Student visa application invalid - overstayer

Hi all
I'm so glad i found this very useful forum! My boyfriend applied for a student visa extension at beginning of Dec 09. He wasn't called for biometrics and at end of April they sent back his application as invalid saying he must reapply cos his payment didn't go through. He has reapplied and had his biometrics done now, but his previous visa expired end of December.
Is there any chance he will get the visa extension or will it be automatically refused because he is technically an overstayer? And will he have to wait another 4 months to get a decision?
Thanks for your help,
Lizzie

lizziet wrote:Hi all
I'm so glad i found this very useful forum! My boyfriend applied for a student visa extension at beginning of Dec 09. He wasn't called for biometrics and at end of April they sent back his application as invalid saying he must reapply cos his payment didn't go through. He has reapplied and had his biometrics done now, but his previous visa expired end of December.
Is there any chance he will get the visa extension or will it be automatically refused because he is technically an overstayer? And will he have to wait another 4 months to get a decision?
Thanks for your help,
Lizzie

nope, there shouldn't be any problem for him. Although if he was planning to apply for the 10 year long residence ILR, his continous legal stay has been broken.

As for how long his visa may take to process, it really depends. I've know people's application to take 6 months or even just 1 month.

joh118 wrote: nope, there shouldn't be any problem for him. Although if he was planning to apply for the 10 year long residence ILR, his continous legal stay has been broken.

As for how long his visa may take to process, it really depends. I've know people's application to take 6 months or even just 1 month.

I dont agree with Joh on this one since this is technically a new application done after visa expiration. I think he is gonna end up in trouble. Just the other day, there was a case where an application was returned due to improper photographs. The applicant send the same application with new photographs but his visa was refused tagging him an overstayer. Depends on the EC officer really. Wait and watch..

potterbond007 wrote:

joh118 wrote: nope, there shouldn't be any problem for him. Although if he was planning to apply for the 10 year long residence ILR, his continous legal stay has been broken.

As for how long his visa may take to process, it really depends. I've know people's application to take 6 months or even just 1 month.

I dont agree with Joh on this one since this is technically a new application done after visa expiration. I think he is gonna end up in trouble. Just the other day, there was a case where an application was returned due to improper photographs. The applicant send the same application with new photographs but his visa was refused tagging him an overstayer. Depends on the EC officer really. Wait and watch..

The user @potterbon007 is referencing would be me!

@lizziet

I'm sorry but the chance of his application being successful is very low just as in my case. When he sent his application back with proper payment, did he attach his CAS Reference Number from University? Also, you should understand an application sent for 2nd time would be considered as FRESH application by UKBA and hence his application would be refused stating the fact that his application was sent after his visa expiration.

The only thing he would be allowed to do is to re-apply back from his home country, his passport would be sent to the nearest Airport from where he has to collect it once his travel arrangements are made. I'm sorry this happened to your boy friend and many other Genuine students who happened to get stuck at this scenario.

Cheers

the OP never mentioned that his passport was kept by the UKBA. Therefore it is FINE to reapply.

It is only if you reapply and get refused, then you have to leave and get a new visa back home.

Why else would the UKBA advise him to reapply if they know that he has no chance?

in the case that the user above is talking about is that she submitted the wrong photo and she reapplied only to be rejected for a different reason, now she has to leave.

In YOUR CASE however, her photo issue is your payment issue, so it is fine to reapply. but just make sure your bank statements are still valid and you give the CAS number as it can catch people out. Remember, you are making a NEW fresh application.

crazy3gg wrote:

potterbond007 wrote:

joh118 wrote: nope, there shouldn't be any problem for him. Although if he was planning to apply for the 10 year long residence ILR, his continous legal stay has been broken.

As for how long his visa may take to process, it really depends. I've know people's application to take 6 months or even just 1 month.

