URGENT...Please help/Eu Permanent residence refused

I would like to seek the help of the good people on this forum. I arrived Ireland with my spouse who is British June 2006 and in August recieved a 5 year EU residence permit. I made an application for permanent residence in April of this year and I got a refusal letter this morning.
My situation is as follows,My wife worked for about 6 months but lost her job in 2007, I worked for 9 months but my company moved from Ireland. Since then we registered with FAS and decided to go to college. My wife is currently in the third year of a state sponsored course. I completed a masters degree and I am currently a Phd student in my college. INIS said the refusal is based

Sorry i could not complete the post as I am using my phone....
INIS refused my application on basis that my wife has not exercised her treaty rights for the duration of the five years and that she has been claiming unemployment assistance. Before i sumitted the application, i sought advise from solvit and they indicated that as long as she reiigisterd with fas and was on a state sponsored programme then i shouldnt have any problem. I will like to get advise from you guys in terms of my next course of action..many thanks

just make sure you have proof of last 5 years living together and all the college letter with life insurance.they cant refuse your application if your experience your eu treaty right.once your wife/husband is stand with you.you can even knock the court door.its breaches the eu regulations.they cant treat irish spouse/eu spouse separted rules.if irish spouse even in socail,college whatever you can easily renew your visa.but your wife is even in college they cant have right to refuse your visa.do you have any kid together?what is the nationallity of your kid? just make sure contact mrci,irish immigrant rights and solvit.good luck

IQU wrote:just make sure you have proof of last 5 years living together and all the college letter with life insurance.they cant refuse your application if your experience your eu treaty right.once your wife/husband is stand with you.you can even knock the court door.its breaches the eu regulations.they cant treat irish spouse/eu spouse separted rules.if irish spouse even in socail,college whatever you can easily renew your visa.but your wife is even in college they cant have right to refuse your visa.do you have any kid together?what is the nationallity of your kid? just make sure contact mrci,irish immigrant rights and solvit.good luck

Many thanks for your reply. I gave them proof of us living together for the last five years, my spouse is even more distressed than I am and I have her 100% support. We have four boys together and 3 of them have Irish citizenship. She gave birth to our last boy in 2010 and was back in school the next day, bless her.

She contacted Solvit but it was referred to the UK as that is where she is from, initially the lady at Solvit said based on the evidence provided the Irish authorities were correct in their decision but interestingly we provided an email we were sent by solvit prior to making the application and she back tracked and said she would look into it. The initial email from Solvit said Permanent residence is based on article 16 of the 2004 free movement treaty which just means we need to provide evidence we have been living together for five years and all we need to provide is proof of that we have cohabited together and the five year residence card that was issued.

Like you suggested I would contact MRCI and ICI on Monday, thank you for your post.

oh happy days,just make sure send all the documents to eu treaty right.also keep all the correspondence from them.in main time contact solvat.also you can renew your visa under zambaro catgory.because you have irish citizens child.you can make another application to repration divsion.send them folowing documents.child irish passport copy,birth copy,yours passport,college letter,if child is in school than school letter

i contacted EU commission and got a reply previously that your LTR can only be refused if you are a threat to the country you are living in and have criminal convictions. Also, refusal has to be thorough and explanatory.


Not sure if on any other basis it can be refused unless it is a marriage of convenience etc

EUspouse82 wrote:I would like to seek the help of the good people on this forum. I arrived Ireland with my spouse who is British June 2006 and in August recieved a 5 year EU residence permit. I made an application for permanent residence in April of this year and I got a refusal letter this morning.
My situation is as follows,My wife worked for about 6 months but lost her job in 2007, I worked for 9 months but my company moved from Ireland. Since then we registered with FAS and decided to go to college. My wife is currently in the third year of a state sponsored course. I completed a masters degree and I am currently a Phd student in my college. INIS said the refusal is based

If they give you a reason, but it appears to me that, you did not state the reason whereby a standi could be created on that virtue. saved in exceptional circumstances, you can appeal it to the high court, however, this is a case of direct effect of non-privileged nature and there's a ground for favorable judicial review answer, but the basis of refusal need to be stated. then a further basis for such standi can then be advised.

