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Immigration & Residence Bill - January 2008

Forum to discuss all things Blarney | Ireland immigration

Moderators: Casa, push, JAJ, ca.funke, Amber, zimba, vinny, Obie, EUsmileWEallsmile, batleykhan, meself2, geriatrix, John, ChetanOjha, archigabe, Administrator

microlab
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Immigration & Residence Bill - January 2008

Post by microlab » Tue Jan 01, 2008 2:36 pm

In an interview with The Irish Times, Brian Lenihan said the Immigration and Residence Bill, brought forward by his predecessor, had been withdrawn for "legal fine tuning" and would be reintroduced in January.


http://home.eircom.net/content/irelandc ... =Eircomnet

runie80
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Post by runie80 » Tue Jan 01, 2008 6:33 pm

legal fine tuning= More red tape :twisted:
In any moment of decision, the best thing you can do is the right thing, the next best thing is the wrong thing, and the worst thing you can do is nothing.

microlab
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Post by microlab » Tue Jan 01, 2008 10:30 pm

runie80 wrote:legal fine tuning= More red tape :twisted:

We just dont know
at this point what gift they have wrapped up for all of us! :lol: :x
Residence,nationality and DNA data base are in pipeline as far as I can tell......EU question is up for grabs...I dont know if I would to bet on that one...time will tell....

runie80
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Post by runie80 » Tue Jan 01, 2008 10:43 pm

Lets Hope some good News come out for those who still waiting in Ireland for EU-1

I can understand the frustration as i went through it.

Lets Start a new year on a "positive note" :lol:
In any moment of decision, the best thing you can do is the right thing, the next best thing is the wrong thing, and the worst thing you can do is nothing.

microlab
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Post by microlab » Mon Jan 28, 2008 1:32 am

Well,.....it has been approved and we shall see very soon all details...this is just little appetizer :wink:

http://www.sbpost.ie/post/pages/p/story ... qqqx=1.asp

archigabe
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Post by archigabe » Mon Jan 28, 2008 10:57 am

I think the main proposals are for tests in English for Citizenship applicants and the controversial I.D card proposal for foreign nationals...Still I can't believe they will give the gardai power to stop anyone looking foreign (ie coloured) and ask them for papers on the streets.

joesoap101
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Post by joesoap101 » Mon Jan 28, 2008 8:38 pm

I think politicians aren't being open with the public. What they conveniently fail to mention is that Irish citizens have ID cards coming their way too... Why? Because Ireland basically is the UK's b*tch (there is no other way to euphamise this!) and it looks likely that it will be introduced there despite the opposition to it, and as we all know, Ireland copies just about everything the UK does, except the good things like coherent immigration laws!. Also, now that the common travel area has been reviewed and e-borders will be implemented passport checks are likely to be started from 2009 onwards between the UK and Ireland (the NI issue has yet to be resolved but unlikely that border checks will be instated between NI and the ROI).

The idea of using the GNIB card as an ID is not such a bad thing, it will make it far more useful and possibly justify its EUR100 price tag. It already has a chip and no one knows what exactly they store on that chip.

Its unfortunate if you are non-white because experience has shown (Germany, France, the Netherlands) that it will be non-whites who will be profiled and harassed for ID checks.

microlab
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Post by microlab » Tue Jan 29, 2008 1:21 am

News are coming thick and fast :wink:
This one is from todays examiner.

***Justice Minister Brian Lenihan believes a way can be found to allow Ireland to access the EU's massive database of information on visitors to mainland Europe. Because Ireland and Britain are not part of the Schengen travel free area within the EU, they cannot access the common EU Schengen database, which allows member states to exchange information on visa applicants and to see if and why a person has already been refused a visa by another country. Minister Lenihan said Ireland would be more than willing to give the Schengen countries access to the Irish visa database in exchange for access to theirs.***

mendo
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Post by mendo » Tue Jan 29, 2008 7:13 am

The amendments take account of developments in immigration and citizenship but retain its key features. It will include proficiency tests in English for long-term residency.


It looks that they want proficiency tests in English for long-term residency, not only for citizenship.

