Immigrationboards.com

Hi Guys

I'm posting this on behalf of a friend, as I'm trying to get some advice for her. We've had similar immigration timelines and whilst I've gotten ILR now, she's going through court battles to get hers.

She came to the UK in 2007 with her husband (entry clearance got in Nigeria), they were both married before He applied for the HSMP.

They renewed into tier 1 in 2009, so by June 2012, they applied for ILR together, fees paid by the man (main applicant). They did biometrics together again in August I think..

In this period, they've had two kids (5yrs and 1yr). But about 2 years ago, the man started been abusive (she suspects mental health issues) towards her, but she's done her best to put up without reporting to authorities etc.

Anyway, towards the end of 2012 (whilst still waiting for the ILR) the wife had to report to the police (in Sept 2012), and other times and by (dec 2012) she filed a non-molestation order.

Unknowing to her, the man emailed Home Office (in Dec) and lied that the woman has been separated from him since 2011 which was a lie, as he still lives in the same house with her. The Home Office sent a refusal letter for her on 6th Feb to the man's office which was the correspondence address. She was given 10 days to appeal, but the man held onto the letter till 1st march before giving to her!

Apparently, the email was sent to HO on 17/12. He got served a court notice of the non-molestation order on the 13/12, and by 14th he went to GP to make false reports about her, and then by 17th he sent this letter to the HO. And then by 27/12, he hurriedly filed for a divorce.

I'm really surprised that the UKBA didnt charge him for deceiving them at the time of applying seeing that he applied for both of them in June 2012.

Another issue was that they didnt apply for the kids, so the HO didnt even realise they had kids, and felt that if the woman is no longer with the man since 2011, and has no other family, they'll have her removed.

She hurriedly sent in her appeal form on that same 1st MArch, but they said the judge will have to decide if her reasons for the late appeal are cogent enough...she reported to the police that morning and they spoke to the man who admitted to hiding the letter.

He's got his ILR, and had even applied for the kids' registration without informing her, and whilst hiding her letter!

It seems a straightforward case to me, but she's understandably worried...she works as an office manager, earning 25k, and has no criminal record whatsoever. She also has pictures of birthdays, outings, and family events where they all participated, and the man is still in the same house despite having filed for a divorce!

Could the seniors in the house please examine this case? I'll be on hand to provide any info required as I've followed it up from day one....we've made all our applications at the same time from the very first time, its just that this issue has caused a strain between our families as you cant help but take sides...

And I'll add that, according to my understanding of the HO requirement,

1. They needed to have a subsisting relationship as at time of application

2. They needed to have the INTENTION to continue their relationship as at the time of application.


They're still susbsisting (i.e living together, looking after kids together, and sharing financial responsibilities). Its only the intention that has changed when he applied for the divorce on 27/12/12.

Seeing that they applied in June, I think what happened after then should have no effect...as if they had done PEO, they'd have gotten ILR together on the same day...

Or am I wrong in my thinking?

I'll also add that apart from the kids, they have a joint mortgage (the deposit was all hers infact) and he had presented all this as proof of cohabitation at the time of applying.

Is there any chance at all that she'll be removed from this country when we have criminals who cant even be removed???

Its the circumstances at the time of the decision that matter and not at time of the application, so if by the time the decision was made the marriage broken down she wouldn't qualify for ilr on the basis of their relationship. However clearly the fact that she has two British children means that she should not be removed and should e granted some form of leave. Who are the children living with? She needs to obtain a copy of the police report and evidence of the non molestation order etc.

When was his ilr granted?

Greenie wrote:When was his ilr granted?

I dont know, but I'll assume around the same date of her refusal which was 6th feb 2013.

Greenie wrote:Its the circumstances at the time of the decision that matter and not at time of the application, so if by the time the decision was made the marriage broken down she wouldn't qualify for ilr on the basis of their relationship. However clearly the fact that she has two British children means that she should not be removed and should e granted some form of leave. Who are the children living with? She needs to obtain a copy of the police report and evidence of the non molestation order etc.

Ohh I see...I thought it was at the time of the application.

Because her requirement was to have stayed with him as his dependant 2 years up to the time of application? And she had stayed all of 5 years? The kids live with both of them in the family home, but she's their main carer.

Hmmm...it may not be a straightforward as I thought then

This passage from your post is confusing:
They're still susbsisting (i.e living together, looking after kids together, and sharing financial responsibilities). Its only the intention that has changed when he applied for the divorce on 27/12/12.

