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Bigyou
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Wales

When is an application considered late?

Post by Bigyou » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:10 pm

Hello all,

I just applied for my extension but could not put in the application till the last day of expiry of my permit. So i would like to know when an application is considered late application. Thanks

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marcnath
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Re: When is an application considered late?

Post by marcnath » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:30 pm

Bigyou wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:10 pm
Hello all,

I just applied for my extension but could not put in the application till the last day of expiry of my permit. So i would like to know when an application is considered late application. Thanks
From the guidance:

Date of application : You are inside the UK: The date of application is the date of posting or, if you send by courier, the date delivered to the Home Office
My comments are in no way meant to be advisory. I have no professional knowledge of immigration. These are based on my own experience, convictions and personal interpretation of publicly available information.

Bigyou
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Posts: 46
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:44 pm
Wales

Re: When is an application considered late?

Post by Bigyou » Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:17 am

Thanks Marcnath.

So in essence my application should not be considered late as i am not overstaying yet.

cancerian
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Re: When is an application considered late?

Post by cancerian » Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:39 am

i think your application is considered late when you apply or send your documents after your visa is expired. you should keep a proof of posting receipt when you send your documents. you have to send your application of extension before your current visa expires.

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marcnath
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Re: When is an application considered late?

Post by marcnath » Tue Nov 14, 2017 6:40 am

Bigyou wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:17 am
Thanks Marcnath.

So in essence my application should not be considered late as i am not overstaying yet.
Assuming you posted the application and not sent it by courier, yes.
My comments are in no way meant to be advisory. I have no professional knowledge of immigration. These are based on my own experience, convictions and personal interpretation of publicly available information.

Bigyou
Newbie
Posts: 46
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:44 pm
Wales

Re: When is an application considered late?

Post by Bigyou » Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:02 am

Okay thanks it was posted. Cheers

Bigyou
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Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:44 pm
Wales

Validity date

Post by Bigyou » Mon Nov 27, 2017 12:55 pm

Hello house,

Please i would like to know about application validity date.

If an application is considered invalid, does compliance to the validity change the date of application? Will the old application date be used or the new date according to the validiation of the application?

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Zimba
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Re: Validity date

Post by Zimba » Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:16 pm

If an application is returned as invalid, it is treated like it has been never been made. So there will be no application date.
Currently the rules allow HO to contact the applicant and given them an opportunity to fix any issue to prevent an application from being rendered invalid.
Advice is given based on my personal research and experience only. DO NOT contact me via private messages for advice

Bigyou
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Posts: 46
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Wales

Re: Validity date

Post by Bigyou » Tue Nov 28, 2017 5:15 am

Okay thanks Zimba. Noted

Bigyou
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Wales

Extension refused

Post by Bigyou » Mon Nov 25, 2019 7:44 am

Hello all,

Thanks to all on this forum, i can have some understanding of things.

My application has been refused after over two years of applying.

The reasons given was with genuiness of business and creation of job.

Honestly, things have been downwards with regards to the business and creation of job. So i am not confident of these areas. I have been asked to put in for administrative review if i think the decision was not right.

I have less than a year to complete the ten years route and was wondering what i could do to buy some more time till i complete the 10 years.

I have a dependent child who has lived over 7 years continuously here.

I am in a dilemma and would be glad if i get advise to navigate trough this maze.

Thanks

Bigyou
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Posts: 46
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:44 pm
Wales

Re: Extension refused

Post by Bigyou » Mon Nov 25, 2019 8:04 am

The reasons given was with genuiness of business, credibility of business and creation of job.

1. a. Genuiness: due to submission of incorrect information regarding turnover. Based on this information from the visit, its clear you dont have adequate understanding of financial matters of the business.

b. The lack of scope and limited scope of the services that you desribed at interview leads us to question the credibility of the contract you have provided in support of your application and described at interview.

2. Due to lack of evidence provided regarding client and no evidence being provided of the work hours of your current and previous employee. We have concerns whether your business has a genuine need and sizeable workload to justify recruitment of employees.


I have a dependent child who has lived over 7 years continuously here.

In his refusal they said considerations have been given to section 55 of the borders, citizens, and immigration Act 2009. ....

