Naturalisation, when to apply?

jojuuu · Post by **jojuuu** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:04 pm

I came to UK in 2002 as a student. Got married to a British Citizen in 2005 and obtained a Spouse Visa in 2006. After having spent 2 years after spouse visa, I have been granted ILR recently. Please note that I have spent slightly over 6 years in UK in all.

Now the question I have is when should I apply for Naturalisation and whats the best way forward and how? Please note I have Life in the UK certificate.

An early reply will be appreciated.

John · Post by **John** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:17 pm

I think you can probably apply now, or whenever you like. You just need to make sure that you pass the "applicant was physically in the UK exactly three years before BIA receive the Naturalisation application" test.

In other words, look at any outside-the-UK dates in 2005, and take those into account when applying in 2008. For example, say you were out of the UK from say 15.04.05 to 30.04.05, then make sure the application does not arrive at BIA in the period from 15.04.08 to 30.04.08. Yes I know, a strange rule, but BIA have absolutely no discretion about it.

Presumably you have not been out of the UK more than 270 days in the last 3 years, not out more than 90 days in the last year?

thirdwave · Post by **thirdwave** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:36 pm

jojuuu wrote:I came to UK in 2002 as a student. Got married to a British Citizen in 2005 and obtained a Spouse Visa in 2006. After having spent 2 years after spouse visa, I have been granted ILR recently. Please note that I have spent slightly over 6 years in UK in all.

Now the question I have is when should I apply for Naturalisation and whats the best way forward and how? Please note I have Life in the UK certificate.

An early reply will be appreciated.

Would you be the person in question?

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewtopic.php?t=24738

Jojuuu, I have checked your previous post and have realised that you are infact the same person i.e Yasmin's spouse. In your first post you mentioned that you have a driving offence (driving without license and insurance I think it was) for which you were fined and received a disqualification for 8 weeks. From your post it appears that the offence was in (?)2005 in which case you`ll have to wait until 2010 before you can apply for naturalisation as your offence wouldn`t be considered 'spent' until then..

jojuuu · Post by **jojuuu** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:41 pm

John wrote:I think you can probably apply now, or whenever you like. You just need to make sure that you pass the "applicant was physically in the UK exactly three years before BIA receive the Naturalisation application" test.

In other words, look at any outside-the-UK dates in 2005, and take those into account when applying in 2008. For example, say you were out of the UK from say 15.04.05 to 30.04.05, then make sure the application does not arrive at BIA in the period from 15.04.08 to 30.04.08. Yes I know, a strange rule, but BIA have absolutely no discretion about it.

Presumably you have not been out of the UK more than 270 days in the last 3 years, not out more than 90 days in the last year?

Thanks John, for a quick and precise reply. I didn't know about this "present in UK, 3 years before the BIA received the application" thing. That really helped.

So, it means I can apply for Naturalization pretty much straight away. Is there any other thing that I need to keep in mind?

once again, thank you for your help. I really appreciate that.

jOjuuu

vinny · Post by **vinny** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:42 pm

Agree with John. Suggest that you use the Nationality checking service when applying.

jojuuu · Post by **jojuuu** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:43 pm

thirdwave wrote:
jojuuu wrote:I came to UK in 2002 as a student. Got married to a British Citizen in 2005 and obtained a Spouse Visa in 2006. After having spent 2 years after spouse visa, I have been granted ILR recently. Please note that I have spent slightly over 6 years in UK in all.

Now the question I have is when should I apply for Naturalisation and whats the best way forward and how? Please note I have Life in the UK certificate.

An early reply will be appreciated.
Would you be the person in question?

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewtopic.php?t=24738

Yes, its about me.

thirdwave · Post by **thirdwave** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:49 pm

jojuuu wrote:
thirdwave wrote:
jojuuu wrote:I came to UK in 2002 as a student. Got married to a British Citizen in 2005 and obtained a Spouse Visa in 2006. After having spent 2 years after spouse visa, I have been granted ILR recently. Please note that I have spent slightly over 6 years in UK in all.

Now the question I have is when should I apply for Naturalisation and whats the best way forward and how? Please note I have Life in the UK certificate.

An early reply will be appreciated.
Would you be the person in question?

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewtopic.php?t=24738
Yes, its about me.

Well, in that case you'd have to wait until 2010 (or whenever you received the conviction plus 5years) before you can apply for naturalisation..I have posted the relevant link on the BIA website in my response to Yasmin's post on your trip to the PEO

jojuuu · Post by **jojuuu** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:51 pm

vinny wrote:Agree with John. Suggest that you use the Nationality checking service when applying.

Thanks Vinny, your information really helped me and I feel more confident in applying for Naturalization now.

jojuuu · Post by **jojuuu** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:54 pm

Hi yes thats me but how sure are you that i have to wait for 5 years. Becuase I have gone through all the requirements for the Naturalization and they don't talk about any such thing. Have you got a reference to any website in this regard?

If that traffic offence was a major issue then how come I have been granted an ILR??

thirdwave · Post by **thirdwave** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:56 pm

jojuuu wrote:
vinny wrote:Agree with John. Suggest that you use the Nationality checking service when applying.
Thanks Vinny, your information really helped me and I feel more confident in applying for Naturalization now.

Jojuuu, please read the guidance before you apply!I am pretty sure you can`t apply just yet.If you still go ahead and apply, you'd certainly lose your money (600 odd quid). They do make allowances for a single breach but ITS ONLY FOR SPEEDING OFFENCES and NOT FOR DRIVING WITHOUT INSURANCE AND LICENSE!If you still decide to go ahead and apply,I would expect the people at NCS to tell you the same thing..

