Proof of residence in UK for citizenship

hello dear experts

I have an urgent query regarding my application for citizenship. I am married to a british citizen and hold an European travel document. the NCS advised that due to me having travel documents instead of passports to show my residency in UK then I need extra documentations to proof residency. even though my travel document get stamped each time I return to the UK after holidays! I am not a student. also I'm unemployed and don't claim any benefits. so I can't provide any of the documents listed in the guide for residency requirements. I have asked my GP for a letter confirming registration at surgery and list of my appointments, but I haven't been to GP many times during the 3 years period!!!
has anyone been in this situation too? what advise could you give me before i submit my application?? is there anything I could do? and could this result in rejection of my application?? I'm so confused please help

many thanks

It is not mandatory and NCS is being extra cautious, too cautious in my opinion.
If you have tenancy agreement, bills, bank statements, that all goes into proving your residency and presence in UK.

Thank you for your reply! The NCS lady has phoned the Home Office to ask about this and they were the ones who said all that! She even mentioned that the answer was given by a senior officer! Also they told her that GP letter may still not be helpful!
I told them I could provide bills and bank statements but she said it's not what they ask for! I'm really confused and don't know what to do, my application is on hold now at the NCS!!

Thank you for your help

Are you considered to be a EEA/EU National?

If not, what documents have you used to apply for your EU Travel Documents? Assuming you had to provide evidence of residency.

Have you ever used a Dentist, Optician, went to a College, University or a School? Does your wife have any letters from the Council with your name on it? Does she have a Tenancy Agreement with your name? Have you ever had any support from the Government like benefits, job seekers allowance?

Have you tried going to your local branch and asking for Bank Statements and having them stamped?

Can you elaborate a bit more?

If you can't satisfy the residency requirements and provide the sufficient proof, your application will most likely be refused.

I am not an EU national and I don't think I understood what you meant by what documents I used for my travel document! I entered the UK with a spouse visa stamped on my travel document. then I applied to ILR last year. my travel document is what I use for travel and it has all the stamps on entry to UK.
I have not gone to a dentist and only once to an optician! I do not study or go to school or uni. we do have council tax bills with both my husband and my name on it. but NCS didn't copy them she said Home office don't need them.
I have used many bills, letters addressed to me for my application for IRL but again NCS said they are not required for citizenship!

could you please explain what you meant by going to the local branch for the bank statements?

many thanks

I'm not sure that I can help, however have a couple of questions to see if either I or anyone else is able to comment further.

What type of 'European Travel Document' is it that you have? Additionally did the NCS give you a list of acceptable evidence that you can provide (As they don't appear to be accepting what you have suggested)?

Thank you for your reply
It's a convention 1951 travel document
The NCS phoned the home office during my appointment and they advised of the documents mentioned in the guide i.e either employment letters, uni or school letters or benefits letters! When I mentioned that these don't apply to me they asked for the GP letter!

Thank you for your help

dmukhtar wrote:I entered the UK with a spouse visa stamped on my travel document. then I applied to ILR last year. my travel document is what I use for travel and it has all the stamps on entry to UK.

dmukhtar wrote:It's a convention 1951 travel document

I understand that this particular travel document is issued to those who have permission to remain in the UK as a refugee. Something that's slightly confusing is that you say you entered the UK with a spouse visa stamped on your travel document. Could you perhaps elaborate on your immigration history, which led to your ILR, in order to understand why the HO are requesting this particular evidence? It may be easier to comment further if the context and background is understood.

Sorry for the confusion. But my travel document was issued to me after seeking asylum in an EU country not the UK. So it's not a UK travel document. Then when I got married. My husband is british so I applied for spouse visa to the UK. And was issued the visa in 2012. In 2014 I was eligible for the ILR and now I'm eligible for citizenship based on my 3 years residency as wife of british citizen.
I hope this clears the confusion.

Thanks for that explanation, it cleared up that confusion. However I'm not entirely sure I can add much to help. I have seen instances on this forum where additional proof of evidence is requested by the home office, when passports are lost. I can only guess that the HO do not accept your particular travel document as a valid means of verifying your residence (reason unknown).

