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Human rights lawyers condemn English tests for spouses

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Human rights lawyers condemn English tests for spouses

Post by Dawie » Tue Oct 05, 2010 10:11 am

Home Office plans to introduce an English language test for those coming to Britain to marry UK citizens could breach human rights and race relations laws, according to leading human rights lawyers. A legal opinion by Rabinder Singh QC and Aileen McColgan, of Matrix Chambers, said the decision to impose the test from November has more to do with reducing the number of immigrants to Britain than minimising abuse.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/sep/2 ... lish-tests
In a few years time we'll look back on immigration control like we look back on American prohibition in the thirties - futile and counter-productive.

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Post by Casa » Tue Oct 05, 2010 10:51 am

The discussion on the BBC Sunday Morning programme totally missed the point that Spouses already have to show they can communicate in English before being granted ILR...if the reason for introducing an English test is to ensure integration, surely this is already in place. :roll:

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Post by Obie » Tue Oct 05, 2010 12:22 pm

It is plain and simple, they want to limit the number of people who can come here to settle with their spouses. Infact i feel they want to suppress the idea of family reunion for 3rd world country nationals completely.

The people who will be affected mostly are people fro 3th world country or Non-EU francophone or with non-English affiliation.

This is simply crazy and unfair. It has a set of target in it. It will not affect Australian, Canadians or Americans for sure.

You get my gist.
Last edited by Obie on Tue Oct 05, 2010 12:32 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Post by Dawie » Tue Oct 05, 2010 12:25 pm

Obie wrote:It is plain and simple, they want to limit the number of people who can come here to settle with their spouses. Infact i feel they want to suppress the idea of family reunion for 3rd world country nationals completely.

The people who will be affected mostly are people fro 3th world country or Non-EU francophone or with non-English affiliation.

This is simply crazy and onfair. It has a set of target in it. It will not affect Australian, Canadians or Americans for sure.

You get my gist.
No gist needed. Immigration control and beloved are 2 sides of the same coin, no doubt about it. You never seem to hear Brits complain about all those Australians and Americans stealing their jobs.
In a few years time we'll look back on immigration control like we look back on American prohibition in the thirties - futile and counter-productive.

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Post by Obie » Tue Oct 05, 2010 12:36 pm

Like the COA, which is in its final days, and the policy of removal without notification for certain people in detention, which to all intence and purpose is about to be buried, i am sure the court will be able to see these rules for what the are.

Then again one is unsure whether to infact trust these judges, when 3 of them that recently retired went to join migration watch.
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Post by Dawie » Tue Oct 05, 2010 12:38 pm

I don't have much faith in those crusty old British judges. They are all a bunch of old school tie lovey.
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Post by Rozen » Tue Oct 05, 2010 12:41 pm

Obie wrote:It is plain and simple, they want to limit the number of people who can come here to settle with their spouses. Infact i feel they want to suppress the idea of family reunion for 3rd world country nationals completely.

The people who will be affected mostly are people fro 3th world country or Non-EU francophone or with non-English affiliation.

This is simply crazy and unfair. It has a set of target in it. It will not affect Australian, Canadians or Americans for sure.
Same applies with Nederland! Non EU spouses/partners (excepting Australia, Canada, USA, etc) have to undergo a 'Dutch Integration' exam at the Dutch embassy in the country they are coming from! (except if they use the EU route ofcourse). I agree that it's just a discriminative way of barring TCNs from joining their EU partners in Europe.

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Post by Obie » Tue Oct 05, 2010 12:51 pm

The difference between the Dutch and UK system is this.

The Dutch were very open on who their targets are. They set exempt and none exempt nations. Although this was ruled unlawful about couple of years back.

The UK are however clever. They will be very subtle. They will say it applies to every nations. But look at the statistic of spousal visas issued to western state and 3 world state, and you will see clearly who are the main loosers.
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Post by Casa » Tue Oct 05, 2010 1:27 pm

It doesn't apply to every nation Obie...countries with majority English speaking are exempt.

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Post by Dawie » Tue Oct 05, 2010 1:33 pm

Casa wrote:It doesn't apply to every nation Obie...countries with majority English speaking are exempt.
The UKBA's interpretation of what constitutes a majority English speaking country seems a little one sided.

South Africa has been left off this list despite a sizable minority of people in South Africa who speak English as their home language, and despite the fact that English is the lingua franca of South Africa.
In a few years time we'll look back on immigration control like we look back on American prohibition in the thirties - futile and counter-productive.

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Post by Obie » Tue Oct 05, 2010 1:55 pm

Thanks Casa for pointing the English Majority country and South Africa being exempted from the list.

I found the Ministarial statement here.

In the final paragraph of the statement , it states the aim is to tighten the rules, and the minister is looking into other ways of making it tighter.

Intepreted in the context of English majority country, it would seem the rules are not to help integration, but to tighten the rules for certain nationals. This is discrimination, which is clear, although it is still much better than the Dutch one, which was not aimed at Western Nations, even though those nations are non-dutch speaking. The UK are very clever in this regards too, although i believe it will not hold well in court.

How are the going to do this. If someone holds a passport of an English majority country, but lives in a country considered as english minority, will they need to take the test, or if the reverse is the case. This will mean the rules are aimed at particular nations or nationality.

Interesting to see the outcome of this, or the practicalities.
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Post by Casa » Tue Oct 05, 2010 2:07 pm

Ironically, the British must be one of the worst nations when comes to learning another language and the most reluctant to integrate with other cultures outside of the UK.

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Post by chezza100 » Fri Oct 08, 2010 10:12 am

I'm in total agreement with most of the comments on this thread.

I'm a white British woman and waiting for my Pakistani husband to have his passport stamped then he can finally join me here.

I'm very ashamed sometimes of the way my countrymen and women react to immigration.

Immigrants should be welcomed as they make a postive difference to society.

I'm currently learning Urdu to be able to speak to my husbands family in their own language and our children will learn both Urdu and English.

Good luck to everybody with their battles.

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Post by Obie » Sun Oct 10, 2010 1:41 pm

If just 10% of policy makers have your mindset the world and the UK inparticular will be a wonderful place to live, and their won't be interacial tensions.

Unfortunately, Immigrant are viewed as source of production. They are not viewed as human beings who have family, who uses service, and contribute to the provision of these services. Their numbers means more than their contribution and worth to society

For example, the X factor saga, has really shown that it is when ( but only when) the tabloid see an immigrants as human, that is when they commence becoming one.
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