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Can the citizenship be revoked?

Forum to discuss all things Blarney | Ireland immigration

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Guti
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Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by Guti » Mon Nov 01, 2021 7:17 pm

Hi,

can the naturalized citizenship be revoked after gaining another nationality?

littlerr
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Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by littlerr » Mon Nov 01, 2021 8:26 pm

Yes. Naturalised citizenship will be revoked upon receiving a second naturalised citizenship, unless that second citizenship is received via marriage.

Guti
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Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by Guti » Mon Nov 01, 2021 8:59 pm

littlerr you are a beast!!!!!!! Are you lawyer?

And if the irish citizenship was obtained through marriage?

Shakey
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Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by Shakey » Mon Nov 01, 2021 10:20 pm

Guti wrote:
Mon Nov 01, 2021 8:59 pm
littlerr you are a beast!!!!!!! Are you lawyer?

And if the irish citizenship was obtained through marriage?
It "may" be revoked. Big world of difference to "will" be revoked.

I would be highly surprised if anyone has ever had Irish citizenship revoked for this reason. Practically its very difficult for the Irish government to even found something like that out and then even if they did I doubt they would chase somebody down to strip them.

It is on the statute book however so it is technically possible.

Guti
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Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by Guti » Tue Nov 02, 2021 10:15 am

I think they pick them out. Someone who owns a property and has cash on the bank will barely lose it.

Dub23
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Ireland

Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by Dub23 » Tue Nov 02, 2021 10:44 am

Hi Littlerr,

Do you have a link that confirms this?

I don't see this in the actual act: https://www.irishimmigration.ie/wp-cont ... ersion.pdf.

It is point 19 on page 18.

"Revocation of certificates of naturalisation.
19.—(1) The Minister may revoke a certificate of naturalisation if he is satisfied—

(a) that the issue of the certificate was procured by fraud, misrepresentation whether innocent or fraudulent, or concealment of material facts or circumstances, or

(b) that the person to whom it was granted has, by any overt act, shown himself to have failed in his duty of fidelity to the nation and loyalty to the State, or

(c) that (except in the case of a certificate of naturalisation which is issued to a person of Irish descent or associations) the person to whom it is granted has been ordinarily resident outside the State or, in the case of an application for a certificate of naturalisation granted under section 15A, resident outside the island of Ireland (otherwise than in the public service) for a continuous period of seven years and without reasonable excuse has not during that period registered annually in the prescribed manner his name and a declaration of his intention to retain Irish citizenship with an Irish diplomatic mission or consular office or with the Minister, or

(d) that the person to whom it is granted is also, under the law of a country at war with the State, a citizen of that country, or

(e) that the person to whom it is granted has by any voluntary act, other than marriage or entry into a civil partnership, acquired another citizenship.

(2) Before revocation of a certificate of naturalisation the Minister shall give such notice as may be prescribed to the person to whom the certificate was granted of his intention to revoke the certificate, stating the grounds therefor and the right of that person to apply to the Minister for an inquiry as to the reasons for the revocation.

(3) On application being made in the prescribed manner for an inquiry under subsection (2) the Minister shall refer the case to a Committee of Inquiry appointed by the Minister consisting of a chairman having judicial experience and such other persons as the Minister may think fit, and the Committee shall report their findings to the Minister.

(4) Where there is entered in a certificate of naturalisation granted to a person under the Act of 1935 the name of any child of that person, such entry shall for the purposes of this Act be deemed to be a certificate of naturalisation under the Act of 1935.

(5) A certificate of naturalisation granted or deemed under subsection (4) to have been granted under the Act of 1935 may be revoked in accordance with the provisions of this section and, upon such revocation, the person concerned shall cease to be an Irish citizen.

(6) Notice of the revocation of a certificate of naturalisation shall be published in Iris Oifigiúil."
littlerr wrote:
Mon Nov 01, 2021 8:26 pm
Yes. Naturalised citizenship will be revoked upon receiving a second naturalised citizenship, unless that second citizenship is received via marriage.

littlerr
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Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by littlerr » Tue Nov 02, 2021 1:38 pm

That is literally in the section (e) of the article that you pasted here.

Dub23
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Ireland

Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by Dub23 » Tue Nov 02, 2021 1:48 pm

Apologies, I clearly can't read. :-)
littlerr wrote:
Tue Nov 02, 2021 1:38 pm
That is literally in the section (e) of the article that you pasted here.

