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Is ILR is a type of visa?
Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 8:53 pm
by indran
Hi,
I would appreciate if someone could clarify if ILR is also known as a type of visa. My employer promised to pay for my visa/work permit but now they dont want to pay for my ILR by saying that ILR is not a visa or work permit. Please help. Thank you.
Regards,
Indran
Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 10:17 pm
by CR001
your employer is correct and it is not their responsibility to pay for your ilr, which is indefinite leave to remain, eg settled person free from immigration control and does not expire. ilr is your responsibility and is not an employer sponsored process like a work permit.
your employer will know that once you have ilr you can leave them as your are free to do so.
Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 10:45 pm
by indran
CR001,
Thank you for your response.
My employer do pay for Tier 1 general visas with a condition that you have to work for 2 years afterwards or else you have to pay back when you leave. I wonder why they are willing to pay for Tier 1 visas (which allows you to work for employer) but not for ILR.
Regards,
Indran
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 1:40 am
by vinny
You were lucky. A Tier 1/ILR holder may work for any other employer. ILR is more expensive? Your 2 year employment condition with your employer is probably up?
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:11 am
by indran
Vinny,
This is my new employment with this employer. They promised to pay during interview but now denying saying that ilr is not a visa. So they are not allowed to pay. I have written confirmation from them that they will pay for visa but not specifically for ilr. During interview, I did mention about my ilr. I just joined this company 1 year ago.
So, if I can prove that ilr is a visa, they would pay I think.
Regards,
Indran
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:14 am
by indran
Also, the payment is capped at max. £800. I paid £1300 for in person application
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:18 am
by Lucapooka
This is a private matter between you and your employer. In the past they have agreed to pay for your immigration applications and you don't have to return this cost if you remain in their employment for a fixed period. You can, of course, leave at any time and they will expect you to pay that sum. There is no statute for this practise so you can't insist.
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:58 am
by vinny
indran wrote:So, if I can prove that ilr is a visa, they would pay I think.
Technically, a 'visa' is a
type of
entry clearance. It's issued only from
outside the UK.
An
ILR application is an indefinite
leave to remain application. It's only issued from within the UK.
ILR is not a visa.
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:25 am
by indran
Hi,
Thank you very much for your responses. Nowadays, we cannot rely on people's words, everything has to be written clearly on paper. Unfortunately it was not written clearly in my employment letter. So, I need to find a way to convince them that ILR is a visa. It is not defined clearly in the websites. Some websites say that permanent residence is a type of visa, so ILR should be a visa. Also, they are only two categories of permission to stay in a country as far as i am aware; visa or citizenship. So, ILR must be in the visa category. Please correct me if i am wrong.
Regards,
Indran
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:28 am
by Greenie
You are wrong and you have already been given the answer. A visa is only issued from outside the UK. Indefinite leave to remain is an application made from within the UK live here permanently. It is not a visa application.
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:28 am
by indran
I just spoke to HM and they are saying that ILR is a type of visa since it has some restrictions to it such as, cant leave the country more than 2 years, not allowed to work for some public sectors etc. The new biometric card also has 10 year limit on the validity period.
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:33 am
by vinny
indran wrote:I just spoke to HM and they are saying that ILR is a type of visa since it has some restrictions to it such as, cant leave the country more than 2 years, not allowed to work for some public sectors etc. The new biometric card also has 10 year limit on the validity period.
Who is HM?
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:48 am
by CR001
Indran, you are grasping at straws and trying to avoid paying for your own ILR, which is an application that you would choose to do, not your employer and you need to meet the requirements, not your employer.
I have yet to come across any employer paying for an employee's Settlement application (ILR). Three stages are :
Temporary Visas - work permits, Tier Categories, Spouse, student, etc
Settlement Apps - ILR or PR under EU Regulations
BC Citizenship
The only difference between ILR and BC is the nationality and passport as ILR holders have the same rights as BC, including jobs and benefits.
Biometric cards have an expiry in the same sense as your drivers licence, bank card, etc. ILR never expires, only the card does and needs to be updated every 10 years.
Will you expect your employer to pay for your BC application too??
And as Vinny has asked - Who is HM??
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 10:23 am
by z18runway
I think he mean Home Office, not sure though
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 10:25 am
by wpilr_nov12
Looking at the bigger picture, it would be advisable and reasonable for the OP to not expect employer to bear the costs of ILR application. Unless the employer insists on paying for this, of course.
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 11:12 am
by mulderpf
It seems like you are trying to "catch your employer out" on the technicality of words. However, in what you are saying, one also has to look at the intention of the employer - especially since you mention "visa / work permit".
