Law on being outside of Ireland AFTER naturalisation application?

[niccim]

I see a lot of people mentioning second letters, but I'm not understanding what they are. Are they just confirmation or are they asking for more info?

I applied a year and half ago and have received two letters asking for info. The first asked me for a police report from the year I lived abroad. Seemed normal.

The second letter asked me for info on why it took me a month to get an appointment for a visa renewal. This one seemed a bit weird... my passport gives me three months to stay in Ireland before I apply for a visa. I made my appointment a month before I arrived and there just weren't any appointments for two months. I was covered by my tourist visa for the first month then had my appointment

Anyway, is this usual? Nothing has changed with my application, of course, but I'm dealing with another round of questions (that, honestly, I find self-evident).

[littlerr]

The letter you refer to is called a second stage letter. It would clearly say that your application has been moved to second stage.

On the letter you received, I doubt if this 'visa renewal' is what INIS is actually trying to know. I would imagine they are looking to know why you want to apply for a permission to live in Ireland, when you were holding a short term tourist visit. If you are a visa-required national, you would have to declare your intention in the visa application. If you are visa-exempt, you would still need to tell the immigration officer what your purpose is. If you told the immigration officer that your intention is tourism, but then you stayed in Ireland and sought for long term stay, INIS might interpret this as providing false information and intentionally misleading the officer.

You would need to explain whether any personal circumstances have changed substantially so that you eventually wanted to change your position from a temporary tourist to a permanent resident.

[niccim]

Oh that’s great news. I was hoping it would be a second stage letter.

As far as the tourist stamp, it’s a bit complicated. My husband and I had been out of Ireland for about a year for a work project of his. My stamp 4 expired when we were away, so when I arrived back, I was on a tourist visa. I’d already made my INIS appointment but everything was delayed so it was scheduled for a month after my arrival. I did indeed tell the immigration officer this and he stamped my passport saying I must have the stamp 4 renewed within 3 months (which I did do).

Ive now submitted proof that I had scheduled my appointment before my arrival so I would think that’s good. I felt it was a sort of unnecessary question but then again I was just hoping it would be an invitation. Anyway thanks so much for reply, I’m really happy to think this is the last few months

[niccim]

I am in the final stages of my citizenship application (started March 2019) and currently have a stamp 4 visa that expires in October 2020. My husband and I have been out of Ireland since December and I registered my mailing address as our family's home in Belfast.

Our plan was to move to Belfast after a short stay in Spain but our plans changed with COVID. When INIS asked for my Northern Irish visa, I explained that I do not have it and we have not yet moved permentantly to NI (my husband and I are both working remotely from Spain).

They have said that I need "permission to remain in the state up to the date of naturalisation" but I'm confused on this. I have a US passport so can enter the country at any time for the naturalisation and stay up to three months.

Do I really need to have another visa if I'm out of the country? I realise it wasn't allowed to be out of the country before the application, but is it also impossible after?

[littlerr]

Your US passport does not give you any *leave to remain* right in Ireland. It only gives a temporary right to *stay* in Ireland. There's a fundamental difference on whether you are counted as a resident or a visitor. Your application will no longer be considered if you are no longer a resident.

As part of your naturalisation application, you have had declared that you intend to continue being a resident of Ireland. Therefore, you must have a valid Stamp 4 at all times, until you are sworn in.

[jlad]

Literrr is spot on on this. Like what literrr has mentioned, being a US passport holder doesn't give you much rights in terms of residency. There is a difference between coming into the country as tourist or to reside. And the responsibility is on you to make sure you have all the permission up to date right up to when you receive your certificate.

If you were to move to Belfast (considering you havent receive your irish citizenship yet) you might want to look into applying UK visa to reside.

Since you have mentioned you have left Ireland in Dec and if you are residing in Spain now, and as a US passport holder, you are only allowed to spend 90days out of 180 days (again mostly for tourism purposes), you also have to make sure all your stay are legal.

Do you or have you applied for any legal permission to stay in Spain since you left Ireland?

[Vorona]

They have said that I need "permission to remain in the state up to the date of naturalisation" but I'm confused on this. I have a US passport so can enter the country at any time for the naturalisation and stay up to three months.

You're seriously mistaken on this. As people above pointed out, citizens of USA have no entitlement or right to be in Ireland. USA is not a member of EU. It is solely at discretion of immigration officer to decide to let you in or not.

Working without a valid permission while living in UK or Spain as a tourist is a very serious breach of immigration laws with far reaching consequences.
As a US migrant myself, I'm quite shocked with how irresponsible your actions are

[niccim]

[/quote]

You're seriously mistaken on this. As people above pointed out, citizens of USA have no entitlement or right to be in Ireland. USA is not a member of EU. It is solely at discretion of immigration officer to decide to let you in or not.

Working without a valid permission while living in UK or Spain as a tourist is a very serious breach of immigration laws with far reaching consequences.
As a US migrant myself, I'm quite shocked with how irresponsible your actions are
[/quote]

Appreciate the effort but please do be careful with the judgement and misinformation. EU family members are allowed to travel freely within the EU with family. It doesn't matter which government issues the visa. If I were to let my EU visa lapse at any time, with a visa-free passport, I do indeed have 90 days to renew my stamp four. Yes, I do realise that anyone can be denied entry into any country at any time, but this would be the exception, not the rule. While there is discretion left to the officer, there is also the burden of proof that I pose a threat that would be serious enough to deny my EU rights. Please familiar yourself with EU rights, not just a list of which countries are in the EU. We may be immigrants, but we still have rights and it is not just the mood of the officer.

Furthermore, the physical/mental act of working is not automatically illegal. A person can open their laptop anywhere and work. Again, an important right. Residency rights are not the same as work rights and, since you're giving Spanish visa advice, note Royal Decree 421/2020, which created COVID-appropriate immigration policy. Many people are working under different circumstances these days so scaremongering isn't help.