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Wifes' naturalisation: questions around section 3.1 - 3.5
Posted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 1:53 pm
by quantumscience
Hi
My wife is applying for her British citizenship via NCS, on the basis of marriage to me (a (naturalized) British citizen).
Of course she also qualifies on the other mandatory bits like residence requirements, etc. i.e. had ILR for 6 years now, and not been away from UK etc.
Anyway, I have one question though (on section 3.1 3.5 Tax office reference details):
She used to be working (on a Work permit) ages ago (before marriage) but she quit her job before our marriage (more than 8 years back) after going back to India.
When she was working here (for about 4+ years) she has paid tax, NI etc, and also has the tax reference number from that period. She went away from UK to back home and after our marriage she entered UK on spouse visa, and then on to ILR until now.
For all the time (ever since she entered uk on spouse visa) she is just housewife and that is what she is filling in as - i.e. Housewife.
Since she is only to give information about the past 3 years, and her tax details and work aspects pertain to before that period, should she still put her old UK tax reference, tax office details etc. on that form (section 3.1 - 3.5?) or is it not required?
She has anyway indicated her NI number and also put a note in the page/section 13 that she got this NI number before marriage while on work permit ages ago.
So similarly, should she also do the same thing for the past employment tax reference numbers or just leave that blank since she has nothing to do with her past employment?
... or maybe she can add an entry in the page/section 13 area) explaining the above.
Some advised us that more and non-required info is not to be given, but we are thinking why not put a note in section/page 13 since it is only a good thing - considering she has paid a lot of tax and NI during those years
I am curious to see what expert members have to say or those in similar circumstances have done who have got their application submitted.
Thanks.
Posted: Fri Jul 12, 2013 2:18 pm
by CR001
She only needs to write 'unemployed' or 'housewife'. The requirement is 3 years residence, so anything before that is not really relevant.
Employment etc is not a requirement for BC and there is no need to provide the information as it is not relevant to her current circumstances/application. UKBA have the means to check with HMRC anyway if they wanted to.
Posted: Mon Jul 15, 2013 2:32 pm
by quantumscience
Thanks.
One other question on the NI number section of the form.
Should she quote that number at all? That number was allotted to her - way back in past (about 12 years back when she was on work permit here in UK). Ever since marriage - i.e. 8+ years now, she is just housewife only.
Should she still fill that main AN form NI section with that number or put a note in Page 13 (other notes), or completely ignore NI aspect totally?
One guy from NCS (over phone) has said this info is not needed since it is sort of linked to the earlier section around employer/tax office etc. and since my wife is applying as Housewife it is irrelevant, but he is not sure of that
Posted: Mon Jul 15, 2013 4:58 pm
by CR001
Her NI number remains hers for life, she needs it if she works, claims benefits and her state pension! There is no harm done if she puts it on the form!
Posted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 2:42 pm
by Amber
quantumscience wrote:Hi
Looking at the August thread, it is clear that the HO guys are really working at a good pace (as normal), clearing applications within 4-5 weeks time (from start to approval). No extraordinary postal delays etc.
My wife (spouse of British citizen) applied on July 16th via NCS and nothing so far (after the acknowledgement).
Maybe the July applications (around that printer issue time) have been lost or something at HO Wink
A crazy thought... but i am thinking if we could withdraw her application and apply again (new fees etc.), so at least we can get in the September lot and get lucky (since that is how HO seems to be working these days – lottery style of picking applications)?
I know its a crazy thought, but could not resist thinking about it.. its really frustrating as to why it was not even allocated to a case worker Sad
Brits don't jump the queue... but no idea why they (HO) are jumping queue on the allocation process! Smile
Posted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 2:50 pm
by Derivaz
D4109125 wrote:quantumscience wrote:Hi
Looking at the August thread, it is clear that the HO guys are really working at a good pace (as normal), clearing applications within 4-5 weeks time (from start to approval). No extraordinary postal delays etc.
My wife (spouse of British citizen) applied on July 16th via NCS and nothing so far (after the acknowledgement).
Maybe the July applications (around that printer issue time) have been lost or something at HO Wink
A crazy thought... but i am thinking if we could withdraw her application and apply again (new fees etc.), so at least we can get in the September lot and get lucky (since that is how HO seems to be working these days – lottery style of picking applications)?