This to me says that your employer was happy to pay for a visa in the "work permit" category (e.g. Tier 1 or Tier 2), and not just any visa. If they meant ANY visa, then you could go to them and demand that they pay for you for a visit visa, or a student visa. (That is IF you managed to convince yourself and your employer that ILR is in fact a visa).
Most employers take employees up to the point of ILR - after that, it's their own problem to sort things out.
The technicality of your argument as to whether ILR is a visa or not, simply does not hold water.
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 2:30 pm
by Heisgood
mulderpf wrote:It seems like you are trying to "catch your employer out" on the technicality of words. However, in what you are saying, one also has to look at the intention of the employer - especially since you mention "visa / work permit".
This to me says that your employer was happy to pay for a visa in the "work permit" category (e.g. Tier 1 or Tier 2), and not just any visa. If they meant ANY visa, then you could go to them and demand that they pay for you for a visit visa, or a student visa. (That is IF you managed to convince yourself and your employer that ILR is in fact a visa).
Most employers take employees up to the point of ILR - after that, it's their own problem to sort things out.
The technicality of your argument as to whether ILR is a visa or not, simply does not hold water.
This is an interesting topic - I see on a previous post here that the moderator indicated some employers do pay for ILR.
https://immigrationboards.com/viewtopic ... f5a3a3ffe1
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 2:50 pm
by CR001
considering the link you have posted is more than 2years old and the current economic climate, i dont think many employers would cover these costs now for employees. also, there would obviously be stringent pay back terms if this was common practice.
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 3:01 pm
by kiranchinnu
indran wrote:I just spoke to HM and they are saying that ILR is a type of visa since it has some restrictions to it such as, cant leave the country more than 2 years, not allowed to work for some public sectors etc. The new biometric card also has 10 year limit on the validity period.
so as you spoke to HM and confirmed that ILR is a Visa , did you ask any guidance notes ? If so pls paste the link here to inform us. Employer paying for ILR is rare as they know that you can leave them anytime unless there is some time frame. And limit of money they can give for issue of visa is solely depends on employer not you . And you cannot argue to pay 1300 pounds as you have opted for PEO.
not allowed to work for some public sectors etc
That's a new one for me -is that true?
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 7:49 pm
by ban.s
kiranchinnu wrote:
not allowed to work for some public sectors etc
That's a new one for me -is that true?
an example - Secret Intelligence Services MI6 jobs
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:47 pm
by PaperPusher
kiranchinnu wrote:indran wrote:I just spoke to HM and they are saying that ILR is a type of visa since it has some restrictions to it such as, cant leave the country more than 2 years, not allowed to work for some public sectors etc. The new biometric card also has 10 year limit on the validity period.
so as you spoke to HM and confirmed that ILR is a Visa , did you ask any guidance notes ? If so pls paste the link here to inform us. Employer paying for ILR is rare as they know that you can leave them anytime unless there is some time frame. And limit of money they can give for issue of visa is solely depends on employer not you . And you cannot argue to pay 1300 pounds as you have opted for PEO.
not allowed to work for some public sectors etc
That's a new one for me -is that true?
True
http://www.civilservice.gov.uk/wp-conte ... -rules.pdf
Reserved Posts
3.4 All posts within the security and intelligence services (that is, the Security Service, the Secret Intelligence Service, and the Government Communications Headquarters) are automatically reserved to UK nationals.
3.5 Certain other categories of posts are capable of being reserved if the Minister responsible for the department or agency considers that to be necessary (that is, that special allegiance to the Crown is required in respect of that post such that the post must be held by a UK national).
3.6 These categories of posts are:
- posts within the Defence Intelligence Staff within the Ministry of Defence; and
- posts whose functions are concerned with:
(i) access to intelligence information received directly or indirectly from the security and intelligence services;
(ii) access to other information which, if disclosed without authority or otherwise misused, might damage the interests of national security;
(iii) access to other information which, if disclosed without authority or otherwise misused, might be prejudicial to the interests of the United Kingdom or the safety of its citizens;
(iv) border control or decisions about immigration.
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:58 pm
by indran
All,
Thank you very much guys for your opinion and quick responses. That was very helpful.
Correction HM should have been HO = Home office.
PaperPusher,
Thank you for your clarification on the jobs restrictions for ILR holders.
Regards,
Indran
Posted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:15 pm
by PaperPusher
ILR isn't a visa
http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas ... eral-info/
There are 4 types of entry clearance that can give someone permission to travel to or enter the UK:
A visa is for people we call 'visa nationals'. They are nationals of the countries or territories listed in Appendix 1 of the Immigration Rules - see 'More information' below.