I dont agree with Joh on this one since this is technically a new application done after visa expiration. I think he is gonna end up in trouble. Just the other day, there was a case where an application was returned due to improper photographs. The applicant send the same application with new photographs but his visa was refused tagging him an overstayer. Depends on the EC officer really. Wait and watch..

The user @potterbon007 is referencing would be me!

@lizziet

I'm sorry but the chance of his application being successful is very low just as in my case. When he sent his application back with proper payment, did he attach his CAS Reference Number from University? Also, you should understand an application sent for 2nd time would be considered as FRESH application by UKBA and hence his application would be refused stating the fact that his application was sent after his visa expiration.

The only thing he would be allowed to do is to re-apply back from his home country, his passport would be sent to the nearest Airport from where he has to collect it once his travel arrangements are made. I'm sorry this happened to your boy friend and many other Genuine students who happened to get stuck at this scenario.

Cheers

in your case, you had every chance to be granted a visa in the UK if you supplied the CAS number. so i'm afraid your statement "I'm sorry but the chance of his application being successful is very low just as in my case." is just wrong. he was never asked to leave the country just asked to reapply, just like when your application got refused because of the wrong photos.

if he messes it up again, this time round, then you would be right to say that "I'm sorry but the chance of his application being successful is very low just as in my case."

do you see?

potterbond007 wrote:

joh118 wrote: nope, there shouldn't be any problem for him. Although if he was planning to apply for the 10 year long residence ILR, his continous legal stay has been broken.

As for how long his visa may take to process, it really depends. I've know people's application to take 6 months or even just 1 month.

I dont agree with Joh on this one since this is technically a new application done after visa expiration. I think he is gonna end up in trouble. Just the other day, there was a case where an application was returned due to improper photographs. The applicant send the same application with new photographs but his visa was refused tagging him an overstayer. Depends on the EC officer really. Wait and watch..

no, it does not depend on the EC officer. they all follow the rules to the letter.

yes this is a new application I agree.

No, it won't "end up in trouble" as long as he gets his application right.

In, crazy3gg's case, she was ASKED to reapply. why on earth would they do that if she was gonna get refused.

crazy3gg being an overstayer was NOT a factor in the refusal decision, it was her CAS number. crazy3gg being an overstayer only mattered if she had the right of appeal or not.

come one everyone, let's stop giving people the wrong information. Only advise if we know for sure.

This person could've have gone back home for nothing.

joh118 wrote:
no, it does not depend on the EC officer. they all follow the rules to the letter.

yes this is a new application I agree.

No, it won't "end up in trouble" as long as he gets his application right.

In, crazy3gg's case, she was ASKED to reapply. why on earth would they do that if she was gonna get refused.

crazy3gg being an overstayer was NOT a factor in the refusal decision, it was her CAS number. crazy3gg being an overstayer only mattered if she had the right of appeal or not.

If it was refused for the CAS number then why wasn't crazy3gg given the right to appeal calling him an overstayer? I have no idea why the UKBA asks to apply if there is no chance of an application being successfull. A lot of cases actually depend on the particular EC officer who checks your file. A fine example of different EC officers taking different decisions is the admin review cases taking place in all countries. Once EC officer makes a mistake with a decision and we try and ask the other EC officer to set things right. I am not giving any wrong info here. Just stating facts that could/could not happen. This is no debate is it. Every scenario that could happen should not be overlooked in a case and if your finding it hard to accept it, then that's your problem.

lizziet wrote: He has reapplied and had his biometrics done now, but his previous visa expired end of December.

If he has provided all necessary documentary evidence(s) as per rules/guidance applicable on the date of (re)application, then there should be no reason to worry.

It will be treated as an "out-of-time" application but if all requirements are met, leave should be granted. If the application is refused for any reason, he will not get the right to appeal ('coz of out-of-time application) and, perhaps, end up in the same situation as crazy3gg.