Bell2 wrote:

EUspouse82 wrote:I would like to seek the help of the good people on this forum. I arrived Ireland with my spouse who is British June 2006 and in August recieved a 5 year EU residence permit. I made an application for permanent residence in April of this year and I got a refusal letter this morning.
My situation is as follows,My wife worked for about 6 months but lost her job in 2007, I worked for 9 months but my company moved from Ireland. Since then we registered with FAS and decided to go to college. My wife is currently in the third year of a state sponsored course. I completed a masters degree and I am currently a Phd student in my college. INIS said the refusal is based

If they give you a reason, but it appears to me that, you did not state the reason whereby a standi could be created on that virtue. saved in exceptional circumstances, you can appeal it to the high court, however, this is a case of direct effect of non-privileged nature and there's a ground for favorable judicial review answer, but the basis of refusal need to be stated. then a further basis for such standi can then be advised.

Angelcountry, you have been banned so many times from this forum. Why don't you realise at this stage that you are not wanted here and just give up? Your advice for the most part is incomprehensible, wrong and useless.

Monifé wrote:

Bell2 wrote:

EUspouse82 wrote:I would like to seek the help of the good people on this forum. I arrived Ireland with my spouse who is British June 2006 and in August recieved a 5 year EU residence permit. I made an application for permanent residence in April of this year and I got a refusal letter this morning.
My situation is as follows,My wife worked for about 6 months but lost her job in 2007, I worked for 9 months but my company moved from Ireland. Since then we registered with FAS and decided to go to college. My wife is currently in the third year of a state sponsored course. I completed a masters degree and I am currently a Phd student in my college. INIS said the refusal is based

If they give you a reason, but it appears to me that, you did not state the reason whereby a standi could be created on that virtue. saved in exceptional circumstances, you can appeal it to the high court, however, this is a case of direct effect of non-privileged nature and there's a ground for favorable judicial review answer, but the basis of refusal need to be stated. then a further basis for such standi can then be advised.

Angelcountry, you have been banned so many times from this forum. Why don't you realise at this stage that you are not wanted here and just give up? Your advice for the most part is incomprehensible, wrong and useless.

Dont you see the way you picked on me out of everybody, do you know the law of what you believed i don't know, just because is coherent, you get intimidated by knowledge, which is power.

You're sick, not wanted in a commentary website ? are you crazy ?

In a country, relationship, company, education sector, you name it, you're dearly beloved and i am sure you are an Asian person that like to dominate aren't you ? you're hurt of the truth, take it out again i will be back until you allow other people to comment or what does not concern you or has a direct effect on you and if you need to challenge me in court mail me and get my full details then we meet in court for your persistent breaches of freedom of speech in a website comment. ******.

knapps wrote:i contacted EU commission and got a reply previously that your LTR can only be refused if you are a threat to the country you are living in and have criminal convictions. Also, refusal has to be thorough and explanatory.


Not sure if on any other basis it can be refused unless it is a marriage of convenience etc

Thanks for your post. I can confirm that I have no criminal convictions or even visited the police station apart from renewing my residence permit. In terms of the refusal, the letter itself was awash with inconsistencies, typographical errors and was quite unprofessional. The reasons for refusal were that :

. Between 2006-2009, there was very limited exercise of treaty rights
. I submitted a letter from FAS confirming my spouse had registered with them but they said the letter did not state when she first registered

One thing that I am confused about is that nothing was mentioned about my own employment. I worked in 2006 and 2007 before I lost my job and provided evidence but this was not taken into consideration at all. I was of the opinion that my employment would also be considered as part of her exercising her treaty rights.

@IQU, I have considered applying via the Zambrano route as I do not have any immigration status at the moment but my problem is I dont know if you can make two separate applications concurrently as I intend to still appeal the EU treaty rights.

