Changing from a Passport stamp to a BRC.

Jamiwa · Post by **Jamiwa** » Thu May 20, 2021 4:45 pm

On the off chance, are there any Aussie or Kiwis ( or anyone else) on here who have dealt with swapping an old-fashioned Indefinite Leave to Remain in the UK Passport stamp to a newer Biometric Residents Card?
I have a vignette for ILR in the UK from 2002 and have been self-employed since 2004, but I have now been offered a job and apparently, I can't work for someone else unless I get a BRC.
I have questions about the documentation able to be used to prove I've been in the country 19 years (!!!) and the very expensive immigration lawyer I spoke to yesterday knew less than I did.
Can anyone help?

secret.simon · Post by **secret.simon** » Thu May 20, 2021 5:06 pm

You are not eligible for a BRC (Biometric Resident Card), but can apply for a BRP (Biometric Resident Permit).

The former were (possibly are?) issued to EEA citizens and their family members.

The latter are issued to people who qualify to reside in the UK on the basis of other parts of the Immigration Rules.

Apply for a BRP.

Replace your visa with a BRP wrote: You must apply from inside the UK.

You have permission to settle (‘indefinite leave to remain’)

You must apply online if you have indefinite leave to remain. It costs £229. You’ll get a decision within 6 months.

If you want a faster decision you can pay an extra £800 for the super priority service. You’ll get a decision:

by the end of the next working day after your UKVCAS appointment if your appointment is on a weekday
2 working days after your UKVCAS appointment if your appointment is at the weekend

Working days are Monday to Friday, not including bank holidays.

Jamiwa wrote: ↑
Thu May 20, 2021 4:45 pm
I have questions about the documentation able to be used to prove I've been in the country 19 years (!!!)

Quite possibly. At the very least, you will need to prove that you have not been absent from the UK for any period of longer than two continuous years.

Assuming that you are not an EEA citizen or the family member of an EEA citizen, you can submit your current and former passports. And probably the annual tax statements for the past 19 years won't hurt.

Jamiwa · Post by **Jamiwa** » Thu May 20, 2021 5:38 pm

Sorry , yes I meant a BRP- will change that now.
The problem is I don't have any P60s as I've been caring for kids/self employed.
Am working my way through council tax payments and letters from IR re NI but not sure whether they will accept this!

Jamiwa · Post by **Jamiwa** » Thu May 20, 2021 5:39 pm

Jamiwa wrote: ↑
Thu May 20, 2021 4:45 pm
On the off chance, are there any Aussie or Kiwis ( or anyone else) on here who have dealt with swapping an old-fashioned Indefinite Leave to Remain in the UK Passport stamp to a newer Biometric Residents Card?
I have a vignette for ILR in the UK from 2002 and have been self-employed since 2004, but I have now been offered a job and apparently, I can't work for someone else unless I get a BRC.
I have questions about the documentation able to be used to prove I've been in the country 19 years (!!!) and the very expensive immigration lawyer I spoke to yesterday knew less than I did.
Can anyone help?

meunier · Post by **meunier** » Thu May 20, 2021 6:49 pm

I am in a similar situation, although I have been employed. I saw a ruling on a gov.uk website that said a Council Tax bill was sufficient proof to show residence for a calendar year.

Evidence that covers longer periods of time
Documents that cover a longer period of time between 2 dates include:

annual bank statement or account summary, showing at least 6 months of payments received or spending in the UK
employer letter confirming employment and evidence that the employer is genuine, for example, their Companies House number
council tax bill
letter or certificate from your school, college, university or other accredited educational or training organisation showing the dates you enrolled, attended and completed your course
invoice for fees from your school, college, university or other accredited educational or training organisation and evidence of payment
document showing a UK address from a student finance body in England, Wales, Scotland or Northern Ireland or from the Student Loans Company
residential mortgage statement or rental agreement and evidence of payment
letter from a registered care home confirming your residence there
employer pension contributions
annual business account of a self-employed person
a P60 for a 12-month period – your P60 shows the tax you’ve paid on your salary in the tax year (6 April to 5 April). We may ask you for additional evidence to confirm that you were resident here for at least 6 months of that period.
a P45 showing the length of your previous employment. You should get a P45 from your employer when you stop working for them.