I know its a crazy thought, but could not resist thinking about it.. its really frustrating as to why it was not even allocated to a case worker Sad
Brits don't jump the queue... but no idea why they (HO) are jumping queue on the allocation process! Smile
Uhm, that does sound crazy yeah; do you think that they might have lost some applications? even after issuing a reference number? if so, won't they let applicants re-apply for free and under the rules before 28/Oct/2013?
Cheers
D
Posted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 3:02 pm
by quantumscience
Call it may be its just due to my frustration, but have a feeling they have lost the application.
There is no way a HO guy is going to pick a late August or early September application when they have got piles of July apps pending in the box.
Think about it, they won't be able to answer some authority if they question them as to why they jump queues (i.e. that too for allocation?
... that's pushing it!)
Something seriously has gone wrong with those bunch of applications around that time.
Anyway, I just spoke to the same NCS, and they said she could withdraw and in parallel apply again
(new fees etc, but she can do so apparently).
Its just that the HO may have the record already in there they say... but if she is withdrawing and reapplying then its fine it seems!
I have to get home from work and speak to my wife about this possibility, but i am sure she will fume at me (another 900 pounds... grrr
, she will say she is just happy with ILR, thank you.)
Posted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 3:25 pm
by Derivaz
quantumscience wrote:Call it may be its just due to my frustration, but have a feeling they have lost the application.
There is no way a HO guy is going to pick a late August or early September application when they have got piles of July apps pending in the box.
Think about it, they won't be able to answer some authority if they question them as to why they jump queues (i.e. that too for allocation?
... that's pushing it!)
Something seriously has gone wrong with those bunch of applications around that time.
Anyway, I just spoke to the same NCS, and they said she could withdraw and in parallel apply again
(new fees etc, but she can do so apparently).
Its just that the HO may have the record already in there they say... but if she is withdrawing and reapplying then its fine it seems!
I have to get home from work and speak to my wife about this possibility, but i am sure she will fume at me (another 900 pounds... grrr
, she will say she is just happy with ILR, thank you.)
Personally, I don't think that's a good idea 1) the don't follow a logical order, there are pending apps from all months; they just don't follow any logical order 2) You don't know it's lost and you don't know that the new one is not going to get lost; maybe this one is not lost and the new one gets lost; you don't know; I think if they have given you a reference number, they have to give you an answer sooner or later.
Have you got a reference number from them?
Posted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 5:29 pm
by rod_p
Withdrawing your wife's app would be just crazy!
I applied for my citizenship last November. At the time, the average ( based on the small sample of persons belonging to this forum that submitted info to this forum < 1% total apps ) was about 10 weeks. Few complained about waiting times the length your wife is experiencing.
Suddenly, something happened ( probably the closing of the enquiry line that resulted in a HUGE waste of UKBA's time ), and the average time sped up to 4-5 weeks ( despite UKBA's target of < 6 months ).
Before, after and during the time I applied, there were always a number of apps that took 12-16 weeks ( we'll never know why as they do not release info of that detail ). Some apps take 6, 8 or 9 months.
IMO, it is only common sense to leave your wife's existing app in the system. It will be processed in due time.
Posted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 6:41 pm
by Derivaz
rod_p wrote:Withdrawing your wife's app would be just crazy!
I applied for my citizenship last November. At the time, the average ( based on the small sample of persons belonging to this forum that submitted info to this forum < 1% total apps ) was about 10 weeks. Few complained about waiting times the length your wife is experiencing.
Suddenly, something happened ( probably the closing of the enquiry line that resulted in a HUGE waste of UKBA's time ), and the average time sped up to 4-5 weeks ( despite UKBA's target of < 6 months ).
Before, after and during the time I applied, there were always a number of apps that took 12-16 weeks ( we'll never know why as they do not release info of that detail ). Some apps take 6, 8 or 9 months.
IMO, it is only common sense to leave your wife's existing app in the system. It will be processed in due time.
I think you are right Rod, like I said; a lottery.
Also, if they issued a reference number, i guess that means that they didn't lose it, don't you think? furthermore; if I ask them every 2 weeks and they say they've checked and a decision hasnt been made, that means they've checked, it, so it hasn't been lost, don't you think?
How long did yours take?