I will appreciate the comments so far and I will be glad if I can get your further inputs..Thanks

EUspouse82 wrote:

knapps wrote:i contacted EU commission and got a reply previously that your LTR can only be refused if you are a threat to the country you are living in and have criminal convictions. Also, refusal has to be thorough and explanatory.


Not sure if on any other basis it can be refused unless it is a marriage of convenience etc

Thanks for your post. I can confirm that I have no criminal convictions or even visited the police station apart from renewing my residence permit. In terms of the refusal, the letter itself was awash with inconsistencies, typographical errors and was quite unprofessional. The reasons for refusal were that :

. Between 2006-2009, there was very limited exercise of treaty rights
. I submitted a letter from FAS confirming my spouse had registered with them but they said the letter did not state when she first registered

One thing that I am confused about is that nothing was mentioned about my own employment. I worked in 2006 and 2007 before I lost my job and provided evidence but this was not taken into consideration at all. I was of the opinion that my employment would also be considered as part of her exercising her treaty rights.

@IQU, I have considered applying via the Zambrano route as I do not have any immigration status at the moment but my problem is I dont know if you can make two separate applications concurrently as I intend to still appeal the EU treaty rights.

I will appreciate the comments so far and I will be glad if I can get your further inputs..Thanks

Immigration status is not about criminal conviction, but the type of crime, and indeed, how they can Usurp deportation with the conviction in questions and if they couldn't lucky you. Mostly based on serious crime.

However, Zambrano case is based on a family who has been residing in Belgium and lost their job and decided to claim unemployment benefit which comes under article 8 re;sala and under article 20 (2) per the right to provide for their family who are European citizen.

What i don't understand is that, where you informed in that letter that, you're given certain days to appeal their decision or just pure refusal otherwise judicial review will be the best option at present.

Bell2 wrote:

EUspouse82 wrote:

knapps wrote:i contacted EU commission and got a reply previously that your LTR can only be refused if you are a threat to the country you are living in and have criminal convictions. Also, refusal has to be thorough and explanatory.


Not sure if on any other basis it can be refused unless it is a marriage of convenience etc

Thanks for your post. I can confirm that I have no criminal convictions or even visited the police station apart from renewing my residence permit. In terms of the refusal, the letter itself was awash with inconsistencies, typographical errors and was quite unprofessional. The reasons for refusal were that :

. Between 2006-2009, there was very limited exercise of treaty rights
. I submitted a letter from FAS confirming my spouse had registered with them but they said the letter did not state when she first registered

One thing that I am confused about is that nothing was mentioned about my own employment. I worked in 2006 and 2007 before I lost my job and provided evidence but this was not taken into consideration at all. I was of the opinion that my employment would also be considered as part of her exercising her treaty rights.

@IQU, I have considered applying via the Zambrano route as I do not have any immigration status at the moment but my problem is I dont know if you can make two separate applications concurrently as I intend to still appeal the EU treaty rights.

I will appreciate the comments so far and I will be glad if I can get your further inputs..Thanks

Immigration status is not about criminal conviction, but the type of crime, and indeed, how they can Usurp deportation with the conviction in questions and if they couldn't lucky you. Mostly based on serious crime.

However, Zambrano case is based on a family who has been residing in Belgium and lost their job and decided to claim unemployment benefit which comes under article 8 re;sala and under article 20 (2) per the right to provide for their family who are European citizen.

What i don't understand is that, where you informed in that letter that, you're given certain days to appeal their decision or just pure refusal otherwise judicial review will be the best option at present.

I was actually replying to Knapps who said that the EU commission said the only reason why the state could refuse an EU permanent residence application is criminal convictions or threat to public order.

I understand the Zambrano case quite well, I was just asking if I could make two applications concurrently i.e. EU treaty rights and Zambrano.

I was given 15 working days to make an appeal if I felt the deciding officer had erred.

