Tourist visa for Italy and sitzerland

vik123 · Post by **vik123** » Sun Jun 26, 2011 6:27 pm

Hi. I am a candian national who is a uk resident (indefinite leave to enter). My wife is an indian national who has joined me here in the uk via the settlement visa (vaf4a form). We wish to travel to italy in november and switzerland in february as tourists. From the research I have done I understand I will not require a visa for either visits as I have a canadian passport. But my wife will require a schengen visa. Is this the correct form to complete?:
http://www.esteri.it/visti/pdf/Formular ... gen_EN.pdf?
Also if we specify multiple entries (q 24.) will that mean my wife wont need to apply for another visa to go to switzerland?
I have also seen another form here http://www.conslondra.esteri.it/Consola ... in_italia/ but I think she cant apply through this as I am not an eea national?

Post by **Directive/2004/38/EC** » Sun Jun 26, 2011 10:12 pm

Your wife will need a Schengen visa for her visits. With luck you can get multiple entry...

Any chance you have recent relatives in your past who lived in Europe and who might have had a European citizenship? Italian? Irish? British?

vik123 · Post by **vik123** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:34 am

My parents are british. My wife and I live with them. Is there any significance to this?

Post by **vinny** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:05 am

Are you not British?

vik123 · Post by **vik123** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:10 am

I am canadian. its complex... way back when when i was due to be born my parents had ideas of us moving to canada. we have relatives over there so my parents decided to get me born there. but moving over there never materialised... i have held a canadian passport ever since. but just to make things more complex i have applied for british citizenship through naturalisation 2 months back. but im still waiting for that to come through (have been told up to 6 months, then have to apply for british passport after that...) So as of now I am still a canadian!!!

Post by **vinny** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:18 am

When were you born?
Are your parents British otherwise than by descent (e.g born in the UK)?

vik123 · Post by **vik123** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:23 am

I was born in canada. my parents were not born in britain. mum came over here when she was 2 back in 50's. dad married mum n came over here in 70's. they both have held british nationality and passports ever since

Post by **vinny** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:27 am

Both your prents are British by descent?

vik123 · Post by **vik123** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:32 am

I dont think so. My mums parents immigrated over here from india back in the 50's - mum came with them. My dad was in india until the 70's. Then when he married my mum he came over here

vik123 · Post by **vik123** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:35 am

i was born in 1982

Post by **vinny** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:40 am

How did your dad become British? Was he British when you were born?

vik123 · Post by **vik123** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:42 am

my dad became british through marrying my mum. yes he was british when i was born

Post by **vinny** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:46 am

If he naturalised, then you are probably automatically British by descent.

Post by **Directive/2004/38/EC** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:48 am

vik123 wrote:I dont think so. My mums parents immigrated over here from india back in the 50's - mum came with them. My dad was in india until the 70's. Then when he married my mum he came over here

It sounds like one or both of your parents were NOT British when they were born. That your mom moved to the UK as a small child, and that your dad moved over in the 70s to marry your mother. When did your father get his UK citizenship? When did your mother get her UK citizenship?

You are most likely already British and can simply apply for a passport. You would need to include a copy of your parent's Marriage certificate and proof of your father's or mother's naturalization.

vik123 · Post by **vik123** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:51 am

2 months back i took the life in uk test, filled out the naturalisation form and then coughed up Â£836 to apply through naturalisation. now you guys are saying i didnt need to do that???

vik123 · Post by **vik123** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:54 am

Yes you are correct my parents were indian nationals at birth as they were born there. I'm not exactly sure when my parents got uk citizenship. I'm guessin mum when she came here in 50's and dad when he married my mum in mid 70's

Post by **Directive/2004/38/EC** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:55 am

vik123 wrote:2 months back i took the life in uk test, filled out the naturalisation form and then coughed up Â£836 to apply through naturalisation. now you guys are saying i didnt need to do that???

You clearly should have checked with us first! :lol:

At least we might save you the cost of a Schengen visa application!

vik123 · Post by **vik123** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:59 am

On the pdf here http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... chapter20/ in section 20.1.3 it says
'British citizens otherwise than by descent automatically transmit their citizenship to children born abroad.'

So it looks like I am british. Damn what a s**t start to the day. I'm feelin really deflated now I have found out about all this.

Post by **vinny** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:07 pm

See also Can i have you oppinion please?

Post by **Directive/2004/38/EC** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:10 pm

They were British citizens and moved to Canada. You were born in Canada and so are automatically Canadian. That much is easy.

When they moved back to UK, I would guess they must have checked with the British embassy either about (1) whether you were also a British citizen and (2) if you were not a British citizen, whether your needed an immigrant visa to come to the UK. Even if (2), then the embassy SHOULD have pointed out that you were British. You should have a good talk with your parents to figure out exactly what happened in Canada after you were born and before you moved back... Probably mixed understandings, incomplete information, and maybe even bad information from the embassy.

A couple of notes for your future:
Any child you have is automatically Canadian, since you were born in Canada.
Any child you have in the UK is automatically British.
Any child you have outside of the UK is British because you have lived for more than 3 years in the UK before the child was born. But you need to register the birth outside the UK with the British embassy within 365 days!

Post by **Directive/2004/38/EC** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:16 pm

You might possibly be able to cancel your naturalization application and get the fee back. Or they might refund the fee when they realize you are already British. I am not sure what their procedural rules are.

I would not do this today though. Check the facts first! Breath deeply!

Then apply for your UK passport.

And once you have that (it likely will take 2-4 weeks), your wife can apply for a Schengen visa for free. http://eumovement.wordpress.com/2007/04 ... u-citizen/

Note that as a British citizen, you and you wife can now live and work trivially in any EU member state.

vik123 · Post by **vik123** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:18 pm

My parents never lived in canada or moved to canada. My parents just went there for my birth (around 6 weeks) and then came back to UK.
Anyway now I am currently more interested in getting a refund for the amount I spent on applying through naturalisation. I applied through the Nationality Checking Service (NCS) and on the form AN there is a section 'parents details' which questions fathers and mothers birth place and nationality. Surley the person reviewing the form should have flagged up I was already british? Do you think I have a case?

vik123 · Post by **vik123** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:31 pm

ok thanks. you guys are really great and know your stuff. You know prior to applying for naturalisation I even went to see a solicitor and he quoted me Â£1000 just for helping me fill in the form an and send it off (on top of Â£836 fee). I didnt bother with that as I thought Â£1000 was too much and I could just fill it in myself. But the solicitor knew my parents were both british. So either he didnt know about the british by descent rule or he was trying to con me. Anyway thanks for your help guys

Post by **vinny** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:43 pm

Directive/2004/38/EC wrote:Any child you have outside of the UK is British because you have lived for more than 3 years in the UK before the child was born. But you need to register the birth outside the UK with the British embassy within 365 days!

It's now sufficient to Register (3(2)) child while child is under 18.

Post by **Directive/2004/38/EC** » Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:47 pm

British citizenship law is very complex, and so it is easy to make mistakes in the hard bits. But your case seems very straight forward.

The NCS is interestingly named. They just check to make sure you have filled everything in and make a copy of your passport. They do not really understand citizenship law in any sort of depth - they just work for the local council. I doubt it is worth working on them for your money back.

Double-check with your parents that they were not British citizens before they came to the UK. That they naturalized once arriving in the UK and before you were born. And finally that your parents were legally married at the time of your birth.

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Tourist visa for Italy and sitzerland

Tourist visa for Italy and sitzerland