Mendo
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Last edited by mendo on Tue Feb 22, 2011 4:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

microlab
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Post by microlab » Tue Jan 29, 2008 8:33 am

Yeah, thats what I thought when I read it first time.
Its only newspaper article so I wouldnt think it has any merit .
Hopefully we`ll see that Immigration and Residence Bill soon.

archigabe
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Post by archigabe » Tue Jan 29, 2008 11:29 am

Actually the Sunday Tribune of last sunday (27th Jan) also mentioned the English or Irish language tests as requirement for citizenship.

archigabe
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Post by archigabe » Tue Jan 29, 2008 11:33 am

microlab wrote:News are coming thick and fast :wink:
This one is from todays examiner.

***Justice Minister Brian Lenihan believes a way can be found to allow Ireland to access the EU's massive database of information on visitors to mainland Europe. Because Ireland and Britain are not part of the Schengen travel free area within the EU, they cannot access the common EU Schengen database, which allows member states to exchange information on visa applicants and to see if and why a person has already been refused a visa by another country. Minister Lenihan said Ireland would be more than willing to give the Schengen countries access to the Irish visa database in exchange for access to theirs.***
Actually, this goes all the way back to 2002...the eejits want access to the database without giving up any immigration controls.

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/Lex ... 92:EN:HTML
2002/192/EC: Council Decision of 28 February 2002 concerning Ireland's request to take part in some of the provisions of the Schengen acquis

microlab
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Post by microlab » Tue Jan 29, 2008 3:45 pm

as requirement for citizenship.
Archie,this time is for long term residence if its to belive to that article.

ac3340
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Post by ac3340 » Tue Jan 29, 2008 6:22 pm


archigabe
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Post by archigabe » Tue Jan 29, 2008 7:34 pm

Ireland must be the only country in the world to insist on language tests for just residency...the only other country I suspect that can also go so far could be Germany.

yankeegirl
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Post by yankeegirl » Tue Jan 29, 2008 9:09 pm

Ireland must be the only country in the world to insist on language tests for just residency...the only other country I suspect that can also go so far could be Germany
The UK is talking about introducing it as a requirement for entry clearance.

archigabe
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Post by archigabe » Tue Jan 29, 2008 10:11 pm

yankeegirl wrote:
Ireland must be the only country in the world to insist on language tests for just residency...the only other country I suspect that can also go so far could be Germany
The UK is talking about introducing it as a requirement for entry clearance.
Wow! Somehow I don't think it will be that easy in the U.K, especially when there is a significant population from some ex colonies who would then be completely lost...and I don't think they are the kind of people who would accept things quietly.
http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... ht=#140222

mendo
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Post by mendo » Tue Jan 29, 2008 10:28 pm

Unfortunately the biggest surprise is not the English language test, but the request for a police clearance certificate for the LTR applicants, retrospective as well.

More details discussed here:

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewtopic.php?t=22972

I wonder how long it will take to introduce this requirement for the naturalization!

Mendo
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Last edited by mendo on Tue Feb 22, 2011 4:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

microlab
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Post by microlab » Wed Jan 30, 2008 2:11 am

IMMIGRATION, RESIDENCE AND PROTECTION BILL 2008

***********************************************************
http://www.oireachtas.ie/documents/bill ... B0208D.pdf

***********************************************************

archigabe
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Post by archigabe » Wed Jan 30, 2008 4:25 pm

Thanks for that Microlab. More details here

http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Pages/La ... ation_Bill
http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Pages/Im ... _Bill_2008
Among the innovative features of the Bill are provisions to prevent the misuse of the judicial process by a foreign national solely for the purposes of frustrating their removal from the State.
Seems like this government would really like to tamper with the individual's right to justice via the legal system...who decides what is 'misuse' of the legal system?

Here's another statement of complete, utter hypocricy and stupidity...
Part 2 sets out the classes of persons who are deemed to have permission to be present in the State and makes it clear that the Bill does not affect any EU-related obligations of the State affecting immigration matters e.g. obligations arising from the Council Directive on Free Movement of Persons which are given effect in Irish law by the European Communities (Free Movement of Persons) (No. 2) Regulations 2006 (S.I. No. 656 of 2006).

