question about fiancé using visitor visa for a longish stay

[askingman]

Some background:

My russian fiancé and I have known each other (online) 9 months ago, been very close for the last 6 months, and have actually met in person for three weeks so far, a week last month in Moscow followed by two weeks in the UK on her newly granted visitor visa.

We've been advised that we need to meet up a bit more and spend more time together before applying for a Fiancé visa, as although the rules state only that we must have met it is likely that the ECO would view the limited time together so far as a sign that the relationship may not be genuine.

As she lives in a remote closed city I cannot visit her in Russia, and the costs of her getting in and out of the place are vast (a month of her wages just in airfares to Moscow) we are thinking that we should use the rest of her visitor visa to spend over 4 months together in the UK (she'll have to leave her job to do this, but would be doing that anyway when applying for a Fiancé visa). We hope it would be hard to argue that the relationship is not genuine when we've been living together (supported by me) for such a length of time!

My question:

Can anyone see a problem with using the remaining 4 and a bit months of the visitor visa to do this? We have no intention to overstay as she would be going back to Moscow to apply for the Fiancé visa before her visitor visa expires. However we are worried about what the Immigration Officer at Heathrow might do faced with an intended stay of 4 months.

We've been thinking about getting return tickets for a ten day visit, easier to explain on entry, then altering the return part of the flight to a few days before the visa expires.

Would this cause any trouble, are the IND likely to record what she says at Heathrow about how long she intends to stay - or would they be interested only in the fact that she finally left before her visa expired?

Many thanks for any advice anyone can give!


G.

[Wanderer]

Some background:

My russian fiancé and I have known each other (online) 9 months ago, been very close for the last 6 months, and have actually met in person for three weeks so far, a week last month in Moscow followed by two weeks in the UK on her newly granted visitor visa.

We've been advised that we need to meet up a bit more and spend more time together before applying for a Fiancé visa, as although the rules state only that we must have met it is likely that the ECO would view the limited time together so far as a sign that the relationship may not be genuine.

As she lives in a remote closed city I cannot visit her in Russia, and the costs of her getting in and out of the place are vast (a month of her wages just in airfares to Moscow) we are thinking that we should use the rest of her visitor visa to spend over 4 months together in the UK (she'll have to leave her job to do this, but would be doing that anyway when applying for a Fiancé visa). We hope it would be hard to argue that the relationship is not genuine when we've been living together (supported by me) for such a length of time!

My question:

Can anyone see a problem with using the remaining 4 and a bit months of the visitor visa to do this? We have no intention to overstay as she would be going back to Moscow to apply for the Fiancé visa before her visitor visa expires. However we are worried about what the Immigration Officer at Heathrow might do faced with an intended stay of 4 months.

We've been thinking about getting return tickets for a ten day visit, easier to explain on entry, then altering the return part of the flight to a few days before the visa expires.

Would this cause any trouble, are the IND likely to record what she says at Heathrow about how long she intends to stay - or would they be interested only in the fact that she finally left before her visa expired?

Many thanks for any advice anyone can give!


G.

Can be a problem, my (also Russian) partner spent three months here on a six months visa and got her knuckles rapped at the normally lenient Yekaterinburg Consulate when we applied for another visa. The next one was issued with a warning to return after two weeks. Which ignored cos we converted it a student visa but that's another story.....

I wouldn't risk it, for although Russia is fairly easy to get visas from, I've known others struggle with black marks on their immigration records.

Whilst the UK won't record her going out, the Russians will stamp her passport in, and the UK consulate will notice it and ask questions. That's what happened to us.

Давай пока и удачи........

[askingman]

Can be a problem, my (also Russian) partner spent three months here on a six months visa and got her knuckles rapped at the normally lenient Yekaterinburg Consulate when we applied for another visa. The next one was issued with a warning to return after two weeks. Which ignored cos we converted it a student visa but that's another story.....

Was the second visa you applied for another visitor one? We'll be applying for a settlement visa (either fiancé or spouse, depending on if we can get a CoA whilst she's here) so I'd have thought any ECO worries that she might want to stay for a long time again just won't be relevant any more.

Many thanks for the reply

[Wanderer]

Was the second visa you applied for another visitor one? We'll be applying for a settlement visa (either fiancé or spouse, depending on if we can get a CoA whilst she's here) so I'd have thought any ECO worries that she might want to stay for a long time again just won't be relevant any more.

Many thanks for the reply :)

They were both Short Term Student visas, six month duration, so I'd agree not exactly the same as ur sitch, but valid I think.

Also you should know u definitely can't switch from a Visitor visa to fiance or spouse or much else. So she'd have to apply from Russia.

It's the ECO mindset; they reckon a Visitor Visa is that, not for seeing ur boyfriend and living here on it. It's not a setlement visa or a visa leading to settlement. So it might work against you.

Having said that fiancee visa and spouse visa is almost a certainty from Russia provided ur not penniless so I wouldn't worry about that.

but i belive in face time in international relationships, we've used the visa system to live together in UK for over two years now, and we're still not ready to marry, certainly not for a visa.

You should see the horror stories I see WRT to marriage failures in Anglo-FSU couples....

Which city is she from? I'm asking if it's Ozhersk, in the Urals, cos I got in there once!

[askingman]

Also you should know u definitely can't switch from a Visitor visa to fiance or spouse or much else. So she'd have to apply from Russia.

I know that, but CoA is now possible even on a visitor visa because of the government losing the appeal in the Baiai court case.

And oddly enough there is a section in the FLR(M) form that specifically asks if you got married due to a CoA whilst here WITHOUT 'entry clearance as a spouse, civil partner, unmarried or same sex partner, fiancé(e) or proposed civil partner before entering the UK'. I can't see what that section if for unless it is possible to apply for FLR whilst here and just married.

(see section 5 of http://www.ind.homeoffice.gov.uk/6353/1 ... (m)may.pdf)

It's the ECO mindset; they reckon a Visitor Visa is that, not for seeing ur boyfriend and living here on it. It's not a setlement visa or a visa leading to settlement. So it might work against you.

Thanks.

Which city is she from? I'm asking if it's Ozhersk, in the Urals, cos I got in there once!

Dudinka, you can't get much more remote or closed

[Wanderer]

Ozhersk is Chelyabinsk-65, totally dangerous, due to several nuclear incidents in the 50's totally poisoning the land and rivers.

Dudinka is indeed totally off the beaten track, a bit like Burnley...

I never heard of CoA's on VV's I thought the no-switching rule would over-ride any other ruling - will check!

Visa denials from Russia are in the order of 2% so unless ur daft you can't go wrong.