If they are still co-habiting, how is the non-molestation order valid?

These were the grounds under which refusal was decided:


(e) The marriage or civil partnership, or relationship similar to marriage or civil partnership, must be subsisting at the time the application is made.

(f) The applicant and the Relevant Points Based System Migrant must intend to live permanently with the other as their spouse or civil partner, unmarried or same-sex partner.


http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/polic ... 1migrants/

Casa wrote:This passage from your post is confusing:
They're still susbsisting (i.e living together, looking after kids together, and sharing financial responsibilities). Its only the intention that has changed when he applied for the divorce on 27/12/12.

If they are still co-habiting, how is the non-molestation order valid?

Sorry I didnt clarify that point.

She went to court, but the case was dismissed. Most of the abuse is emotional, and unfortunately, its not taken as seriously as if he had given her a black eye. So they were dismissed and asked to divorce if they could no longer live together.

He was served a notice to come to court, and all these were the things he did before the court date, even filing for the divorce. The court date was Jan 3rd I think.

See also:

If your marriage, civil partnership or other relationship permanently breaks down while your partner still has only limited permission to stay in the UK (that is, during the 2 or 5 year probationary period before they can apply to live here permanently), you should tell us by writing to:

NCC3
UK Border Agency
9th floor
Lunar House
40 Wellesley Road
Croydon
CR9 2BY

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas ... ship-ends/

Which from the information you've given, it appears he has done. Hence the refusal of ILR.

Casa wrote:Which from the information you've given, it appears he has done. Hence the refusal of ILR.

Yes he did, but he gave a wrong date of Nov 2011 which was untrue....I feel that if he actually gave the date as DEC 2012, it would have had no bearing on the application seeing that they applied together in June 2012.

Between Nov 2011 - April 2012, he was working away from home, but would return home every weekend without fail. However, he's given the date Nov 2011 as the date since which they'd been separated, but they've never been separated!

Even if they separated Nov 11 - April 12, he lived full time in the house since May 2012 (before applying in June) till date.

sanjacs wrote:Hi Guys

I'm posting this on behalf of a friend, as I'm trying to get some advice for her. We've had similar immigration timelines and whilst I've gotten ILR now, she's going through court battles to get hers.

She came to the UK in 2007 with her husband (entry clearance got in Nigeria), they were both married before He applied for the HSMP.

They renewed into tier 1 in 2009, so by June 2012, they applied for ILR together, fees paid by the man (main applicant). They did biometrics together again in August I think..

In this period, they've had two kids (5yrs and 1yr). But about 2 years ago, the man started been abusive (she suspects mental health issues) towards her, but she's done her best to put up without reporting to authorities etc.

Anyway, towards the end of 2012 (whilst still waiting for the ILR) the wife had to report to the police (in Sept 2012), and other times and by (dec 2012) she filed a non-molestation order.

Unknowing to her, the man emailed Home Office (in Dec) and lied that the woman has been separated from him since 2011 which was a lie, as he still lives in the same house with her. The Home Office sent a refusal letter for her on 6th Feb to the man's office which was the correspondence address. She was given 10 days to appeal, but the man held onto the letter till 1st march before giving to her!

Apparently, the email was sent to HO on 17/12. He got served a court notice of the non-molestation order on the 13/12, and by 14th he went to GP to make false reports about her, and then by 17th he sent this letter to the HO. And then by 27/12, he hurriedly filed for a divorce.

I'm really surprised that the UKBA didnt charge him for deceiving them at the time of applying seeing that he applied for both of them in June 2012.

Another issue was that they didnt apply for the kids, so the HO didnt even realise they had kids, and felt that if the woman is no longer with the man since 2011, and has no other family, they'll have her removed.

She hurriedly sent in her appeal form on that same 1st MArch, but they said the judge will have to decide if her reasons for the late appeal are cogent enough...she reported to the police that morning and they spoke to the man who admitted to hiding the letter.

He's got his ILR, and had even applied for the kids' registration without informing her, and whilst hiding her letter!

It seems a straightforward case to me, but she's understandably worried...she works as an office manager, earning 25k, and has no criminal record whatsoever. She also has pictures of birthdays, outings, and family events where they all participated, and the man is still in the same house despite having filed for a divorce!

Could the seniors in the house please examine this case? I'll be on hand to provide any info required as I've followed it up from day one....we've made all our applications at the same time from the very first time, its just that this issue has caused a strain between our families as you cant help but take sides...