However that applied for 'settlement status' for EEA people who had been resident in the UK. I don't exactly know if it is a different matter for non-EEA people - but it would strike me as odd if it were.

I noted that they suggest with P60s they 'may ask you for additional evidence to confirm that you were resident for at least 6 months of that period'.

I assume passports would help too in this regard - I made a chart showing exactly where stamps for the different years were to help with the process.

It is, I agree, a bit of a mystery. I was thankful that the above list as at least it was specific.

secret.simon · Post by **secret.simon** » Thu May 20, 2021 6:55 pm

meunier wrote: ↑
Thu May 20, 2021 6:49 pm
However that applied for 'settlement status' for EEA people who had been resident in the UK. I don't exactly know if it is a different matter for non-EEA people - but it would strike me as odd if it were.

Completely different for non-EEA citizens.

The passports of EEA citizens and their family members were not stamped on arrival into the UK (or indeed into any other EEA member-state). The passports of non-EEA citizens are. So passports can suffice as proof of residing in the UK for non-EEA citizens, but not for EEA citizens or their family members.

There is a lot of difference between the immigration rules for non-EEA citizens and for EEA citizens, even post-Brexit. Don't mix up the two. As you saw above, in my earlier response, even the cards issued to the two differ (BRPs vs BRCs).

meunier · Post by **meunier** » Thu May 20, 2021 7:15 pm

Understood. Sorry for the confusion, secret.simon.

Jamiwa · Post by **Jamiwa** » Thu May 20, 2021 7:32 pm

meunier wrote: ↑
Thu May 20, 2021 6:49 pm
I am in a similar situation, although I have been employed. I saw a ruling on a gov.uk website that said a Council Tax bill was sufficient proof to show residence for a calendar year.

Evidence that covers longer periods of time
Documents that cover a longer period of time between 2 dates include:

annual bank statement or account summary, showing at least 6 months of payments received or spending in the UK
employer letter confirming employment and evidence that the employer is genuine, for example, their Companies House number
council tax bill
letter or certificate from your school, college, university or other accredited educational or training organisation showing the dates you enrolled, attended and completed your course
invoice for fees from your school, college, university or other accredited educational or training organisation and evidence of payment
document showing a UK address from a student finance body in England, Wales, Scotland or Northern Ireland or from the Student Loans Company
residential mortgage statement or rental agreement and evidence of payment
letter from a registered care home confirming your residence there
employer pension contributions
annual business account of a self-employed person
a P60 for a 12-month period – your P60 shows the tax you’ve paid on your salary in the tax year (6 April to 5 April). We may ask you for additional evidence to confirm that you were resident here for at least 6 months of that period.
a P45 showing the length of your previous employment. You should get a P45 from your employer when you stop working for them.

However that applied for 'settlement status' for EEA people who had been resident in the UK. I don't exactly know if it is a different matter for non-EEA people - but it would strike me as odd if it were.

I noted that they suggest with P60s they 'may ask you for additional evidence to confirm that you were resident for at least 6 months of that period'.

I assume passports would help too in this regard - I made a chart showing exactly where stamps for the different years were to help with the process.

It is, I agree, a bit of a mystery. I was thankful that the above list as at least it was specific.

Have you actually made an application then? I've made mine tonight so I have a reference number to give my employer- was told this would suffice to show I have the right to work 14 days after the application was made.
We will see if that's true.
I have made a timeline with the stamps from my passport but annoyingly it hasn't been stamped at LHR sometimes as the rest of my family are British and I was often allowed to enter with them ( had young children)

meunier · Post by **meunier** » Thu May 20, 2021 8:26 pm

I haven't as yet. I wanted to make certain I had as many ducks in order as I could find. I have a lot of scanned documents - but then in my case it is 24 years. Certainly I have things for every year. Thank heavens I still have the documents. (That said I'm not looking for employment.) Can I ask what you supplied for proof of residency? The only time I've seen someone reporting being rejected for a ntl/brp - short of an issue over payment - was for 'lack of proof of residency'.