Stating that...

"In this particular case, it has been concluded that the need to maintain the intergrity of the immigration laws outweighs the possible effect on your children that might result from you and your children having to re-establish family life outside the UK".

entrepreneurman1925
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Re: Extension refused

Post by entrepreneurman1925 » Mon Nov 25, 2019 12:54 pm

Hi,

Can you give us a breakdown of the jobs/employees? (dates they were hired, weekly hours etc.).

It would be helpful if you posted the exact refusal wording especially about the jobs.

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marcnath
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Re: Extension refused

Post by marcnath » Thu Nov 28, 2019 3:39 pm

Bigyou wrote:
Mon Nov 25, 2019 8:04 am
The reasons given was with genuiness of business, credibility of business and creation of job.

1. a. Genuiness: due to submission of incorrect information regarding turnover. Based on this information from the visit, its clear you dont have adequate understanding of financial matters of the business.

b. The lack of scope and limited scope of the services that you desribed at interview leads us to question the credibility of the contract you have provided in support of your application and described at interview.

2. Due to lack of evidence provided regarding client and no evidence being provided of the work hours of your current and previous employee. We have concerns whether your business has a genuine need and sizeable workload to justify recruitment of employees.


I have a dependent child who has lived over 7 years continuously here.

In his refusal they said considerations have been given to section 55 of the borders, citizens, and immigration Act 2009. ....

Stating that...

"In this particular case, it has been concluded that the need to maintain the intergrity of the immigration laws outweighs the possible effect on your children that might result from you and your children having to re-establish family life outside the UK".
Your business doing bad has nothing to do with your extension application. So I don't understand why you were not confident about business and jobs - they are either genuine or they are not.

If they are genuine, you have to fight for it.

Having said that, to the refusal points you put up above:
1. Depending on what the incorrect info was and how far the financial figures were incorrect, you may have grounds to argue. A business owner does not need to know all figures accurately - that is what accountants are for. But it is expected that the entrepreneur understands the overall business and major figures.
2. Again difficult to say without having precise details, but HO shouldn't be the one deciding what the need of the business is. But if there is insufficient evidence of work done, that will be tough.

You can always apply for FLR (FP) on the basis of your child once the AR process is exhausted. But they seem to have already tried to address it in advance, so it is not something that you can be guaranteed of success
My comments are in no way meant to be advisory. I have no professional knowledge of immigration. These are based on my own experience, convictions and personal interpretation of publicly available information.

Bigyou
Newbie
Posts: 46
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:44 pm
Wales

Re: Extension refused

Post by Bigyou » Sat Nov 30, 2019 12:16 pm

entrepreneurman1925 wrote:
Mon Nov 25, 2019 12:54 pm
Hi,

Can you give us a breakdown of the jobs/employees? (dates they were hired, weekly hours etc.).

It would be helpful if you posted the exact refusal wording especially about the jobs.
It is an 11 page refusal and i could only type the important bits. Much of it was from the interview process.

Bigyou
Newbie
Posts: 46
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:44 pm
Wales

Re: Extension refused

Post by Bigyou » Sat Nov 30, 2019 12:17 pm

marcnath wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 3:39 pm
Bigyou wrote:
Mon Nov 25, 2019 8:04 am
The reasons given was with genuiness of business, credibility of business and creation of job.

1. a. Genuiness: due to submission of incorrect information regarding turnover. Based on this information from the visit, its clear you dont have adequate understanding of financial matters of the business.

b. The lack of scope and limited scope of the services that you desribed at interview leads us to question the credibility of the contract you have provided in support of your application and described at interview.

2. Due to lack of evidence provided regarding client and no evidence being provided of the work hours of your current and previous employee. We have concerns whether your business has a genuine need and sizeable workload to justify recruitment of employees.


I have a dependent child who has lived over 7 years continuously here.

In his refusal they said considerations have been given to section 55 of the borders, citizens, and immigration Act 2009. ....

Stating that...

"In this particular case, it has been concluded that the need to maintain the intergrity of the immigration laws outweighs the possible effect on your children that might result from you and your children having to re-establish family life outside the UK".
Your business doing bad has nothing to do with your extension application. So I don't understand why you were not confident about business and jobs - they are either genuine or they are not.