This part is somewhat reasonable
An important innovation in the Bill will be the introduction of a statutory long-term resident status. This status will be available for those who have at least 5 years’ satisfactory residence in the State (periods as an asylum-seeker or short-term student will not be reckoned) and will bring with it access to the employment market and State-funded services and benefits generally on a par with Irish citizens. The benefits of this special status are an acknowledgement that over time, those who migrate to Ireland contribute increasingly to Irish society and the Irish economy and have earned this status and the stability that it brings. There will be provision for shorter qualifying periods where, the Minister determines that this would be desirable in order to attract particularly sought-after migrants. This should be seen in tandem with the Employment Permits Act 2006 and the "Green Card" type employment permits, the holders of which will qualify for the accelerated process for becoming a long-term resident.

And we all know what happens to applications when INIS is allowed to make decisions.
Under the Bill, the functions currently carried out by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner will be subsumed into the Irish Nationality and Immigration Service (INIS), the administrative agency of the Minister’s Department.
This part is a bit puzzling.
Part 8: General
Requirements on persons embarking to provide documents and information when requested; and requirement in relation to the provision by carriers of date in relation to persons embarking from the State;Special provisions relating to judicial review;

and some more dodgy stuff..
Judicial Review (Section 118) – this provision builds on the existing provisions at section 5 of the Illegal Immigrants (Trafficking) Act 2000. The intention is to prevent the misuse of the judicial process by a foreign national solely for the purposes of frustrating his or her removal from the State;
· Marriage of foreign nationals in the State (Section 123) – this provision is intended to provide a mechanism to combat marriages of convenience which are being increasingly availed of to avoid removal from the State. Foreign nationals who wish to contract a marriage in the State will be required to be lawfully resident in the State at the time of the marriage and notify the Minister of the intended marriage

microlab
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Post by microlab » Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:59 pm

· Marriage of foreign nationals in the State (Section 123) – this provision is intended to provide a mechanism to combat marriages of convenience which are being increasingly availed of to avoid removal from the State. Foreign nationals who wish to contract a marriage in the State will be required to be lawfully resident in the State at the time of the marriage and notify the Minister of the intended marriage
Similar to certificate of aproval in the UK.(as usual)
I reckon people will need some kind of permission to get married.

http://www.ind.homeoffice.gov.uk/visiti ... fapproval/

ferrellk
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Post by ferrellk » Wed Jan 30, 2008 8:34 pm

Coming from a visa-free state....I find this interesting:
The Bill will facilitate the possibility that in the future, visa exemption will be available for nationals of those countries only for short-duration visits, and that where a person from a "visa-free" country wishes to migrate to Ireland or come for a long (over 3 months) visit, he or she will have to get pre-clearance by applying for a visa in advance.

joesoap101
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Post by joesoap101 » Wed Jan 30, 2008 10:43 pm

ferrellk wrote:Coming from a visa-free state....I find this interesting:
The Bill will facilitate the possibility that in the future, visa exemption will be available for nationals of those countries only for short-duration visits, and that where a person from a "visa-free" country wishes to migrate to Ireland or come for a long (over 3 months) visit, he or she will have to get pre-clearance by applying for a visa in advance.
Again, the above basically explains the pre entry clearance system that the UK introduced for those who do not require tourist visas who intends to stay in the UK for 6 months or more.

microlab
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Post by microlab » Thu Jan 31, 2008 12:20 pm


Ben
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Post by Ben » Thu Jan 31, 2008 2:34 pm

microlab wrote:Bit of "digest" here@

http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/frontp ... tml?via=me
"No foreign national will be in any doubt as to whether he or she is lawfully in the State. If you have a permission from the Minister you will be lawfully in the State; but if you have not you will be unlawfully in the State; and unlawful presence brings with it the obligation on the person to leave the State."
Erm, if you have permission from the Minister you will be lawfully in the State; but if you have not you will be unlawfully in the State? What if the Minister is in breach of EU law by refusing someone permission to be in the State?

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