I know what you mean about Heathrow. I actually had stamps up though 2019, but then have been able to use the electronic gates so have no stamp. That said with full identification of my passport on the application I assume they would have a record of the electronic comings. (I would hope. Surely that's what they are for I would have thought.) It's all just a bit of a mystery to me.

Did you go for super priority? I did fill out the application - but as it was not an option at that time I decided not to go forward and return. I'm told that if you start refreshing at 1am it will become an option as that is when the quotas are released (or so I have read). I very much want the super priority option. Anything to help speed up the process. I do know it is not a guarantee ... and that many consider it perhaps a poor use of their funds. I would like to take the gamble in that regard.

meunier · Post by **meunier** » Fri May 21, 2021 12:18 pm

A question for secret.simon or one of the experience moderators if I might ...

I realise there is a considerable difference in documentation required between EEA and non-EEA applicants.

I was just wondering now - well, since the latter part of 2019 if memory serves - certain non-EEA countries have been able to pass through the UK e-Passport gates and, therefore, not receive stamps. To wit - and I quote from a government site: -

'If you’re from a non-EEA country

Your passport (and visa if you have one) will be checked at border control. You’ll usually be asked why you’re coming to the UK.

You can use the UK/EEA immigration lanes and the automatic ePassport gates if you’re from:

Australia
Canada
Japan
New Zealand
Singapore
South Korea
United States'

QUESTION: Do you know if the Border Force / Home Office keep an electronic record of those comings (I know no goings are checked in the UK)????

I made a very brief trip for my work to the US between 4th and 11th February 2020. As a Canadian I can use the e-Passport gates in the US and used them again on my return home to the UK. Thus I have no stamps for that trip.

I remember when these ePassport gate permissions were first advanced I went up to a Border Force Officer and asked her if I should still go through and get my passport stamped - showing her my ILR in an old passport - which I always keep strapped to my current one. I remember her saying distinctly: 'Don't worry about it. Just hang onto it.'

Jamiwa · Post by **Jamiwa** » Fri May 21, 2021 5:32 pm

meunier wrote: ↑
Thu May 20, 2021 8:26 pm
Can I ask what you supplied for proof of residency? The only time I've seen someone reporting being rejected for a ntl/brp - short of an issue over payment - was for 'lack of proof of residency'.

I am using Utility bills, council tax bills, letters from doctors and have some letters from various people I have done work for.

Did you go for super priority?

No, I have just done standard. My main issue is being able to work and apparently I can do this within 2 weeks of making my application with my unique application number. I am still getting some documentation together and hope to book an appointment in about a month.

meunier · Post by **meunier** » Fri May 21, 2021 6:19 pm

That's brilliant news. Thanks so for getting back to me. Do let me know how it goes.

Jamiwa · Post by **Jamiwa** » Tue May 25, 2021 5:05 pm

Have made a biometric appointment for the 18th June. Will see what they say about my big cardboard box full of 'evidence'.

Jamiwa · Post by **Jamiwa** » Fri Jun 18, 2021 2:03 pm

I had my biometric apoointment today and they don't anticipate any problems with my proof of residence.
They really did want proof from every year since my original ILR (2002).
I used a mix of council tax bills (could only get back to 2012) and letters of Council Tax liability from various councils. I also got letters from 2/3 doctor's surgeries saying that I had been registered with them between date A and date B and had been seen at least yearly. This way they didn't need to go through all my records and find dates.
There were two years I struggled with and for those I used one of my kids' birth certificates and a letter from a doctor that I downloaded from my medical records!
They weren't interested in the stamps in my passports but they did copy the front of all 4 as well as my original Home Office letter and Vignette in my expired passport.
I hope this helps someone and if anyone needs any more information, please ask!

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Changing from a Passport stamp to a BRC.

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