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jaberdene wrote:Hi
Im going to apply ILR based on long residency 10 year rule this September. one of my extension application was supposed to finish on 14-03-2005 so I submitted student application on 11-03-2005 which was in time. And it was refused on 07-04-2005 due to applying short course for more than 2 years. Because if this reason the refusal letter said my right to appeal this decision was limited. The letter didnt mention anything about time limit to reapply or appeal but asked me to inform them of any reason why I think I shud be allowed to stay here. I didnt appeal, but on 12-04-2005 I submitted 2nd application with my reason to stay and changing course length up to 2 years , then finally got 2 years extension on 20-04-2005.

Is this refusal affect my future ILR application or not?
Ive read tons of thread and info but still struggling to find answer. In my case did 3C leave end on the day of the refusal decision or after 10 days from that date?

any advice on it will be very appreciated ,

many thanks
JE

15Jan wrote:As far as I understand Section 3C, in your case, it expired on 07/04/05.

The silver lining is for long residence, you are allowed a single GAP of not more than 10 days, so I think you should be OK.

The imp. bit here is to consult a good solicitor and write a good cover letter, quoting the relevant laws/guidance so that CW won't reject your application.

quantum1 wrote:

jaberdene wrote:Hi
Im going to apply ILR based on long residency 10 year rule this September. one of my extension application was supposed to finish on 14-03-2005 so I submitted student application on 11-03-2005 which was in time. And it was refused on 07-04-2005 due to applying short course for more than 2 years. Because if this reason the refusal letter said my right to appeal this decision was limited. The letter didnt mention anything about time limit to reapply or appeal but asked me to inform them of any reason why I think I shud be allowed to stay here. I didnt appeal, but on 12-04-2005 I submitted 2nd application with my reason to stay and changing course length up to 2 years , then finally got 2 years extension on 20-04-2005.

Is this refusal affect my future ILR application or not?
Ive read tons of thread and info but still struggling to find answer. In my case did 3C leave end on the day of the refusal decision or after 10 days from that date?

any advice on it will be very appreciated ,

many thanks
JE

I would advise a solicitor. Long Residency does allow for discretion on a short gap of unspecified duration. Discretion is shown on the gap, if it was the result of an out of time application of 10 days or less. I am not sure if out of time applications are counted from date of expiry of visa or from day section 3 leave ceases. A solicitor would make good arguments to support your case.

quantum1 wrote:

jaberdene wrote:Hi
Im going to apply ILR based on long residency 10 year rule this September. one of my extension application was supposed to finish on 14-03-2005 so I submitted student application on 11-03-2005 which was in time. And it was refused on 07-04-2005 due to applying short course for more than 2 years. Because if this reason the refusal letter said my right to appeal this decision was limited. The letter didnt mention anything about time limit to reapply or appeal but asked me to inform them of any reason why I think I shud be allowed to stay here. I didnt appeal, but on 12-04-2005 I submitted 2nd application with my reason to stay and changing course length up to 2 years , then finally got 2 years extension on 20-04-2005.

Is this refusal affect my future ILR application or not?
Ive read tons of thread and info but still struggling to find answer. In my case did 3C leave end on the day of the refusal decision or after 10 days from that date?

any advice on it will be very appreciated ,

many thanks
JE

I am not sure if out of time applications are counted from date of expiry of visa or from day section 3 leave ceases.

As far as I can understand, Section 3C leave starts from the date of expiry and ceases on the date of approval, so, if we take the same logic forward, in case of rejection, Section 3C would cease on the date of rejection(provided there is no appeal).

Other's are most welcome to add on this.

cs95tdg wrote:You may want to keep an eye on the following post which is around a similar topic. The OP there may post his/her findings after getting legal advice to determine the best course of action.

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... highlight=

http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... ht=#655892

jaberdene wrote:thanks all,

presumably there are many people has this kind of similar issues in this forum as well as in another forum. so we should find the correct answer here.
And I am trying to answer it myself. It might be correct or might be WRONG. please judge on it

as for my case I didnt appeal, so my 3C leave ended on the date of refusal decision which is 07/04/2005. I submitted 2nd application on 12/04/2005 and It means I overstayed 5 days since my 3C leave ended. The Immigration Rule says (see the link below) overstay starts from the 3C leave end date if I have one. So, those 5 days overstay is 5 days gap in my 10 years. Also obviously out of time application is made due to the overstaying.

Taking everything into account I could say
1. Have I got a short gap? -> YES from 07/04/2005 to 12/04/2005.
2. is the gap is created through making one single previous
application out of time? -> YES.
3. is the gap less than 10 days? -> YES (5 days)

therefore I think this one single gap can be used as discretion in long residence ILR application (see link below)

so please comment on this pleeeeese.

What I have been trying to say is that, the length of the gap is not really relevant according to the rules. The gap in your leave is thirteen days, ie you were an overstayer and did not have leave from the 7th to the 20th of April. But this is not important in the construction of the rules. The discretion is offered due to an out of time application made within 10 days.

Taking everything into account you could say
1. Have You got a short gap? -> YES from 07/04/2005 to 20/04/2005.
2. is the gap is created through making one single previous
application out of time? -> Maybe (Might have been two applications)
3. is the gap less than 10 days? -> No (12 days) But irrelevant
4. Is the out of time application within 10 days? -> Maybe

Out of time is not really defined, and this is the issue. Does it mean making an application beyond the latest of:

(i) the time limit attached to the last period of leave granted

(ii) beyond the period that his leave was extended under sections 3C or 3D of the Immigration Act 1971

Does it refer to (i) and (ii) or to (i) alone.

There are valid reasons for both arguments. Unfortunately I have not yet come against case law where the term has been well defined. I strongly recommend you speak with a solicitor.

Does it refer to (i) and (ii) or to (i) alone.