If they are genuine, you have to fight for it.

Having said that, to the refusal points you put up above:
1. Depending on what the incorrect info was and how far the financial figures were incorrect, you may have grounds to argue. A business owner does not need to know all figures accurately - that is what accountants are for. But it is expected that the entrepreneur understands the overall business and major figures.
2. Again difficult to say without having precise details, but HO shouldn't be the one deciding what the need of the business is. But if there is insufficient evidence of work done, that will be tough.

You can always apply for FLR (FP) on the basis of your child once the AR process is exhausted. But they seem to have already tried to address it in advance, so it is not something that you can be guaranteed of success
Thanks @marcnath. This make a lot of sense in arguing for the application. So if my son has lived here for 9 years, he is not guaranteed of a visa?

Is that what the clause in section 55 quoted means?

Thanks again

Bigyou
Newbie
Posts: 46
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:44 pm
Wales

Re: Extension refused

Post by Bigyou » Sat Nov 30, 2019 12:21 pm

marcnath wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 3:39 pm
Bigyou wrote:
Mon Nov 25, 2019 8:04 am
The reasons given was with genuiness of business, credibility of business and creation of job.

1. a. Genuiness: due to submission of incorrect information regarding turnover. Based on this information from the visit, its clear you dont have adequate understanding of financial matters of the business.

b. The lack of scope and limited scope of the services that you desribed at interview leads us to question the credibility of the contract you have provided in support of your application and described at interview.

2. Due to lack of evidence provided regarding client and no evidence being provided of the work hours of your current and previous employee. We have concerns whether your business has a genuine need and sizeable workload to justify recruitment of employees.


I have a dependent child who has lived over 7 years continuously here.

In his refusal they said considerations have been given to section 55 of the borders, citizens, and immigration Act 2009. ....

Stating that...

"In this particular case, it has been concluded that the need to maintain the intergrity of the immigration laws outweighs the possible effect on your children that might result from you and your children having to re-establish family life outside the UK".
Your business doing bad has nothing to do with your extension application. So I don't understand why you were not confident about business and jobs - they are either genuine or they are not.

If they are genuine, you have to fight for it.

Having said that, to the refusal points you put up above:
1. Depending on what the incorrect info was and how far the financial figures were incorrect, you may have grounds to argue. A business owner does not need to know all figures accurately - that is what accountants are for. But it is expected that the entrepreneur understands the overall business and major figures.
2. Again difficult to say without having precise details, but HO shouldn't be the one deciding what the need of the business is. But if there is insufficient evidence of work done, that will be tough.

You can always apply for FLR (FP) on the basis of your child once the AR process is exhausted. But they seem to have already tried to address it in advance, so it is not something that you can be guaranteed of success

Please what is the full meaning of the FLP? I only need a year to be able to apply for indefinite leave to remain. So i would rather a route that gives me the flexibility to reach the 10 years legal route.

Please advise.

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marcnath
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Location: Milton Keynes

Re: Extension refused

Post by marcnath » Sun Dec 01, 2019 7:21 pm

Bigyou wrote:
Sat Nov 30, 2019 12:17 pm
marcnath wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 3:39 pm
Bigyou wrote:
Mon Nov 25, 2019 8:04 am
The reasons given was with genuiness of business, credibility of business and creation of job.

1. a. Genuiness: due to submission of incorrect information regarding turnover. Based on this information from the visit, its clear you dont have adequate understanding of financial matters of the business.

b. The lack of scope and limited scope of the services that you desribed at interview leads us to question the credibility of the contract you have provided in support of your application and described at interview.

2. Due to lack of evidence provided regarding client and no evidence being provided of the work hours of your current and previous employee. We have concerns whether your business has a genuine need and sizeable workload to justify recruitment of employees.


I have a dependent child who has lived over 7 years continuously here.

In his refusal they said considerations have been given to section 55 of the borders, citizens, and immigration Act 2009. ....

Stating that...