As advised by joh118, even if approval is granted he will not qualify for 10yr. long residence ILR as this out-of-time application has reset his clock.



regards

sushdmehta wrote:

lizziet wrote: He has reapplied and had his biometrics done now, but his previous visa expired end of December.

If he has provided all necessary documentary evidence(s) as per rules/guidance applicable on the date of (re)application, then there should be no reason to worry.

It will be treated as an "out-of-time" application but if all requirements are met, leave should be granted. If the application is refused for any reason, he will not get the right to appeal ('coz of out-of-time application) and, perhaps, end up in the same situation as crazy3gg.

As advised by joh118, even if approval is granted he will not qualify for 10yr. long residence ILR as this out-of-time application has reset his clock.



regards

So his documentation should be perfect... Thanx for that clarification sush..

potterbond007 wrote:

joh118 wrote:
no, it does not depend on the EC officer. they all follow the rules to the letter.

yes this is a new application I agree.

No, it won't "end up in trouble" as long as he gets his application right.

In, crazy3gg's case, she was ASKED to reapply. why on earth would they do that if she was gonna get refused.

crazy3gg being an overstayer was NOT a factor in the refusal decision, it was her CAS number. crazy3gg being an overstayer only mattered if she had the right of appeal or not.

If it was refused for the CAS number then why wasn't crazy3gg given the right to appeal calling him an overstayer? I have no idea why the UKBA asks to apply if there is no chance of an application being successfull. A lot of cases actually depend on the particular EC officer who checks your file. A fine example of different EC officers taking different decisions is the admin review cases taking place in all countries. Once EC officer makes a mistake with a decision and we try and ask the other EC officer to set things right. I am not giving any wrong info here. Just stating facts that could/could not happen. This is no debate is it. Every scenario that could happen should not be overlooked in a case and if your finding it hard to accept it, then that's your problem.

I don't want to argue with you about the EC officers.

but

potterbond007 wrote:If it was refused for the CAS number then why wasn't crazy3gg given the right to appeal calling him an overstayer?

In answer to your question, crazy3gg was refused due to no CAS number BUT wasn't given the right to appeal because she made an out of time application. It has no factor in the decision making process. If she had provided the CAS number, she would have been fine. Just as if the OP's bf submits the correct payment details with CAS and bank statements, then he should be fine.

potterbond007 wrote:I have no idea why the UKBA asks to apply if there is no chance of an application being successfull.

maybe because the applicant actualy has a chance to get a new visa???

joh118 wrote:

potterbond007 wrote:

joh118 wrote:
no, it does not depend on the EC officer. they all follow the rules to the letter.

yes this is a new application I agree.

No, it won't "end up in trouble" as long as he gets his application right.

In, crazy3gg's case, she was ASKED to reapply. why on earth would they do that if she was gonna get refused.

crazy3gg being an overstayer was NOT a factor in the refusal decision, it was her CAS number. crazy3gg being an overstayer only mattered if she had the right of appeal or not.

If it was refused for the CAS number then why wasn't crazy3gg given the right to appeal calling him an overstayer? I have no idea why the UKBA asks to apply if there is no chance of an application being successfull. A lot of cases actually depend on the particular EC officer who checks your file. A fine example of different EC officers taking different decisions is the admin review cases taking place in all countries. Once EC officer makes a mistake with a decision and we try and ask the other EC officer to set things right. I am not giving any wrong info here. Just stating facts that could/could not happen. This is no debate is it. Every scenario that could happen should not be overlooked in a case and if your finding it hard to accept it, then that's your problem.

I don't want to argue with you about the EC officers.

but

potterbond007 wrote:If it was refused for the CAS number then why wasn't crazy3gg given the right to appeal calling him an overstayer?

