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Part-time Tier 4 postgraduates not allowed to work?

Only for UK Student Visas, formerly known as Tier 4 (General) student visa

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peterrowe10
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United States of America

Part-time Tier 4 postgraduates not allowed to work?

Post by peterrowe10 » Tue Mar 17, 2020 3:18 pm

Hello,
I'm thinking of doing a part-time PhD in the UK but have just learned that part-time students on a Tier 4 visa are not allowed to work at all whilst studying.

I'm just wondering if anyone has any insight into why this is the case? Surely if full-time PhD students are legally allowed to work up to 20 hours/week, part-time students in theory would also be allowed to work equally as much, if not more? Does allowing part-time students to work make life too possible/affordable whilst studying? It seems that there is no rational explanation for this.

If anyone has any information or experience with this, it is greatly appreciated.

kamoe
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Re: Part-time Tier 4 postgraduates not allowed to work?

Post by kamoe » Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:18 pm

peterrowe10 wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 3:18 pm
part-time students in theory would also be allowed to work equally as much, if not more?
You have the answer in your own question. If part-time tier 4 stdents are allowed to work, then this becomes a route for people to come to the UK to work, rather than to study.
It seems that there is no rational explanation for this.
Come on.
My posts express what I believe are the facts, based on the best of my knowledge, about the topics discussed in this forum. They do not constitute immigration advice.

kamoe
Moderator
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Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2015 10:57 am

Re: Part-time Tier 4 postgraduates not allowed to work?

Post by kamoe » Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:46 pm

Part-time tier 4 visas are designed for people who have to come to the UK for periods of non-continous residency as required by their semi-distance/ṕart time degree (e.g. once every two months, or on a modular basis) but who do not live permanently in the UK, and are based and have their lives elsewhere. Hence why they are enrolled only as part-time students, and hence why right to work is irrelevant for them.

Foreign students whishing to live continuously in the UK should make studies their main activity, and hence can only enroll to study full time.
My posts express what I believe are the facts, based on the best of my knowledge, about the topics discussed in this forum. They do not constitute immigration advice.

peterrowe10
Newly Registered
Posts: 4
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2018 4:54 pm
United States of America

Re: Part-time Tier 4 postgraduates not allowed to work?

Post by peterrowe10 » Wed Mar 18, 2020 10:51 am

Thank you for your responses, as they were certainly helpful. However, it still seems that if the point of the visa is to prevent people from coming to work more than study, then why not apply the same 20 hour working limit that the tier 4 full time study is allowed?

Also, if I were to study part-time for 6 years whilst paying international fees, I would guess I'd end up paying more than if I were to study full time for 3 years, given the 5% increase in tuition that my university suggests will occur each year.

I wonder how many tier 4 visas are issued for part-time study each year? Given they're only required for students outside the UK/EU/EEA, I don't suspect many people would bother with flying to the UK every two months or when required, but stranger things have happened. I checked the home office website for this data and they only publish figures for Tier 4 General, Dependent and Child and unfortunately don't categorize by full time or part time.

Nonetheless, it's a bummer for many students who would love to continue with their studies in a financially sustainable manner.

kamoe
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Re: Part-time Tier 4 postgraduates not allowed to work?

Post by kamoe » Wed Mar 18, 2020 12:02 pm

peterrowe10 wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 10:51 am
Thank you for your responses, as they were certainly helpful. However, it still seems that if the point of the visa is to prevent people from coming to work more than study, then why not apply the same 20 hour working limit that the tier 4 full time study is allowed?
You are not fully understanding the purpose of the 4-tier part-time student visa. It is a new visa that did not exist before, created to address the specific needs of some distance/part-time students, to ease their lives instead of having to apply for short-term visitor visas every few months.