The following thread is an example where an applicant had to provide additional evidence to prove residence, but still didn't have all the required items. But in that case the application was approved with discretion. http://www.immigrationboards.com/britis ... 85378.html

Your case is different, as you don't appear to have any evidence that they consider acceptable. Does the list of evidence mentioned in the above thread appear similar to what you were told? I see that it suggests the following for those who are self-sufficient. Would you be able to supply those as evidence of your residence in the UK? I'm assuming that's the category you fall under as you are not a student, do not work (employed or self-employed) or claim any benefits?

- Statement(s) of funds, assets and any other sources of income held.

If you could find a way to find out why your travel document isn't acceptable, that would help. The guidance below certainly refers to either passport or travel document. I'm conscious that NCS staff would probably follow the basic AN form guidance, which I believe only refers to passports & not travel documents, unless I'm mistaken

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... 141212.pdf

I thought so too! however because the NCS had not seen a similar case before so they phoned the home office straight away and were informed that I need extra proof or residency!! according to the thread you sent the HO didn't accept bank statements so how to prove funds/assets if self sufficient?! I am supported financially by my husband through out those 3 years and i could only prove that with bank statements i guess! but HO don't want them!!!!

thank you again for the help

dmukhtar wrote: according to the thread you sent the HO didn't accept bank statements so how to prove funds/assets if self sufficient?! I am supported financially by my husband through out those 3 years and i could only prove that with bank statements i guess! but HO don't want them!!!

I think in that particular instance, the HO were after school/college attendance records over a few years when the applicant was a student (so they didn't accept bank statement there).

But as you are stating you were self sufficient, then based on the evidence that was mentioned on the first page of that thread, bank statements should be acceptable IMHO (May be with an explanation in the additional information section of the form stating that they are being submitted as evidence of self-sufficiency because you were supported by your spouse throughout your residence). From what I recall that list was emailed to the applicant by a caseworker there. The question is, whether the NCS staff will accept it, it's worth calling them to find out.

I'm wondering whether you'd have a better chance if your evidence was seen by a caseworker/senior caseworker, rather than information passed on second hand by NCS staff. But as theres a risk of refusal associated with that and you'd have to apply directly by post with original documents, I wouldn't really be able to recommend it. I wonder whether you'd be given the same response if you went through a different NCS.

cs95tdg wrote:Thanks for that explanation, it cleared up that confusion. However I'm not entirely sure I can add much to help. I have seen instances on this forum where additional proof of evidence is requested by the home office, when passports are lost. I can only guess that the HO do not accept your particular travel document as a valid means of verifying your residence (reason unknown).

The following thread is an example where an applicant had to provide additional evidence to prove residence, but still didn't have all the required items. But in that case the application was approved with discretion. http://www.immigrationboards.com/britis ... 85378.html

Your case is different, as you don't appear to have any evidence that they consider acceptable. Does the list of evidence mentioned in the above thread appear similar to what you were told? I see that it suggests the following for those who are self-sufficient. Would you be able to supply those as evidence of your residence in the UK? I'm assuming that's the category you fall under as you are not a student, do not work (employed or self-employed) or claim any benefits?

- Statement(s) of funds, assets and any other sources of income held.

Hi cs95tdg,

Just a quick note, the letter which I received asking for further evidence of residence, mentioned either travel documents or passport and in absence of which to provide addtional evidence of residence such as on the annex; which as you know, info was still missing; which I had sent as my passport with ILR was stolen etc.

I am surprised that the Home Office ( via NCS ) mentioned in OP's case that they won't accept the travel documents.

Someone else on the board can perhaps confirm this, who received the same letter as me for additional info,

the letter asks for passport or travel documents, and in absence of which, to provide those additional documents etc.

hellonewhere wrote:I am surprised that the Home Office ( via NCS ) mentioned in OP's case that they won't accept the travel documents.

Yes hellenewhere, I did notice the difference in your circumstances where you lost your passport; whereas here it's a matter of the home office not accepting the travel document provided by the OP.

It is strange that in this case it's the NCS who are refusing to accept the travel document. That's why I am now wondering whether trying a different NCS may be the way to go, if not take a printout of the guidance and show it to the NCS staff. It's illogical, but why would they refuse this document which is clearly stated in the guidance.

@cs95tdg, I have just looked at the letter and it says to provide passport or travel documents, in absence of which to provide alternative evidence of residence.