Obie
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Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by Obie » Tue Nov 02, 2021 4:56 pm

littlerr wrote:
Mon Nov 01, 2021 8:26 pm
Yes. Naturalised citizenship will be revoked upon receiving a second naturalised citizenship, unless that second citizenship is received via marriage.
I will not use the verb will, as that is not the language of the legislation.

The Act confers a discretion on the minister if a person acquired citizenship other than by marriage.

It does not say the minister "shall" or "must" revoke a certificate of naturalisation.

I accept in principle, a person who acquired another nationality, could have it revoked, but it is not mandatory.. The minister may not even exercise such a discretion.
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

littlerr
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Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by littlerr » Tue Nov 02, 2021 5:07 pm

That's right. I doubt if it ever happened or even will happen...

Obie
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Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by Obie » Tue Nov 02, 2021 5:13 pm

With the Supreme Court ruling last Spring that section 19 is unconstitutional, which open the door for all those who had their citizenship revoked through this unconstitutional provision, and with the minister having failed to make the necessary amendments to make it constitutional, I am afraid that section 19 is to all intent and purposes suspended.
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

Guti
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Spain

Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by Guti » Tue Nov 02, 2021 6:21 pm

Obie wrote:
Tue Nov 02, 2021 5:13 pm
With the Supreme Court ruling last Spring that section 19 is unconstitutional, which open the door for all those who had their citizenship revoked through this unconstitutional provision, and with the minister having failed to make the necessary amendments to make it constitutional, I am afraid that section 19 is to all intent and purposes suspended.
Great news thanks. I`m against it until it is justified. For example through criminal activities.

Nre123
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Ireland

Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by Nre123 » Sun Dec 19, 2021 7:09 pm

Do you need to register every year at Irish embassy if you live outside ireland ?

baqa
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Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by baqa » Mon Dec 20, 2021 11:50 am

Nre123 wrote:
Sun Dec 19, 2021 7:09 pm
Do you need to register every year at Irish embassy if you live outside ireland ?
My understanding is that the answer to this question is pretty much the same as the other answers in this thread. That is, technically yes you must - if you will be resident outside Ireland for more than 7 years. Even more concerning, the letter of the law doesn't give any provision to "catch up" - meaning if you thought you would be outside Ireland for 5 years but it turns into 8, and you didn't proactively register for the first years thinking you wouldn't need to, you're SOL.

Now, all that aside, as mentioned upthread this whole section and the related process are totally in limbo right now. And, even before that, there has always been a huge gulf between "may" and "will" - there has never been anyone whose citizenship has been revoked because they didn't register with the Irish embassy. Doesn't mean there won't be a first at some point, though - so if I gain my citizenship and if I ever reside outside Ireland, I plan on registering annually "just in case" even if I don't plan on residing outside Ireland for more than 7 years.

HTH.

alhakeem
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Ireland

Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by alhakeem » Thu Dec 23, 2021 7:37 am

Shakey wrote:
Mon Nov 01, 2021 10:20 pm
Guti wrote:
Mon Nov 01, 2021 8:59 pm
littlerr you are a beast!!!!!!! Are you lawyer?

And if the irish citizenship was obtained through marriage?
It "may" be revoked. Big world of difference to "will" be revoked.

I would be highly surprised if anyone has ever had Irish citizenship revoked for this reason. Practically its very difficult for the Irish government to even found something like that out and then even if they did I doubt they would chase somebody down to strip them.

It is on the statute book however so it is technically possible.
Yes Shakey ,I always prefer if people not to raise these questions, as it opens closed doors that can set laws and hire people their jobs to chase these things

Ppd
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Ireland

Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by Ppd » Wed Apr 06, 2022 8:02 am

Hi!

I am in this situation. I have been living outside Ireland with my Irish husband and our three girls for 8 years and it was until now I found out about this law. We were not aware this was needed... I completed the form and sent it by post BUT, does anyone know if we will receive some sort of confirmation from their side?

I live in Europe and I cannot lose my Irish nationality because it will affect our family status and all documentation, etc.

When receiving my naturalisation and citizenship (10 years ago) nothing was explained/informed...

Has anyone got confirmation after sending the form?

corkms
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Ireland

Re: Can the citizenship be revoked?

Post by corkms » Tue May 10, 2022 7:56 am

Apologies in advance for being uninformed, but I just learned about this law too. Does anyone know what the purpose of this is from the State's perspective?

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