That of course contradicts what's written on the website, but it would make sense. Why print new BRPs when people already have their BRCs. Thanks for sharing!
My initial thoughts exactly, but then I re-red what's written on the website:.
If you already have a residence card it will not be valid after 31 December 2020.
The above does not contradict, as it's true that if no action is taken, RC will not be valid from Dec 2020 onward. It just doesn't clarify that if you apply for the EUSS this won't happen. Subtle difference. Still misleading, if what the Resolution Center told the OP is true.

But the Resolution Center being the Resolution Center I would take it with a grain of salt, until we hear a more consistent and repeated message that this will be indeed the case, or until this is spelled out in the two webpages (EUSS and RC). I will use the online form to ask this as well, and post their written answer here. It would be good if a few of us did the same, to see if we get the same answer.
My posts express what I believe are the facts, based on the best of my knowledge, about the topics discussed in this forum. They do not constitute immigration advice.

goodpartner
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by goodpartner » Mon Jul 22, 2019 8:19 am

Hi who are interested in this thread. Out of curiosity I called 3 times more to the resolution centre and asked the same question. And 3 answers I got implied that people will not need physical document at all, it is going to be all online linked to our ID documents even while traveling. So, it is like it is.

Kamoe, how to send them online request? I would do it.

Thanks.

goodpartner
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by goodpartner » Wed Jul 24, 2019 12:36 pm

I asked them through online form

Here is my question to them

Good afternoon, I applied for pre-settle status with my residence card of family member of EU citizen. I got pre-settled status. According to the home-office official information in december 2020 residence cards will not be valid anymore, so my question is: People with pre-settled status and residence cards will need to apply for a new physical cards if yes when it is possible to do? Will we need to apply for any physical document for travelling purpose while we are holding only online-evidence of our rights of pre-settled status. Thank you.



And here is their answer:

Thank you for your question regarding the result of your application.

We can confirm that any document (be it Registration Certificate, Document Certifying Permanent Residence, Residence Card or Permanent Residence Card) that EU nationals and their non-EEA family members have been or will be issued with under the current EEA Regulations, will not be valid after 31 December 2020.

Evidence of status will be given to EU citizens in digital form; no physical document will be issued to them. They will control who they wish to share this with and will be able to continue to use their passport or national identity card as proof of their identity and nationality and, until the end of the implementation period, of their right to live and work in the UK.

As well as this digital means of evidencing their status, non-EU citizen family members in the UK granted status under the EU Settlement Scheme will also be issued with a biometric residence document, where they do not already hold a biometric residence card issued under the EEA Regulations.

This will provide them with a convenient way of evidencing their status to those who may need to see confirmation of it, such as an employer, landlord or service provider.

Your pre-settled status will be linked to the identity document you submitted when applying. It is currently a requirement that the name shown on any immigration document or digital status matches those details held on the applicant’s identity document. This is to ensure that the information on the immigration status records matches the identity document should one (or both) be used, for example, to enter the UK, or confirm a right to work in the UK.

As set out in the Statement of Intent, applicants granted status under the EU Settlement Scheme receive a secure online status.

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Zerubbabel
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by Zerubbabel » Wed Jul 24, 2019 1:53 pm

It's hard to give absolute opinions about the future. But in general, with the Brexit, immigration rules aren't going to be easier for EEA nationals and their family.

At the moment, when the Home Office case workers deliver a residence under EEA routes, it's not because they are happy to do it but because the UK is bound by some EU Directives and other regulations. Once they are free from these, I expect them to close all EEA routes and convert everybody under the UK Settlement scheme.

Any EEA card that hasn't been converted will cease to be valid on December 2020 even if the expiry date printed on it is 2021, 2022 or beyond. So anyone with that type of card has a little more than a year to sort this out.

The only thing I can recommend is for everyone to keep strict adherence with the terms of the carried residence card in order to maintain eligibility and be able to demonstrate it on request.

Going to the post-Brexit scheme involves a review the immigration status to see if the applicant is still eligible. Don't get caught in headlights!

For EU passports holders, the compliance seems as simple as "I live and work in the UK". For non-EEA nationals (USA, Canada, India, Egypt...) holding non-permanent EEA cards, this is the most fragile status where compliance with immigration terms is a key.

goodpartner
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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by goodpartner » Wed Jul 24, 2019 3:20 pm

I think, those who holding resdidence cards and pre-settled status will not have to do anything after December 2020, I mean online status will be linked to residence cards. Those who did not apply under eu settlement scheme will have their residence cards invalid.

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Re: what will happen to residence card after December 2020

Post by Zerubbabel » Thu Jul 25, 2019 11:04 am

goodpartner wrote:
Wed Jul 24, 2019 3:20 pm
I think, those who holding resdidence cards and pre-settled status will not have to do anything after December 2020, I mean online status will be linked to residence cards. Those who did not apply under eu settlement scheme will have their residence cards invalid.
I agree with you. Settlement / Pre-settlement card are valid and not concerned by the 2020 limit.

Anyone who still holds an EEA card on January 1, 2021 is illegal unless other provisions are implemented by then. But I think every reasonable person would go through the settlement scheme by end 2020.

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