I agree with you that the OP ought to take a print out of the guidance and show it to the NCS staff or try a different NCS.

Thank you all for the help.. the NCS has asked me (after speaking with the HO on the phone) to bring extra evidence of residency after seeing my travel document! I explained that I have all stamps on the document as if it would be stamped if it was a passport. so there shouldn't be any difference between a passport or a travel document! but as i mentioned the NCS spoke to a senior officer from the HO and he asked for the other evidences... so I don't think its the NCS who refused the travel document as a proof or residency.

Hi,

Am sorry for the trouble you are having.

Is it possible for you to print the guidance which cs95tdg linked upthread as it clearly states that evidence of residence is a passport or travel documents. That's the home office own guidance. Also, the further proof of residence is only required when a passport or travel document is missing. This is what my own caseworker ( also a senior ) informed me when I queried why I had to send alternative evidence of residence.

If you could take this guidance with you to the NCS, it might clear things up. Communications via the phone to the home office might have been misinterpreted by the NCS staff.

Also as cs95tdg suggested - is it possible for you to go to a different NCS as they might be more knowledgeable in regards to the travel documents.

It's surprising to hear that the home office has asked for further evidence of residence despite providing a travel document - which is in direct conflict to their own guidance.

Dear hellonewhere

Thank you for your message. And yes I guess I will print out the HO guide which clearly says passports or travel documents as evidence of residency and show it to the NCS. I hope this would help! My application is pending at the NCS now awaiting further documentation (i.e GP letters) so I don't think it would be easy to switch to another NCS!
Do you think seeing an immigration solicitor would help? I have no experience in this and don't know any solicitor or advisor!!

Thank you all for the help

@dmukhtar, you can ask for your documents back from the NCS and try another NCS, if you wish. The only thing is I'm guessing you may lose the NCS fee.

What I would do if it were me is go in person to the NCS with a printout of the guidance and the Url (so that they can look it up themselves) ask one last time whether they are willing to accept your travel document. If they say no ask for your application and supporting documents to be returned (you can give any reason you wish, e.g. You've decided against applying at this point in time as you do not have any of the evidence they are requesting). Thereafter try a different NCS. As your application hasn't yet been submitted to the HO you should be free to do this.

As hellenewhere has explained, sometimes the phone conversation between the NCS and HO may not have clearly explained what your travel document was & the fact that it contained entry and exit stamps for all your travel in and out of the country.

Well the NCS didn't refuse to take up my application. They just asked me (after consulting the HO) to bring them a GP letter with details of my visits. they will send out my application after I do so. Do you think I should go ahead with it and also show them a print out of the guidance?
Or would that still make a problem? as they did say it would still be discretionary!

Many thanks

If it makes them happier, then there is no harm in supplying what they want. However, there's also no harm in pointing out that travel documents satisfies 2.1:

[url=https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/chapter-18-naturalisation-at-discretion-nationality-instructions]Chapter 18: naturalisation at discretion (nationality instructions)[/url] > Annex B: residence requirements wrote:2. Checking the residence requirements
2.1 We should assess whether the applicant has met the residence
requirements from checking the following:
 original passport(s) or travel document(s) which have been endorsed to show arrival in and departure from the United Kingdom; or

Dear all,

As an EEA National what is the proof of residence you suggest I can show to HO?

Regards

vinny wrote:If it makes them happier, then there is no harm in supplying what they want. However, there's also no harm in pointing out that travel documents satisfies 2.1:

[url=https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/chapter-18-naturalisation-at-discretion-nationality-instructions]Chapter 18: naturalisation at discretion (nationality instructions)[/url] > Annex B: residence requirements wrote:2. Checking the residence requirements
2.1 We should assess whether the applicant has met the residence
requirements from checking the following:
 original passport(s) or travel document(s) which have been endorsed to show arrival in and departure from the United Kingdom; or

I would be interested in this, too, because we found lots of contradictory instructions. The guidelines are unfortunately far from as clear as you quote them, because that statement above is modified in a later paragraph using an exception, but it is not quite clear what it is modified to. One way of reading is that you need to be employed or studying, but clearly that would not be compatible with the legal situation.

So what are the most likely documents available for a self sufficient resident under EU/EEA regulations?