John · Post by **John** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:57 pm

jojuuu, wait a minute, it appears you did not supply all the relevant facts previously. You need to take on board the comment made by thirdwave.

If following the conviction you were fined, the conviction will not become "spent" for 5 years .... from the date of conviction, so don't apply for Naturalisation until the conviction is indeed "spent".

thirdwave · Post by **thirdwave** » Sun Mar 23, 2008 11:59 pm

jojuuu wrote:Hi yes thats me but how sure are you that i have to wait for 5 years. Becuase I have gone through all the requirements for the Naturalization and they don't talk about any such thing. Have you got a reference to any website in this regard?

If that traffic offence was a major issue then how come I have been granted an ILR??

Check the following links..

http://www.bia.homeoffice.gov.uk/britis ... character/

http://www.bia.homeoffice.gov.uk/siteco ... ide_an.pdf (check pages 18-20)

jojuuu · Post by **jojuuu** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 12:00 am

Hi John

I understand the point made by thirdwave is important and makes a lot of sense to me. But there is no such mentioning of such offences being spent before you apply for Naturalization anywhere to my knowledge. Could you please give me a reference from any website or document on this. I really don't intend to lose my 600 quid.

thanks

vinny · Post by **vinny** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 12:02 am

Requirements for naturalisation if you are married to or the civil partner of a British citizen wrote:... # you are of good character; and ...

See also Chapter 18: Naturalisation at discretion > Annex D: The good character requirement.

jojuuu · Post by **jojuuu** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 12:09 am

thirdwave, this link is helpful. I think you are right. The only possibility is "disqualification". I was disqualified following the conviction on driving without license and insurance.

and according to the link u sent, if I was disqualified. The conviction becomes spent as the disqualification period ends.

What do you thing? I must say I am impressed by your, John and vinnie's knowledge about these legal issues.

thanks

thirdwave · Post by **thirdwave** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 12:13 am

jojuuu wrote:thirdwave, this link is helpful. I think you are right. The only possibility is "disqualification". I was disqualified following the conviction on driving without license and insurance.

and according to the link u sent, if I was disqualified. The conviction becomes spent as the disqualification period ends.

What do you thing? I must say I am impressed by your, John and vinnie's knowledge about these legal issues.

thanks

Jojuuu, your fine won`t be considered 'spent' for 5 years from the date you received it. Its explicitly stated in the BIA guidance as well as the lnk vinny has posted. I know its a bit odd that driving disqualification is considered less serious than a fine (which you could receive for, well, anything) but such seems to the HO's line of reasoning..

jojuuu · Post by **jojuuu** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 12:17 am

You are right. According to guidance FINES are for 5 years. I think I need to research on the word FINES now. Some one must know what does FINES include. What type of FINES or every FINE?

If its every FINE, then yes I shouldn't apply for Naturalization now. I must wait for another 2 years.

Thanks once again

vinny · Post by **vinny** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 12:29 am

Chapter 18: Naturalisation at discretion[/url] > [url=http://www.bia.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitecontent/documents/policyandlaw/nationalityinstructions/nichapter18/ch18annexd?view=Binary]Annex D: The good character requirement wrote:3.4.2 We should normally be prepared to overlook a single unspent conviction resulting in a bind-over, conditional discharge or relatively small fine or compensation order where the applicant is of good character in all other respects. However, unspent convictions in respect of the following offences should not normally be disregarded, irrespective of the severity of the sentence imposed:

â€¢ offences involving dishonesty (e.g. theft, fraud)
â€¢ offences involving violence
â€¢ offences involving unlawful sexual activity
â€¢ drink-driving offences and driving whilst uninsured or disqualified or whilst using a mobile phone.

jojuuu · Post by **jojuuu** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 12:34 am

Yes, I have already read it. This answers it all. There is no way I should apply for Naturalization at this occeasion. I should wait for another two years before this become spent.

thank you so much for your time and help.

thirdwave · Post by **thirdwave** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 12:40 am

jojuuu wrote:You are right. According to guidance FINES are for 5 years. I think I need to research on the word FINES now. Some one must know what does FINES include. What type of FINES or every FINE?

If its every FINE, then yes I shouldn't apply for Naturalization now. I must wait for another 2 years.

Thanks once again

By fines they mean ANY Fine, unless its incurred as part of a fixed penalty notice. As things stand, your offence is unfortunately unspent and you'd have to wait for 5 years from the date of the fine before applying. If you are still unconvinced, I would suggest that you ring your local NCS (usually based at the registry office) and discuss it with them.

jojuuu · Post by **jojuuu** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 12:44 am

I am convinced. There is no need of wasting time and money at this occeasion. Your refernces were really helpful.

Thanks so much.

JAJ · Post by **JAJ** » Mon Mar 24, 2008 2:50 am

jojuuu wrote:If that traffic offence was a major issue then how come I have been granted an ILR??

Driving while unlicensed/uninsured is a serious matter and you should consider yourself lucky that you were given ILR.

In the not-so-distant future, an offence like that will probably mean a long delay in getting ILR as well as citizenship.

aboudi · Post by **aboudi** » Tue Mar 25, 2008 7:39 am

just wanted to clarify how the person in question can apply for citizenship now without having to wait to complete 12 months after obtaining ILR? i though that the last year of your qualifying residence has to be with ILR regardless of how long you resided here prior to it...

vinny · Post by **vinny** » Tue Mar 25, 2008 8:52 am

That's one of the advantages of being married to, or the Civil Partner of, a British Citizen.

aboudi · Post by **aboudi** » Tue Mar 25, 2008 9:03 am

thanx for clarifying.

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