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Refusal Indication

Only for UK Tier 1 (Entrepreneur) points system

Moderators: Casa, JAJ, ca.funke, Amber, Zimba, vinny, Obie, EUsmileWEallsmile, batleykhan, geriatrix, John, ChetanOjha, archigabe, push

ukbiz
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Posts: 48
Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2016 3:33 pm

Re: Refusal Indication

Post by ukbiz » Wed Dec 21, 2016 3:15 pm

Appendix A, does say 30/week but it does not say it has to be 130 fixed hour per month if your employee works weekly 30/W and over 12 months total hours should be 1560 which is equal to average 130 hours per month.

Hi think you guys are making it complicated for no reason, in real business world if you are working 30 hours per week your maximum month hours for Feb 2016 will be 126 hours, not 130 ! as your monthly total hours on 30/W will be proportionate to numbers of working days each month and if CW don't understand and can't use their common sense to calculate that then they are highly incompetent to deal with highly skills case !

If guidance by HO can be wrong then the interpretation of Appendix A as 30/W = Fixed 130/M can also prove to be wrong and you can defend this in AR which should be acceptable.

And If you are still not Convenience then Show the extra months of employment (more than 12 months) to cover the deficiency of monthly hours of those months which totals are less than 130/M , for your peace of Mind.

alishaikh777
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Re: Refusal Indication

Post by alishaikh777 » Wed Dec 21, 2016 4:17 pm

now it has become very simple ,
if they are saying 30 hours a week means , 6 hours a day .
52 weeks in a year X 30 hrs = 1560 hours
each year having 261 working days X 6 = 1566 Hours
each of the month is having different number of working hours . lets say 2016 as follows ;
JAN...........21 Days X 6 Hrs = 126 hrs
FEB...........21 Days X 6 Hrs = 126 hrs
MAR...........23 Days X 6 Hrs = 138 hrs
APR...........21 Days X 6 Hrs = 126 hrs
MAY...........22 Days X 6 Hrs = 132 hrs
JUN...........22 Days X 6 Hrs = 132 hrs
JUL...........21 Days X 6 Hrs = 126 hrs
AUG...........23 Days X 6 Hrs = 138 hrs
SEP...........22 Days X 6 Hrs = 132 hrs
OCT...........21 Days X 6 Hrs = 126 hrs
NOV...........22 Days X 6 Hrs = 132 hrs
DEC...........22 Days X 6 Hrs = 132 hrs

The result shows , the maximum is 138 hours in few months , and minimum is 126 hours.
So the guidance is correct 120 hours / month . means they saying any monthly pay slip 120 hours are above is acceptable , as in some years there is month when there are 20 working days X 6, which means 120 Hours .
So they saying we will consider 120 hours are above a month as a required .

So the logic majority people or lawyers are having that 1560 hours divided in 12 months is equal to = 130 hours , which is no way possible because in many months its 138 hours and in few months its 126 hours or 120 hours .
So the simple definition is if you are paying weekly the working hours minimum should be 30 hours . if you are paying monthly working hours minimum should be 120 hours .
and for more info , when we make employment contract we already mention every day working hours timings, so you can't beg your employee to work few hours more in month of Feb , as the working days are short . and you need to apply for visa.

I agree many of those in this topic who reffered guidance saying 120 hours month . if bad luck with CW,, then can easily win in JR .
cheers all

scholar 1
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Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Dec 21, 2016 2:42 pm

Re: Refusal Indication

Post by scholar 1 » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:00 pm

Again, just explain in your cover letter to caseworker that worker x worked for so and so period 30hrs per week. That takes care of the calculation in your payslip.

Some weeks overlap in a month but I think the minimum is four weeks/month.

jafersadeq
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Location: LONDON
St Kitts-Nevis

Re: Refusal Indication

Post by jafersadeq » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:24 pm

scholar 1 wrote:please can someone check the refusal letter properly, its says ''we accept a maximum of 130hrs per month''. The minimum is 120hrs. The guidance cannot be wrong.
They said "We accept a maximum" NOT " we accept a minimum as well".
There is no minimum they pointed, the maximum is 130 and if a worker works 170 they just count 130.

jafersadeq
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Re: Refusal Indication