Victims of domestic violence should be afforded extra protection and thus can apply for settlement as per http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas ... rmset(dv)/

You need to gather evidence, having the police involved is good and social worker or women's aid would also be beneficial. Some of the charities will also fund the set(DV) application google it.

Those applying under the Destitution Domestic Violence (DDV) concession also allows the ilr applicant to claim public funds before being granted ilr. The chances should be good but get in touch with the support charities ASAP

Although you did not come as a partner of a bc or settled person, he is now settled and you should have compassionate and exceptional circumstances but the DV charities should be able to help.

sanjacs wrote:Hi Guys

I'm posting this on behalf of a friend, as I'm trying to get some advice for her. We've had similar immigration timelines and whilst I've gotten ILR now, she's going through court battles to get hers.

She came to the UK in 2007 with her husband (entry clearance got in Nigeria), they were both married before He applied for the HSMP.

They renewed into tier 1 in 2009, so by June 2012, they applied for ILR together, fees paid by the man (main applicant). They did biometrics together again in August I think..

In this period, they've had two kids (5yrs and 1yr). But about 2 years ago, the man started been abusive (she suspects mental health issues) towards her, but she's done her best to put up without reporting to authorities etc.

Anyway, towards the end of 2012 (whilst still waiting for the ILR) the wife had to report to the police (in Sept 2012), and other times and by (dec 2012) she filed a non-molestation order.

Unknowing to her, the man emailed Home Office (in Dec) and lied that the woman has been separated from him since 2011 which was a lie, as he still lives in the same house with her. The Home Office sent a refusal letter for her on 6th Feb to the man's office which was the correspondence address. She was given 10 days to appeal, but the man held onto the letter till 1st march before giving to her!

Apparently, the email was sent to HO on 17/12. He got served a court notice of the non-molestation order on the 13/12, and by 14th he went to GP to make false reports about her, and then by 17th he sent this letter to the HO. And then by 27/12, he hurriedly filed for a divorce.

I'm really surprised that the UKBA didnt charge him for deceiving them at the time of applying seeing that he applied for both of them in June 2012.

Another issue was that they didnt apply for the kids, so the HO didnt even realise they had kids, and felt that if the woman is no longer with the man since 2011, and has no other family, they'll have her removed.

She hurriedly sent in her appeal form on that same 1st MArch, but they said the judge will have to decide if her reasons for the late appeal are cogent enough...she reported to the police that morning and they spoke to the man who admitted to hiding the letter.

He's got his ILR, and had even applied for the kids' registration without informing her, and whilst hiding her letter!

It seems a straightforward case to me, but she's understandably worried...she works as an office manager, earning 25k, and has no criminal record whatsoever. She also has pictures of birthdays, outings, and family events where they all participated, and the man is still in the same house despite having filed for a divorce!

Could the seniors in the house please examine this case? I'll be on hand to provide any info required as I've followed it up from day one....we've made all our applications at the same time from the very first time, its just that this issue has caused a strain between our families as you cant help but take sides...

you said the sponsor was abusive. this changes EVERYTHING.

use SET(DV) http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas ... t%28dv%29/

also contact southall black sisters.

read this too http://www.londonelegance.com/transpond ... c-violence

about the registration of birth, i thought only mother could register and if father is present, the mother has to be present as well.

sanjacs wrote:Hi Guys

I'm posting this on behalf of a friend, as I'm trying to get some advice for her. We've had similar immigration timelines and whilst I've gotten ILR now, she's going through court battles to get hers.

She came to the UK in 2007 with her husband (entry clearance got in Nigeria), they were both married before He applied for the HSMP.

They renewed into tier 1 in 2009, so by June 2012, they applied for ILR together, fees paid by the man (main applicant). They did biometrics together again in August I think..

In this period, they've had two kids (5yrs and 1yr). But about 2 years ago, the man started been abusive (she suspects mental health issues) towards her, but she's done her best to put up without reporting to authorities etc.

Anyway, towards the end of 2012 (whilst still waiting for the ILR) the wife had to report to the police (in Sept 2012), and other times and by (dec 2012) she filed a non-molestation order.

Unknowing to her, the man emailed Home Office (in Dec) and lied that the woman has been separated from him since 2011 which was a lie, as he still lives in the same house with her. The Home Office sent a refusal letter for her on 6th Feb to the man's office which was the correspondence address. She was given 10 days to appeal, but the man held onto the letter till 1st march before giving to her!

