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4 months after arrival: was GTV really worth it?

Only for the Global Talent visa, formerly known as Tier 1 (Exceptional Talent) visa

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messengercrow
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Don't you think GTV is an expensive scheme?

Post by messengercrow » Mon Nov 01, 2021 5:50 pm

I have been in the UK for nearly 3 months now, but I haven't been able to apply for my family because of expenses.

I found a job since day 1 I arrived here, which means I am one of the lucky ones. But the salary is only £33000 annually meaning I don't earn enough to support a family. My wife had a surgery 6 months ago and cannot work, so I will be the only work force of the family.

Also, considering I have to pay £600+ IHS fee for each year for every family member, and then pay house deposit and buy a car, which is a must for a family with toddlers, I would need at least £12k just to be able to bring my family here.

I mean, for people from developing countries this is a huge amount of money. The visa fee makes it difficult for me to want to remain here.

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CR001
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Re: Don't you think GTV is an expensive scheme?

Post by CR001 » Mon Nov 01, 2021 6:03 pm

No one is forcing you to stay in the UK.
But the salary is only £33000 annually meaning I don't earn enough to support a family.
This is a really good salary and hardly on the poverty/breadline and many earn substantially less than this on Skilled Worker visas as well as British citizens trying to bring their families. They all manage to sponsor their families.

GTV dependent visa fees are also about £1000 cheaper than the visa fee for a spouse of an ilr holder or British citizen, with the fee for an initial application at £1523 each compared to GTV dependent at £608 each. Everyone pays the IHS fee, why should your family be exempted when they haven't paid into the system. We have all had to pay into the NHS and the IHS is a fraction of the cost of what private treatment would cost you in the UK or some countries like Australia and the US.

Maybe you are looking above your needs and basic requirements or you should look in other cheaper areas. Buying a car is not a must either, public transport works fine, even with babies. Slightly lowering your expectations is usually a good starting point.

When you immigrate to any country, you should do your research and plan accordingly, before jumping in and getting a visa and then realising the reality and difficulties.
Char (CR001 not Casa)
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secret.simon
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Re: Don't you think GTV is an expensive scheme?

Post by secret.simon » Mon Nov 01, 2021 6:49 pm

messengercrow wrote:
Mon Nov 01, 2021 5:50 pm
the salary is only £33000 annually
If that is your annual salary before tax, you earn more than 2/3rd (67%) of all UK earners; if after tax, you earn more than 3/4 (75%) of all UK earners. It is not exactly chump change.

As CR001 has mentioned, people who earn less manage to support their families in the UK. It is a case of cutting your coat according to your cloth. You may have to considerably alter/lower your expectations. For instance, you may want to look at a few years of renting places before saving enough to place a deposit on a house.
messengercrow wrote:
Mon Nov 01, 2021 5:50 pm
The visa fee makes it difficult for me to want to remain here.
You are of course free to leave. You may want to look at the continent, which has lower immigration fees (but different healthcare structures).
I am not a lawyer or immigration advisor. My statements/comments do not constitute legal advice. E&OE. Please do not PM me for advice.

lolo2
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Re: Don't you think GTV is an expensive scheme?

Post by lolo2 » Wed Nov 03, 2021 10:42 am

I am not 100% familiar with fees for the GTV, but every single route has similar costs: application fee, IHS, etc.

I think you are working in academia? Unlike many people outside the UK think, salaries in academia are very low compared to the duties or level of responsibilities we have (or the money unis charge to students). I want to believe that every single worker coming to the UK, in any route, does their maths and plan accordingly before applying for a visa. However I also understand that sometimes from the outside we can underestimate the reality.

My first salary in the UK was more than £5k lower than yours, in a sort of 'semi-senior' position. And I was able to pay for my expenses living in London, and also pay my family expenses (4 people) back in my country where the combined income is like £6 a month, and the prices of goods and services are pretty much similar than here. Without an approppriate (or estrict) financial planning, I would haven't make it. If you see my flag you will have an idea what I am talking about.

As previously said, buying a car is not always the best solution to improve your mobility, in fact it will add an extra expense to your budget (hint: having a car in the UK is also expensive, and even more if you have a foreign driving licence). Try to find accommodation somewhere as closer as possible to your workplace, so you can walk or cycle and save the money from transportation. A lot of families have children and they don't have cars.

secret.simon
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Re: Don't you think GTV is an expensive scheme?