EUspouse82 wrote:

Bell2 wrote:

EUspouse82 wrote:

knapps wrote:i contacted EU commission and got a reply previously that your LTR can only be refused if you are a threat to the country you are living in and have criminal convictions. Also, refusal has to be thorough and explanatory.


Not sure if on any other basis it can be refused unless it is a marriage of convenience etc

Thanks for your post. I can confirm that I have no criminal convictions or even visited the police station apart from renewing my residence permit. In terms of the refusal, the letter itself was awash with inconsistencies, typographical errors and was quite unprofessional. The reasons for refusal were that :

. Between 2006-2009, there was very limited exercise of treaty rights
. I submitted a letter from FAS confirming my spouse had registered with them but they said the letter did not state when she first registered

One thing that I am confused about is that nothing was mentioned about my own employment. I worked in 2006 and 2007 before I lost my job and provided evidence but this was not taken into consideration at all. I was of the opinion that my employment would also be considered as part of her exercising her treaty rights.

@IQU, I have considered applying via the Zambrano route as I do not have any immigration status at the moment but my problem is I dont know if you can make two separate applications concurrently as I intend to still appeal the EU treaty rights.

I will appreciate the comments so far and I will be glad if I can get your further inputs..Thanks

Immigration status is not about criminal conviction, but the type of crime, and indeed, how they can Usurp deportation with the conviction in questions and if they couldn't lucky you. Mostly based on serious crime.

However, Zambrano case is based on a family who has been residing in Belgium and lost their job and decided to claim unemployment benefit which comes under article 8 re;sala and under article 20 (2) per the right to provide for their family who are European citizen.

What i don't understand is that, where you informed in that letter that, you're given certain days to appeal their decision or just pure refusal otherwise judicial review will be the best option at present.

I was actually replying to Knapps who said that the EU commission said the only reason why the state could refuse an EU permanent residence application is criminal convictions or threat to public order.

I understand the Zambrano case quite well, I was just asking if I could make two applications concurrently i.e. EU treaty rights and Zambrano.

It's well spell out in article 83 (1) TFEU
The European parliament and the council may, by directive adopted in accordance ordinary legislative procedure, establish , rules concerning the definition of crime offences and sanctions in the areas of particularly serious crime with cross-border dimension resulting from nature or impact of such offences or from a special need to halt them on common structures.
The European union then pronounced that, these areas of crimes are as follows
1.Terrorism
2.Human trafficking
3 Sexual exploitation of woman and children
4.Illicit Drugs and trafficking
5.Illicit arm arm trafficking
6.Money laundering
7.Corruption
8.Counterfeiting of means of payment
9.Computer crime
10.Organised crimes.

The European Union will then identify other areas of crimes with the consent of the parliaments for approval, please don't interpret public peace that Irish police love to use against immigrant, so public security does not come along public orders.

so know your rights

Bell2 wrote:

Monifé wrote:

Bell2 wrote:

EUspouse82 wrote:I would like to seek the help of the good people on this forum. I arrived Ireland with my spouse who is British June 2006 and in August recieved a 5 year EU residence permit. I made an application for permanent residence in April of this year and I got a refusal letter this morning.
My situation is as follows,My wife worked for about 6 months but lost her job in 2007, I worked for 9 months but my company moved from Ireland. Since then we registered with FAS and decided to go to college. My wife is currently in the third year of a state sponsored course. I completed a masters degree and I am currently a Phd student in my college. INIS said the refusal is based

If they give you a reason, but it appears to me that, you did not state the reason whereby a standi could be created on that virtue. saved in exceptional circumstances, you can appeal it to the high court, however, this is a case of direct effect of non-privileged nature and there's a ground for favorable judicial review answer, but the basis of refusal need to be stated. then a further basis for such standi can then be advised.

Angelcountry, you have been banned so many times from this forum. Why don't you realise at this stage that you are not wanted here and just give up? Your advice for the most part is incomprehensible, wrong and useless.