In answer to your question, crazy3gg was refused due to no CAS number BUT wasn't given the right to appeal because she made an out of time application. It has no factor in the decision making process. If she had provided the CAS number, she would have been fine. Just as if the OP's bf submits the correct payment details with CAS and bank statements, then he should be fine.

potterbond007 wrote:I have no idea why the UKBA asks to apply if there is no chance of an application being successfull.

maybe because the applicant actualy has a chance to get a new visa???

sush has already clarified this situation.. i accept that there may be a chance to get a new visa but if refused due to any reason, there wouldn't be a right to appeal.. i would like to know if this particular case is successful though..

Thank you all SO much for your replies. I think the Tier 4 rules are so confusing and it's really terrible that students can be classed as an overstayer just cos their payment doesn't go through even if it's not their fault. It's all very stressful and I think it will put most people off coming to study here.
My boyfriend's letter did ask him to reapply within a certain timeframe and he had to do his biometrics within 3 days of being invited so I'm hoping that means he has some chance of getting his visa (also they did return his passport). But obviously if there is even the tiniest thing wrong with his application he will be refused! I know he did have to get a CAS from his college to send with his new application and he got help from the college with completing the form.
Thanks again - when I get any news I will post it on the forum...
Lizzie

lizziet wrote:Thank you all SO much for your replies. I think the Tier 4 rules are so confusing and it's really terrible that students can be classed as an overstayer just cos their payment doesn't go through even if it's not their fault. It's all very stressful and I think it will put most people off coming to study here.
My boyfriend's letter did ask him to reapply within a certain timeframe and he had to do his biometrics within 3 days of being invited so I'm hoping that means he has some chance of getting his visa (also they did return his passport). But obviously if there is even the tiniest thing wrong with his application he will be refused! I know he did have to get a CAS from his college to send with his new application and he got help from the college with completing the form.
Thanks again - when I get any news I will post it on the forum...
Lizzie

did he get new bank statements? because that usually catches the others out.

joh118 wrote: did he get new bank statements? because that usually catches the others out.

Thanks joh118 - yes, i just checked with him and he sent a new bank statement and a CAS. I'm just keeping fingers crossed now!!!!

lizziet wrote:Hi all
I'm so glad i found this very useful forum! My boyfriend applied for a student visa extension at beginning of Dec 09. He wasn't called for biometrics and at end of April they sent back his application as invalid saying he must reapply cos his payment didn't go through. He has reapplied and had his biometrics done now, but his previous visa expired end of December.
Is there any chance he will get the visa extension or will it be automatically refused because he is technically an overstayer? And will he have to wait another 4 months to get a decision?
Thanks for your help,
Lizzie

I was reading to all the opinion everyone had to give Lizziet for the problem she had been going through and I would like to thank to everyone for sharing their opinion. One important thing I would like to share with everyone to avoid this kind of small error in payment which might turn out to be a big problem is MAKE A POSTAL ORDER PAYMENT TO THE HOME OFFICE.This is one of the secure and 100% payment gaurantee to the HO. I have been extending my visa for last 6 yrs and never had a problem with postal order.

All the best to Lizziet.

Hi Everyone, My case is similar to Lizziet BF case. I applied to extend my student visa in December 09 (Current Visa Expire end of dec 2009), Didn't get no acknowledgement letter to confirm the receipt of my application, no letter for biometrics either. After loads of letters to the HO, I finally receive a letter in late april 2010. The letter did say they couldnt take money out my card for some reasons and therefore render my application invalid. I was told I can reapply but no time scale have been given as to when I can reapply. Prior to this I have the chance to apply for PWS as I've just finished my masters but decided to extend the student visa to do a course that interest me.

Due to the fact that I need to have some money in my acc for at least 28 days, I decided to deposit money for that period. For this reason, I'll have gone over the 28 days (as people say - but the letter gave no time scale) from the letter date.

The wicked of all is that I have been married to a british citizen for more than a year but I didn't want to put in the FLR(M) because we'll both be aged 21 (a day difference in our dob) at the end of the year.

Can anyone suggest what to do considering the fact I'm now an overstayer??

I suggest the following but need more ideas from people.