Post by secret.simon » Wed Nov 03, 2021 3:01 pm

I agree with many of the points made in the post above.

While answering my earlier post, I did reflect wryly that when I arrived in the UK (about 10 years ago), my earlier salary was £19,000. Swings and roundabouts, I guess. But then I did not have Global Talent. I was merely Highly Skilled.
lolo2 wrote:
Wed Nov 03, 2021 10:42 am
Without an approppriate (or estrict) financial planning, I would haven't make it.
I completely agree with this point and can't agree with it enough. Planning for migration begins (or should begin) years before the event. As I have written in an earlier post, I had researched on how to get around London and the UK for cheap, what facilities are available in local libraries, mobile phone plans, etc, before I had arrived in the UK. So, when I arrived into the UK, I hit the ground running, with getting my Oyster card, local library membership and SIM card on Day One.

You'd want to plan our your finances in some granularity, in one or a few spreadsheets.

I am hoping to help my brother emigrate as well and am using the same techniques and tactics to help him prepare for not just the immigration process, but for settling in and integrating successfully wherever he emigrates to.
lolo2 wrote:
Wed Nov 03, 2021 10:42 am
Try to find accommodation somewhere as closer as possible to your workplace, so you can walk or cycle and save the money from transportation.
Again, I completely agree.

Based on their salary, I would say that the OP may meet the minimum requirements for the Intermediate Market Rent (IMR) scheme of their local council (which is different from social housing).

In IMR, you rent a flat from the local council at 80% of the local market rent (generally in newly built flats) for a period of 3 to 5 years. The idea is that the reduction in rent allows you to save the deposit to then purchase the flat from the developer of the newly built flats.

The OP should check with the local council where they live AND the local council where they work. Generally preference is given to those who already live locally, but those who work locally are also eligible.
I am not a lawyer or immigration advisor. My statements/comments do not constitute legal advice. E&OE. Please do not PM me for advice.

messengercrow
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4 months after arrival: was GTV really worth it?

Post by messengercrow » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:00 pm

So I have asked for a 6-month leave from my permanent job in my country and got a 2-year GTV to come to the UK to see if this route of immigration is really worth it. I am married and have a child but I have not applied for their visas yet. Also, I was lucky I found a job in my own profession as a scientist from day 1. Today marks 4 months I have been here. However, I want to share with you my opinion and thoughts about this route of immigration:

- my first thought is that I think the UK GTV is too expensive and people should avoid it as much as they can, unless they have money and want to invest for some time until it pays off.

I'll give you an example: a colleague of mine has a sponsorship visa. His visa and health fees are completely covered by the institute for up to 3 years. The only thing that he should pay on his own is the application fees for his wife and child, which I have a feeling will be less than mine. The only difference between my route and his? I have not noticed anything yet.

It is true that I can switch jobs (Royal Society told me I don't even need to inform them), but he can also get another sponsorship job. Unless you have money, it is difficult to remain jobless in this country. It is kind of paycheck to paycheck in this country.

- Your dependents must pay same initial visa and IHS fees as you.

This is what I didn't pay attention to when I was applying as my goal was to prepare documents to get my own visa first. I have paid an initial application and two years of IHS (~£608 + 2x~£680). My dependents must pay the same amount. This is bone-breaking if you are from a developing country and your currency is weaker compared to GBP.

I even contacted the UK visa office at WorkNonSponsoredCasework@homeoffice.com, and asked them if my family's initial application can be shorter than mine, but they said it is not possible. They have to pay same amount as me. Excluding other costs (read below) a family of three need to invest at least £15000 on the GTV fee before being eligible for ILR.

- the extension fee is also £608 for each dependent

If you have money, it will make more sense to apply for a longer period. I made a mistake and applied only for 2 years. Four months have already passed, which means I need to apply in a year and pay same amount to extend. The extension fee is also £608. This is for each family member. Be hopeful they won't increase the IHS fees before extension.

- The Jus Soli law has changed. Your UK-born child will not get instant citizenship anymore.

If you are thinking about adding a new member to your family, think again. If you are under GTV, the child won't get citizenship. Consider application fee and other costs as well. It won't be cheap. Citizenship rule may change if you have ILR, I suppose, but I am not sure.