Post by jafersadeq » Wed Dec 21, 2016 7:36 pm

alishaikh777 wrote:now it has become very simple ,
if they are saying 30 hours a week means , 6 hours a day .
52 weeks in a year X 30 hrs = 1560 hours
each year having 261 working days X 6 = 1566 Hours
each of the month is having different number of working hours . lets say 2016 as follows ;
JAN...........21 Days X 6 Hrs = 126 hrs
FEB...........21 Days X 6 Hrs = 126 hrs
MAR...........23 Days X 6 Hrs = 138 hrs
APR...........21 Days X 6 Hrs = 126 hrs
MAY...........22 Days X 6 Hrs = 132 hrs
JUN...........22 Days X 6 Hrs = 132 hrs
JUL...........21 Days X 6 Hrs = 126 hrs
AUG...........23 Days X 6 Hrs = 138 hrs
SEP...........22 Days X 6 Hrs = 132 hrs
OCT...........21 Days X 6 Hrs = 126 hrs
NOV...........22 Days X 6 Hrs = 132 hrs
DEC...........22 Days X 6 Hrs = 132 hrs

The result shows , the maximum is 138 hours in few months , and minimum is 126 hours.
So the guidance is correct 120 hours / month . means they saying any monthly pay slip 120 hours are above is acceptable , as in some years there is month when there are 20 working days X 6, which means 120 Hours .
So they saying we will consider 120 hours are above a month as a required .

So the logic majority people or lawyers are having that 1560 hours divided in 12 months is equal to = 130 hours , which is no way possible because in many months its 138 hours and in few months its 126 hours or 120 hours .
So the simple definition is if you are paying weekly the working hours minimum should be 30 hours . if you are paying monthly working hours minimum should be 120 hours .
and for more info , when we make employment contract we already mention every day working hours timings, so you can't beg your employee to work few hours more in month of Feb , as the working days are short . and you need to apply for visa.

I agree many of those in this topic who reffered guidance saying 120 hours month . if bad luck with CW,, then can easily win in JR .
cheers all

Are you paying MONTHLY or WEEKLY ? and what is the hourly rate, so that we can calculate it.

Thanks

tier1in2014
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India

Re: Refusal Indication

Post by tier1in2014 » Sat Dec 24, 2016 1:08 pm

How would they count one part time employee who worked for 8 months and under 120hrs per moth . LIke we have a employee who worked 100 hrs x 6 months and 70hrs x 2 months . will they add up the total number of hrs to 3120 hrs or this as 4 month full time .

Sorry noajthan I know I have asked this before too .
I am not perfect But I guess no one is ever perfect . We all make mistakes and learn from them. Never give up keep trying until you succeed.

scholar 1
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Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Dec 21, 2016 2:42 pm

Re: Refusal Indication

Post by scholar 1 » Thu Dec 29, 2016 11:30 am

I just noted that it looks like HO has stopped calculating employment by total yearly hours. In the past, up to early this year the renewal application form asks you to state the combined total hours of your employee 1560 x 2. But the new forms for both renewal and ILR application does not have this table. Now they want to just know if its full time job or part time and clearly states full time is 30hrs per week or 120hrs per month. I may be wrong but this may suggest that the emphasis is no longer on total yearly hours. Does anybody agree?

tier1in2014
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India

Re: Refusal Indication

Post by tier1in2014 » Thu Dec 29, 2016 11:48 am

Not sure how they will be counting hrs as there is such formula given any where on policy guidance or under immigration rules . This is why I have been confused with my part time employee . Zimba please if you can input on this will be big help to clear this confusion . Thanks
I am not perfect But I guess no one is ever perfect . We all make mistakes and learn from them. Never give up keep trying until you succeed.

live4pride
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Posts: 134
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Location: UK

Re: Refusal Indication

Post by live4pride » Fri Jan 06, 2017 11:06 pm

Relying on guidance and maintaining your business whilst you have some part timers on payroll means that we are in a situation where no one has a clue whats going on with part timers. Which ultimately means its a waste of time and resources.. Would await for some successful application with suitably presented part timers.. :)
where there's a will there's a way

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Zimba
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Re: Refusal Indication

Post by Zimba » Fri Jan 06, 2017 11:41 pm

I've made an attempt to have a go at it previously here: http://www.immigrationboards.com/uk-tie ... l#p1437307

As I said before, there is no definite guide on this. I know that for the part time jobs, you can combine them to reach 30 hours a week but hours of a part time job on its own or mixing full time/part time hours together are different cases and not covered by the rules.
Advice is given based on my personal research and experience only. Do NOT contact me via private message for immigration advice

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