Dont you see the way you picked on me out of everybody, do you know the law of what you believed i don't know, just because is coherent, you get intimidated by knowledge, which is power.

You're sick, not wanted in a commentary website ? are you crazy ?

In a country, relationship, company, education sector, you name it, you're dearly beloved and i am sure you are an Asian person that like to dominate aren't you ? you're hurt of the truth, take it out again i will be back until you allow other people to comment or what does not concern you or has a direct effect on you and if you need to challenge me in court mail me and get my full details then we meet in court for your persistent breaches of freedom of speech in a website comment. ******.

I am not intimidated by your knowledge. I have a huge knowledge of immigration law aswell so that doesn't bother me. What annoys me, is it seems you quote from law books with no comprehension and even the most knowledgable law person would not understand you.

I am certainly not dearly beloved and I am not asian either. The comment about court is retarded, if that was the case, I should have you for defamation.

Anyway, lets leave it at that and get back on topic. You will be banned again soon anyway.

one should not be a judge of his own case.please out line precisely the dates of the eu citizen's activities since arriving in ireland.non eu person's activities are irrelevant.see art 7 of directive.eu person must show they complied with that for 5 CONTINous years no gaps.did you provide all info?bear in mind job seekers retain workers status for 6 months.she did not work over 1 year to get to retain workers status(there other ways though like study) are there gaps in time?whats her status NOW?should there be problems in simple renewal?any job so long as genuine and paid,hours & rate are irrelevant

last thing, social welfare or their attitude of minimum activity maybe irrelevant. please state precisely what the letter says and avoid passing comment.then people can ACCURATELY help you because far too many people/groups are giving inaccurate info that might not be matching what is actually going on.i request clarity,so please don't be getting tetchy.you maybe completely correct,but your data may not be full here

EUspouse82 wrote:I would like to seek the help of the good people on this forum. I arrived Ireland with my spouse who is British June 2006 and in August recieved a 5 year EU residence permit. I made an application for permanent residence in April of this year and I got a refusal letter this morning.
My situation is as follows,My wife worked for about 6 months but lost her job in 2007, I worked for 9 months but my company moved from Ireland. Since then we registered with FAS and decided to go to college. My wife is currently in the third year of a state sponsored course. I completed a masters degree and I am currently a Phd student in my college. INIS said the refusal is based

you get status in august 2006.you apply for pr in april 11? by my calculation that is less than 5 years (you should have made it in august 11!) if correct, your application is premature.did she apply for fas straight after lost job?(thus jobseeker thus retain status for a time)when did college start?if no gaps- BREACH OF EU

iqu-how does it breach eu law if the pr application was made before the 5 year time limit?, taking into account the exceptions in art 16,which until op clarifies,may not avail.its proof of eu spouse thats relevant not non eu. should have no problems now. and if cant get pr,at least can get eu1 again.eu law don't apply to irish adult citizen who stays in ireland,but your right,eu spouse can't be treated differently.question is,was spouse exercising rights?as for children,they are british&irish.if in school rely on art12 of reg 1612/68 or irish,zambrano (but don't hold breath deckiee v austria could limit it zambrano-unlikely)

eu pr application is made after 4 and half year. because processing time is 6 months.i dont think they are breaches any law.they have all the document from last 5 years living together and also on socail welfare etc etc.they have kids together.inis should give them pr card easily.

knapps wrote:i contacted EU commission and got a reply previously that your LTR can only be refused if you are a threat to the country you are living in and have criminal convictions. Also, refusal has to be thorough and explanatory.