- England is generally too expensive, especially around London and suburbs.

I have been to the UK a lot. I even got my MSc degree from here 20 years ago. London has lots of entertainment. But at what cost? Is it worth it? I am not young anymore and have seen it all, so I'll pass.

Unless you have a particular reason for coming to the UK, e.g. joining family, I think avoid coming to the UK, and try other immigrant-accepting countries such as Canada, Australia or New Zealand.

I travel to Ottawa sometimes, and I think the ratio of income to the cost of life is much more reasonable. Toronto is more expensive, but still cheaper than London in my opinion.

Other UK cities, such as Nottingham, Newcastle or even Liverpool are cheaper. You can buy an apartment for just £100k there and rents are cheaper too. Try www.rightmove.co.uk and see it for yourself. Unless you have no problem with different British accents you can try going there (Google different accents if you don't know what I am talking about). My child's accent is North American so the best I can do for him is bring him to London.

The majority of GTV applicants are from developing countries. Even if you want to come here and live in shared houses, you still need to invest and bring money with you. Since our currencies are too weak compared to GBP, this is a big challenge.

Also, you would need at least £2-4 k to buy a cheap and small used car. Add insurance to it. Also, take note that if you have international driving license, your insurance company will charge you more. For a provisional license, you need to pay ~£700, and will take nearly a year. You can't apply for local driving license if you have been here less than 180 days. Train, metro and bus are expensive too. Generally transport is expensive here. For a one-way Jubilee line I pay nearly ~£5.

- don't come here unless you have a job.

Living with family with an annual salary of £33000 is impossible. They will deduct so much tax from it. My colleague who is under sponsorship visa is earning same monthly salary, even-though I have paid IHS in advance. Unless you find a job with more than annual £45000, your wife should also work.

- Expenses I had no idea I had to pay

Landlords and real estate agents will push you to sign long contracts. The shortest contract you can find, especially if you are married and can't share houses, is a 1-year contract. But make sure to put a Break Clause less than that in your contract. The shortest Break Clause is usually 6 months. This means under any circumstances you have to pay the 6 months rent, even if you decide to leave the country after 3 months. If you don't they can take you to court, and this will disrupt your ILR process.

Let me give you another example, a real estate agent was trying to fool me with a 2-year contract with a Break Clause of 18 months. For a property with a monthly rent of £1300 this would mean £23000. This is too risky if you are a postdoc under a short term job contract. If you find another job in a different location you have to pay the 18 months rent in full before you can leave.

It is true that there are more job opportunities in the UK compared to other migrant-accepting countries, but the competition is tighter too. Don't expect to find a job immediately after your current job contract finishes.

- ILR rules are different based on endorsing body
If your goal is to stay here long enough to get ILR (same as PR I suppose), then apply for an initial 3-4 year GTV. However, I have heard Tech-Nation GTV holders must stay longer (5 years) to get ILR. I am still unsure if we need to extend our GTV status after receiving ILR. I am also unsure if we need to work in our own field of expertise (the one we got endorsed with) to be eligible for ILR, or doing other jobs can also get us an ILR in 3 years? I think no GTV holder has received ILR yet because GTV has been introduced recently. Correct me if I'm wrong please.


Bottom line, I am unsure I want to stay here, honestly. Although the UK is suffering from expert and worker shortages, I think GTV is all about the money. They don't care you are a professor or expert in your field of science. Instead of welcoming you, they crush you with expenses.....but you chose wisely.

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Re: 4 months after arrival: was GTV really worth it?

Post by CR001 » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:07 pm

Again, no one forced you to come to the UK or is forcing you to stay. You are free to leave whenever you wish to.

Immigration doesn't work out for everyone and most don't have unrealistic expectations as you appear to have. Many earn far less than you do as a couple and manage.

Different visa routes have different requirements. Do your research accordingly and if you didn't, then it is no one fault but your own.
Char (CR001 not Casa)
In life you cannot press the Backspace button!!
Please DO NOT send me a PM for immigration advice. I reserve the right to ignore the PM and not respond.

messengercrow
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Re: 4 months after arrival: was GTV really worth it?

Post by messengercrow » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:09 pm

OK Karen. Please don't talk to my manager.

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