Again, people on part-time tier 4 visa are NOT supposed to be continuous residents in the UK, they are supposed to come and spend only the time that is necessary for them to complete the required face-to-face academic activities to comply with their part-time degree. They do NOT study part-time over the course of a year, they study full-time for a very short period of time each time they come, e.g. a week or two, once every few months, then do exams, submit assignments, etc. then go back to their countries and lead their normal lives until the next time they come. In this scenario, there is no window for them to carry out any part-time work while in the UK, since they are supposed to be dedicated full-time to their studies during their stay here.
Also, if I were to study part-time for 6 years whilst paying international fees, I would guess I'd end up paying more than if I were to study full time for 3 years, given the 5% increase in tuition that my university suggests will occur each year.
A common question for people to ponder when considering enrolling in UK higher education. Such is life.
I wonder how many tier 4 visas are issued for part-time study each year? Given they're only required for students outside the UK/EU/EEA, I don't suspect many people would bother with flying to the UK every two months or when required, but stranger things have happened.
My own part-time masters degree is a modular degree, where instead of having only afternoon or morning lectures for several months as typical part-time degrees, you enroll in one-week modules of your choice, so international people come three or four times a year to the UK for a whole week, with full-time class schedules each time. It does end up being very expensive, but being it part time and so flexible, people do have full-time day jobs in their country of origin. I understand most people are usually sponsored by employers, so that is also a factor for why people enroll in it. THIS is the use-case of the Tier 4 part-time visas.
I checked the home office website for this data and they only publish figures for Tier 4 General, Dependent and Child and unfortunately don't categorize by full time or part time.
It's quite a recent visa, so makes sense. It also makes sense that numbers are scarce since it is a very specific use-case.
Nonetheless, it's a bummer for many students who would love to continue with their studies in a financially sustainable manner.
Again, classic dilemma. And such is life.
My posts express what I believe are the facts, based on the best of my knowledge, about the topics discussed in this forum. They do not constitute immigration advice.

lolo2
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Venezuela

Re: Part-time Tier 4 postgraduates not allowed to work?

Post by lolo2 » Tue Mar 24, 2020 3:16 pm

kamoe wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 12:02 pm
You are not fully understanding the purpose of the 4-tier part-time student visa. It is a new visa that did not exist before, created to address the specific needs of some distance/part-time students, to ease their lives instead of having to apply for short-term visitor visas every few months.
Good information, I didn't know about this. Thanks for the update.
peterrowe10 wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 10:51 am
Nonetheless, it's a bummer for many students who would love to continue with their studies in a financially sustainable manner.
You still can study a full-time university programme in the UK and work at the same time (as long as your visa allows you). It's not easy, but it's not impossible either.

I got my Masters degree in the UK, studying full time and worked after University, and got Distinction. Many international students do the same!

Of course, it's unlikely that a part-time job will give you the money to cover 100% of your expenses, but it helps a lot.

Cheers!

sah10406
Diamond Member
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Re: Part-time Tier 4 postgraduates not allowed to work?

Post by sah10406 » Tue Mar 24, 2020 3:31 pm

lolo2 wrote:
Tue Mar 24, 2020 3:16 pm
Of course, it's unlikely that a part-time job will give you the money to cover 100% of your expenses, but it helps a lot.
Plus when you apply for the visa you need to show that you have already paid your tuition fees, or that you have the money to do so, plus that you have enough money for 9 months' living costs.
I do not give immigration advice. I refer you to Immigration Rules, guidance, other online content and to your sponsor.

lolo2
Senior Member
Posts: 642
Joined: Thu Oct 24, 2019 7:14 pm
Venezuela

Re: Part-time Tier 4 postgraduates not allowed to work?

Post by lolo2 » Thu Mar 26, 2020 9:57 pm

sah10406 wrote:
Tue Mar 24, 2020 3:31 pm
Plus when you apply for the visa you need to show that you have already paid your tuition fees, or that you have the money to do so, plus that you have enough money for 9 months' living costs.
Well, hopefully @peterrowe10 is aware of this.

The only way someone can come to the UK (or any other country) without any (personal) money in their pockets is by being awarded with a full scholarship that covers everything before applying for a visa.

Cheers!

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