Not sure if on any other basis it can be refused unless it is a marriage of convenience etc

it can also be refused if you don't meet the requirements (any of them and bear in mind the wide definitions) under art 7 for full 5 years or meet exeptions in arts 7& 17.the advice given to you was given on the assumption that one meets the criteria.not enough to simply reside.that does not mean renewal of status less pr can be refused,if one now complies with art 7(eg,work for 4 months,loose job,do nothing else,return to work 2 years later,loose job after 5 months,do nothing,but now found work or study or self sufficient)

IQU wrote:eu pr application is made after 4 and half year. because processing time is 6 months.i dont think they are breaches any law.they have all the document from last 5 years living together and also on socail welfare etc etc.they have kids together.inis should give them pr card easily.

you can only make application after meeting five rule.looking at the partly disclosed facts,it might not be the case that its obvious,so we should not assume.read what the directive actually says and refrain from making up your own rules.nobody is asking you want you think,your being asked for what you know.kindly provide evidence to support your opinion,thank you

bell2, what are you on about?standi of non priviledge person refers to judicial review of actions of eu institutions by the cjeu.ie at eu level. the directive is now part of irish law.if minister is wrong in law or fact, you can go to high court for jr-there is no exceptions.failure to give a reason or adequate reason is a ground for jr alone.minister gave a reason.we are now asking op to claify somethings.this person has been refused they have full standing under irish law ie irish legislation that transposed the directive, there is no issue of direct effect unless irish law did not implement directive correctly.not case here,its this decision thats at issue.stop using terms you do not understand.even if this was a matter in front of cjeu this would be a priviledged person.direct effect and non priviledge person,are two entirely different issues.the latter is not relevant here.

by the way,bell 2, freedom of speech in this country does not allow people to run their mouths off making false and damaging comments.you know what defamation laws are ?you would get no where in court.and i doubt you would behave in this way if you were not behind a computer.people are complaining simply because your advice is legally incorrect and everyone knows that you don't genuinely understand the phrases that you are using.don't take it personal or get all persecution complex on us,just drop the jargon or at least get it right

bell 2 ,article 83 has nothing directly got to do with freemovement of people in the context of grounds to deport. case law allows member states to determine its own public policy, so long as its proprtionate ie follows article 27-33 of the directive.83 refers to judicial cooperation in criminal matters and procedure.ie tackling crime that concerns many eu states. any decision to refuse or deport on public policy, comes after the court case,thus long after relevancy of 83.

Monifé wrote:

Bell2 wrote:

Monifé wrote:

Bell2 wrote:
If they give you a reason, but it appears to me that, you did not state the reason whereby a standi could be created on that virtue. saved in exceptional circumstances, you can appeal it to the high court, however, this is a case of direct effect of non-privileged nature and there's a ground for favorable judicial review answer, but the basis of refusal need to be stated. then a further basis for such standi can then be advised.

Angelcountry, you have been banned so many times from this forum. Why don't you realise at this stage that you are not wanted here and just give up? Your advice for the most part is incomprehensible, wrong and useless.

Dont you see the way you picked on me out of everybody, do you know the law of what you believed i don't know, just because is coherent, you get intimidated by knowledge, which is power.

You're sick, not wanted in a commentary website ? are you crazy ?

In a country, relationship, company, education sector, you name it, you're dearly beloved and i am sure you are an Asian person that like to dominate aren't you ? you're hurt of the truth, take it out again i will be back until you allow other people to comment or what does not concern you or has a direct effect on you and if you need to challenge me in court mail me and get my full details then we meet in court for your persistent breaches of freedom of speech in a website comment. ******.

I am not intimidated by your knowledge. I have a huge knowledge of immigration law aswell so that doesn't bother me. What annoys me, is it seems you quote from law books with no comprehension and even the most knowledgable law person would not understand you.

I am certainly not dearly beloved and I am not asian either. The comment about court is retarded, if that was the case, I should have you for defamation.

Anyway, lets leave it at that and get back on topic. You will be banned again soon anyway.

What i don't like is that, people denying others of their says, and you don't have to take me off the site than write your own contributions, than singling me out because of the fact, so where do you get your own fact ?
From your own notions ?
Not from text book, constitution books and case law on website for precedence's ? where from your own not from what is laid down ?

You not going to silence me anyway, why have you been down graded recently because of your eduactional fraud systems.