Am I Overstaying?

I had a work permit valid for about 3 more years ... but I left my previous employer ... within 28 days I applied for Tier 1... but after 10 weeks my Tier 1 was refused due to incomplete documents... and within about a couple of weeks of refusal I applied for Tier 1 again...and got approved for Tier 1 general for 3 years....

so my question is:

1. Did I overstay because although I applied within 28 days from my resignation from previous employer I waited for 10 weeks for my Tier 1 visa and then getting the result that it was rejected, even though my second Tier 1 visa application was approved after I applied within 2 weeks of rejection?

2. When I apply for Tier 1 extension before my current Tier 1 visa expires, will the Home Office find out that I "overstayed" as explained above through my P45 that I gave to my new employer or checking with Inland Revenue? Will this affect my chances for ILR?

You didn't overstay at all. If you had the Home Office wouldn't have accepted the second application.

would they not say I used "deception" in my second application because technically it seems like I was already overstaying due to the fact that although I applied for my Tier 1 visa within 28 days of resigning from my previous job, I got a rejection of my Tier 1 application after 10 weeks of waiting (which is already past 28 days)?

also, in my second Tier 1 application which was approved, I never disclosed to them that I resigned from my job (which was based on work permit) which was already more than 10 weeks ago (over 28 days ago) and I still ticked "employed" in the box provided in the application form and not overstaying more than my leave... so was I using deception?

tier1waiting wrote:would they not say I used "deception" in my second application because technically it seems like I was already overstaying due to the fact that although I applied for my Tier 1 visa within 28 days of resigning from my previous job, I got a rejection of my Tier 1 application after 10 weeks of waiting (which is already past 28 days)?

No. You were not overstaying. When you are waiting for a decision from HO you are legally here. So the 10 weeks were legal, as well as 28 days after refusal.

also, in my second Tier 1 application which was approved, I never disclosed to them that I resigned from my job (which was based on work permit) which was already more than 10 weeks ago (over 28 days ago) and I still ticked "employed" in the box provided in the application form and not overstaying more than my leave... so was I using deception?

You should have disclosed this. I'm surprised they didn't ask for a recent payslip. If you have your residence permit already, try not to think about it. I guess you can say you didn't update the 2nd application by mistake.

they considered 12 months payslips within 15 month period...so i only used my oldest 12 months pay slips within the 15 month period, not the most 3 recent 3 month period which i dont have already because i resigned from my previous job...and someone told me i can still tick "employed" based on the fact that i am claiming points for pay slips based on "employment".... so i hope what i did does not count as deception?

to continue from above...had i not ticked "employed", the only other two categories are "self employed" and "other (e.g. students".... so thats why i ticked employed because the points for earnings i am claiming is based on being employed....even though i am not really employed already by the time i submitted my application.... will this be found out by the home office in the future when i apply for extension? is it deception?

tier1waiting wrote:to continue from above...had i not ticked "employed", the only other two categories are "self employed" and "other (e.g. students".... so thats why i ticked employed because the points for earnings i am claiming is based on being employed....even though i am not really employed already by the time i submitted my application.... will this be found out by the home office in the future when i apply for extension? is it deception?

Yes that's deception
What are you going to do?
Report yourself?

well...three immigration lawyers from different companies told me to put employed... because it actually means "employed based on what category of income earnings i am claiming points for".... so i hope they are right so it is not actually deception? if not, then if i did used deception....of course i am not gonna report myself....and when i apply for my extension 3 yrs from now....will the home office found out that little piece of issue?

tier1waiting wrote:well...three immigration lawyers from different companies told me to put employed... because it actually means "employed based on what category of income earnings i am claiming points for".... so i hope they are right so it is not actually deception? if not, then if i did used deception....of course i am not gonna report myself....and when i apply for my extension 3 yrs from now....will the home office found out that little piece of issue?