"In this particular case, it has been concluded that the need to maintain the intergrity of the immigration laws outweighs the possible effect on your children that might result from you and your children having to re-establish family life outside the UK".
Your business doing bad has nothing to do with your extension application. So I don't understand why you were not confident about business and jobs - they are either genuine or they are not.

If they are genuine, you have to fight for it.

Having said that, to the refusal points you put up above:
1. Depending on what the incorrect info was and how far the financial figures were incorrect, you may have grounds to argue. A business owner does not need to know all figures accurately - that is what accountants are for. But it is expected that the entrepreneur understands the overall business and major figures.
2. Again difficult to say without having precise details, but HO shouldn't be the one deciding what the need of the business is. But if there is insufficient evidence of work done, that will be tough.

You can always apply for FLR (FP) on the basis of your child once the AR process is exhausted. But they seem to have already tried to address it in advance, so it is not something that you can be guaranteed of success
Thanks @marcnath. This make a lot of sense in arguing for the application. So if my son has lived here for 9 years, he is not guaranteed of a visa?

Is that what the clause in section 55 quoted means?

Thanks again
Sorry to say there are no guarantees just because your son has lived here for 9 years.

FLR(FP) is an application to remain on the basis of family connections, in this case your son's long stay here.

But none of this has any guarantees
My comments are in no way meant to be advisory. I have no professional knowledge of immigration. These are based on my own experience, convictions and personal interpretation of publicly available information.

Bigyou
Newbie
Posts: 46
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:44 pm
Wales

Re: Extension refused

Post by Bigyou » Sat Dec 07, 2019 5:08 am

Hello all,

I am still in a dilemma. I have 2 options to apply with as i have applied for Administrative review and want to withdraw it before they make a decision.

a. to reapply as entrepreneur before AR is decided. What do i need to make a fresh application in this category? I already have point in other areas except genuiness of business and creation of job. Do i have to make a fresh application meeting all other criteria again or just addressing the points where i did not get point. Creation of job i had 2 staff up till march and 1 staff till August this year.

b. To reapply on basis of my son - assuming i put in for this and it is denied but i keep pushing for it to get me to the 10years route for indefinite will i be able to apply fir ILR in Nov?

Secondly, I have put in an AR but would desperately want to protect the 9 years. I want to withdraw the AR and put in one of this option above for my application. Will withdrawing the AR and putting in another application protect the 9 years i have already?

Please help!

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marcnath
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Location: Milton Keynes

Re: Extension refused

Post by marcnath » Sun Dec 08, 2019 6:32 pm

Bigyou wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 5:08 am
Hello all,

I am still in a dilemma. I have 2 options to apply with as i have applied for Administrative review and want to withdraw it before they make a decision.

a. to reapply as entrepreneur before AR is decided. What do i need to make a fresh application in this category? I already have point in other areas except genuiness of business and creation of job. Do i have to make a fresh application meeting all other criteria again or just addressing the points where i did not get point. Creation of job i had 2 staff up till march and 1 staff till August this year.

b. To reapply on basis of my son - assuming i put in for this and it is denied but i keep pushing for it to get me to the 10years route for indefinite will i be able to apply fir ILR in Nov?

Secondly, I have put in an AR but would desperately want to protect the 9 years. I want to withdraw the AR and put in one of this option above for my application. Will withdrawing the AR and putting in another application protect the 9 years i have already?

Please help!
When you make a new application, the old one is considered withdrawn automatically - two immigration applications cannot exist at the same time. Once the new application is in, you become an overstayer. If the subsequent application is successful, then the overstay will be ignored
a. Yes, you need to make a full application. It is a FRESH application and will be considered on its own.
b. As mentioned earlier you can't have another application at the same time. If you apply for your extension again and it is refused, you will not be able to apply for FLR as you would have been an overstayer.
My comments are in no way meant to be advisory. I have no professional knowledge of immigration. These are based on my own experience, convictions and personal interpretation of publicly available information.

Bigyou
Newbie
Posts: 46
Joined: Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:44 pm
Wales

Re: Extension refused

Post by Bigyou » Sun Dec 08, 2019 7:03 pm

So please what is the safest option now? FLR? Please advise. Thanks

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