Posted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 6:54 pm
by quantumscience
Guys, no worries
I know its a crazy idea, we will leave the app as is.
A lottery is a lottery,... is a lottery...
If HO themselves do not respect their own processes, then what can we do.
Just ranting, that is all.
Thanks anyway.
Posted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 8:53 pm
by Derivaz
quantumscience wrote:Guys, no worries
I know its a crazy idea, we will leave the app as is.
A lottery is a lottery,... is a lottery...
If HO themselves do not respect their own processes, then what can we do.
Just ranting, that is all.
Thanks anyway.
It seems to be a big mess, when an organisation is a big mess, strange things happen haha
I think the best thing to do is email them every 2 weeks, keep their replies and after 6 months ring them using the 2/2 option and if it's not sorted, contact your MP to intervene....
Posted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 9:13 pm
by akhurshid
I think they do follow some sort of order. They do however do some checks and checks can take longer specially if they have to write to referees. Both referees on my daughter's MN1 application has confirmed that they have been contacted by HO to confirm and it happens more often now.
And by the way, you must have some crazy money to waste if you were planning to reapply...
Posted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 11:04 am
by quantumscience
Well, you see i am not worried if the application processing takes 6 months or 4.8 billion years
... as long as it is being considered for processing i am happy.
BUT what i am not happy about is the jumping of queue EVEN to ALLOCATE the application to a case worker!
We have had two emails so far and each has said with confirmation that the application has not even been allocated to a case worker.
Now, they cannot be doing checks etc for even allocating the application for considering - would they?
Now, that is what i am frustrated about.
As for money aspect, no... mine is a hard earned money just like any others'.
I thought it was worthwhile to spend again if i can help the application at least ALLOCATED to a case worker (this time around, as a lottery process!). (Not the processing speed up!)
Anyway, its OK to wait. No worries. One day the application will certainly be ALLOCATED to a case worker
Ha ha!
Posted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 11:12 am
by Heisgood
quantumscience wrote:Guys, no worries
I know its a crazy idea, we will leave the app as is.
A lottery is a lottery,... is a lottery...
If HO themselves do not respect their own processes, then what can we do.
Just ranting, that is all.
Thanks anyway.
Hopefully its the last hurdle in what seems like never ending hurdles to get BC. IMO just be patient .....hopefully all works out well. Please keep the board updated.
Posted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 4:29 pm
by akhurshid
quantumscience wrote:Well, you see i am not worried if the application processing takes 6 months or 4.8 billion years
... as long as it is being considered for processing i am happy.
BUT what i am not happy about is the jumping of queue EVEN to ALLOCATE the application to a case worker!
We have had two emails so far and each has said with confirmation that the application has not even been allocated to a case worker.
Now, they cannot be doing checks etc for even allocating the application for considering - would they?
Now, that is what i am frustrated about.
As for money aspect, no... mine is a hard earned money just like any others'.
I thought it was worthwhile to spend again if i can help the application at least ALLOCATED to a case worker (this time around, as a lottery process!). (Not the processing speed up!)
Anyway, its OK to wait. No worries. One day the application will certainly be ALLOCATED to a case worker
Ha ha!
I wouldn't believe what call centre is telling you. If only I had a penny everytime call centre told somebody that case is not assigned yet and they got approval in a day or two.
Posted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 4:50 pm
by Derivaz
quantumscience wrote:Well, you see i am not worried if the application processing takes 6 months or 4.8 billion years
... as long as it is being considered for processing i am happy.
BUT what i am not happy about is the jumping of queue EVEN to ALLOCATE the application to a case worker!
We have had two emails so far and each has said with confirmation that the application has not even been allocated to a case worker.
Now, they cannot be doing checks etc for even allocating the application for considering - would they?
Now, that is what i am frustrated about.
As for money aspect, no... mine is a hard earned money just like any others'.
I thought it was worthwhile to spend again if i can help the application at least ALLOCATED to a case worker (this time around, as a lottery process!). (Not the processing speed up!)
Anyway, its OK to wait. No worries. One day the application will certainly be ALLOCATED to a case worker
Ha ha!
But if they tell you that your application hasn't been allocated to a caseworker it means that your application is in the system and not lost; if it had been lost, they would say that they can't find, don't you think?