Well I don't think anyone on here is clairvoyant.
I guess you should check with your 3 lawyers on that one.

tier1waiting wrote:well...three immigration lawyers from different companies told me to put employed... because it actually means "employed based on what category of income earnings i am claiming points for".... so i hope they are right so it is not actually deception? if not, then if i did used deception....of course i am not gonna report myself....and when i apply for my extension 3 yrs from now....will the home office found out that little piece of issue?

I really strongly disagree with republique.

If you overstayed, your last visa would have been rejected. It wasn't - so you are just fine.

I am not a law expert, but the rule of thumb as I see it, is that a person have to leave within 28 days after your visa expiration date or your rejection date.

If you are the process of a visa application, your stay is legal pending the outcome of the application.

You were legal while awaiting your visa application. Even after it was rejected, you applied immediatly for a new visa, which in a sense 'made you legal' again.

The thing that bothers me, is that you state that they will pick it up via your P45 and Inland Revenue Services... They cannot do this, unless you worked while your visa has already expired.

Do not worry about the 'employed' part. It doesn't have anything to do with your current situation, and only has to do with the points that you claim for.

Snoozles wrote:

tier1waiting wrote:well...three immigration lawyers from different companies told me to put employed... because it actually means "employed based on what category of income earnings i am claiming points for".... so i hope they are right so it is not actually deception? if not, then if i did used deception....of course i am not gonna report myself....and when i apply for my extension 3 yrs from now....will the home office found out that little piece of issue?

I really strongly disagree with republique.

I dont see how you can disagree with no one is clairvoyant as to whether the HO is going to pick it up. How do you know one way or the other. you don't and that is the bottom line.

republique wrote:

Snoozles wrote:

tier1waiting wrote:well...three immigration lawyers from different companies told me to put employed... because it actually means "employed based on what category of income earnings i am claiming points for".... so i hope they are right so it is not actually deception? if not, then if i did used deception....of course i am not gonna report myself....and when i apply for my extension 3 yrs from now....will the home office found out that little piece of issue?

I really strongly disagree with republique.

I dont see how you can disagree with no one is clairvoyant as to whether the HO is going to pick it up. How do you know one way or the other. you don't and that is the bottom line.

Hey republique. I agree that we just don't know. But I do not agree that it was "deception". In South African visas get approved within 3 days, so many people have to quit there jobs before they apply. They all have to tick "employed" as that is what they claim for.

thanks for your reply...

i feel less worried now... so just to confirm... i did not used deception even though it was already more than 28 days after i left my employer before i made my second tier 1 application due to the fact that my first tier 1 application, which i made within 28 days of leaving my previous job, was rejected?

if i applied for my first tier 1 application 14 days after i left my previous job. and when i got the rejection of my application, does the 28 days start again or is there only remaining 14 days left before i make my second tier 1 application?

regarding p45, i just mentioned it because it states the date i left my previous employer... and this is the document i gave to my new employer after i got my tier 1 visa... so when i apply for my tier 1 extension in the future, i am just wondering whether the home office will have access to this p45 information through the inland revenue and see the date that i actually left my previous employer, and then compare this with my second tier 1 application in which i ticked "employed" even though i was not employed at that time already....

Snoozles wrote:
Hey republique. I agree that we just don't know. But I do not agree that it was "deception". In South African visas get approved within 3 days, so many people have to quit there jobs before they apply. They all have to tick "employed" as that is what they claim for.

What are you going on about? What does it have to do with SA. She had work permit, she quit her job and applied for Tier 1 and was rejected. She applied again 10 weeks later and was clearly not working but ticked off employed. And that wasn't honest. I don't care what her 3 lawyers told her. And I dont know why she is coming on here about it either. She heard what she wanted to hear and applied accordingly. What is the point on coming here after the fact, if it is wrong, it is wrong and she can't change it unless she is going to report herself. She just coming on her for some kind of absolution. Then get a priest. No need to clog the forum about some kind of technicality that she took advantage of and now thinks in retrospect was probably not on in the first place. Stand by your decision and move on. What is this nonsense about? Will they figure it out later and so on? Who knows?

sorry... i am just trying to be too fuzzy... i think everything should be fine by the time i apply again for extension in 3 yrs time... hopefully