1- I should reapply for the Tier 4 and wait for a decision

2- I should put in PSW

3- I should put in FLR(M) - Remeber we are not 21 yet and i've recently been hearing cases where the application was hold until we both turn 21.

Can anyone help please??

Regards

James

ls001008 wrote:Hi Everyone, My case is similar to Lizziet BF case. I applied to extend my student visa in December 09 (Current Visa Expire end of dec 2009), Didn't get no acknowledgement letter to confirm the receipt of my application, no letter for biometrics either. After loads of letters to the HO, I finally receive a letter in late april 2010. The letter did say they couldnt take money out my card for some reasons and therefore render my application invalid. I was told I can reapply but no time scale have been given as to when I can reapply. Prior to this I have the chance to apply for PWS as I've just finished my masters but decided to extend the student visa to do a course that interest me.

Due to the fact that I need to have some money in my acc for at least 28 days, I decided to deposit money for that period. For this reason, I'll have gone over the 28 days (as people say - but the letter gave no time scale) from the letter date.

The wicked of all is that I have been married to a british citizen for more than a year but I didn't want to put in the FLR(M) because we'll both be aged 21 (a day difference in our dob) at the end of the year.

Can anyone suggest what to do considering the fact I'm now an overstayer??

I suggest the following but need more ideas from people.

1- I should reapply for the Tier 4 and wait for a decision

2- I should put in PSW

3- I should put in FLR(M) - Remeber we are not 21 yet and i've recently been hearing cases where the application was hold until we both turn 21.

Can anyone help please??

Regards

James

Go back (ASAP) to home country and apply for spouse visa from there after you turn 21.

regards

@ sushdmehta, Thanks for your response.

few questions,

1- Why ASAP
2- Currently I'm working, does it mean I'm working illegally or something and if yes can it affect my future application
3- Since we've been married for more than a year, will I be given 2 more FLR(M) visa combining the lenght of our probation to be almost 4 years?

Kind regards,

James

1. You have no valid leave to enter / remain, therefore an illegal alien.
2. With no leave to enter/remain in the UK you are not entitled to work.
3. The duration of the spouse visa is 27 months, as per UKBA website.

If you do not leave without further delay (I guess it's within 28 days of receiving refusal), you may be termed an overstayer, and that may negatively impact any leave to enter/remain applications in future.



regards

sushdmehta, Thank you for reply..

I did spoke to a solicitor. He did advised me to resend the application for tier 4. He said worse come to worse (hopefully not) I can make application for discretionary leave (DL) base on my family life.

What do you suggest?

I look forward to receiving your response.

Regards,
James

I would have suggested you to resubmit your Tier 4 application had you not stated that it's close to / already 28 days since your received the refusal. When they advise the applicants to reapply, they do accept the applications (as out-of-time applications) when it is done without delay. In your case, UKBA may refuse to accept the application now, given the delay between refusal and (re)submission.

I cannot comment on the DL route that your solicitor has suggested.

What you must remember is that you have no legal status in UK at this point in time. More you delay corrective action, greater are the chances that this will come back to bite you (later).

The choices are in front of you .. and it is for you to decide.

regards

Hi all
My boyfriend got his letter today - he has been refused a visa based on something to do with his college. I only just spoke to him so haven't seen the letter but I know the college is category "A" - is that not good enough under the new rules?
We are devastated but will go to see a solicitor ASAP. But I am not hopeful now.
Any advice would be welcome
Thanks again for all your help over the past week.
Lizzie

Education institutions offer many courses. So whether the registered sponsor is rated "A" or "Z" is irrelevant here. The question here is whether the course one has got admission in meets the stated requirements for Tier 4 visa? Read What is an acceptable course of study for a Tier 4 (General) student?. If the course isn't at a level accepted under Tier 4, even if he applies for EC from home country for the same course the application will not be approved.

No option but to leave the country ASAP / before any stipulated date.


regards