Apparently, the email was sent to HO on 17/12. He got served a court notice of the non-molestation order on the 13/12, and by 14th he went to GP to make false reports about her, and then by 17th he sent this letter to the HO. And then by 27/12, he hurriedly filed for a divorce.

I'm really surprised that the UKBA didnt charge him for deceiving them at the time of applying seeing that he applied for both of them in June 2012.

Another issue was that they didnt apply for the kids, so the HO didnt even realise they had kids, and felt that if the woman is no longer with the man since 2011, and has no other family, they'll have her removed.

She hurriedly sent in her appeal form on that same 1st MArch, but they said the judge will have to decide if her reasons for the late appeal are cogent enough...she reported to the police that morning and they spoke to the man who admitted to hiding the letter.

He's got his ILR, and had even applied for the kids' registration without informing her, and whilst hiding her letter!

It seems a straightforward case to me, but she's understandably worried...she works as an office manager, earning 25k, and has no criminal record whatsoever. She also has pictures of birthdays, outings, and family events where they all participated, and the man is still in the same house despite having filed for a divorce!

Could the seniors in the house please examine this case? I'll be on hand to provide any info required as I've followed it up from day one....we've made all our applications at the same time from the very first time, its just that this issue has caused a strain between our families as you cant help but take sides...

also perhaps if she was here only for him its time she went back. IF not and she wants to stll stay here, i do sympathise with what youve said BUT you got to look at both sides, cause i dont know what would have led the man to act in this manner. i mean surely if he was mentally upset as you said she wouldve known about it earlier. i dont know, but im just saying why would the man go through all of this have children with her just to kick her out for no reason.

sanjacs wrote:

Casa wrote:Which from the information you've given, it appears he has done. Hence the refusal of ILR.

Yes he did, but he gave a wrong date of Nov 2011 which was untrue....I feel that if he actually gave the date as DEC 2012, it would have had no bearing on the application seeing that they applied together in June 2012.

Between Nov 2011 - April 2012, he was working away from home, but would return home every weekend without fail. However, he's given the date Nov 2011 as the date since which they'd been separated, but they've never been separated!

Even if they separated Nov 11 - April 12, he lived full time in the house since May 2012 (before applying in June) till date.

your relationship was existing and genuine (not a 'marriage of convenience', for example) when you were last given permission to enter or remain or you were last given leave in order to access public funds while you applied for indefinite leave on the basis of domestic violence; and
you were the victim of domestic violence, and this is what caused the relationship to break down before the end of your permission to enter or remain.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas ... e/#header1

go for SET(DV) it doesnt matter if they were living together then.

sanjacs wrote:

Casa wrote:This passage from your post is confusing:
They're still susbsisting (i.e living together, looking after kids together, and sharing financial responsibilities). Its only the intention that has changed when he applied for the divorce on 27/12/12.

If they are still co-habiting, how is the non-molestation order valid?

Sorry I didnt clarify that point.

She went to court, but the case was dismissed. Most of the abuse is emotional, and unfortunately, its not taken as seriously as if he had given her a black eye. So they were dismissed and asked to divorce if they could no longer live together.

He was served a notice to come to court, and all these were the things he did before the court date, even filing for the divorce. The court date was Jan 3rd I think.

abuse is abuse, emotional or physical. thats it.

Greenie wrote:Its the circumstances at the time of the decision that matter and not at time of the application, so if by the time the decision was made the marriage broken down she wouldn't qualify for ilr on the basis of their relationship. However clearly the fact that she has two British children means that she should not be removed and should e granted some form of leave. Who are the children living with? She needs to obtain a copy of the police report and evidence of the non molestation order etc.

having children does NOT mean you cannot be removed.

let me say it like this. she came here to uk for him. he didnt want to be with her, their relationship broke down, and rightfully she should have then no reason to stay here in uk any more.

she can technically go and take care of her kids in her own country.

she has to take custody first.

HOWEVER if she was abused, thats a different thing. Then she deserves to stay.

if she has made a life for herself and wants her kids to see their father too then she should apply for SET(DV) and say she was abused.

Greenie wrote:Its the circumstances at the time of the decision that matter and not at time of the application, so if by the time the decision was made the marriage broken down she wouldn't qualify for ilr on the basis of their relationship. However clearly the fact that she has two British children means that she should not be removed and should e granted some form of leave. Who are the children living with? She needs to obtain a copy of the police report and evidence of the non molestation order etc.

article 8 right to family life is invoked here.
however she shoudl apply with SET(DV)

read 248B

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/polic ... les/part7/

sh1981 wrote:

Greenie wrote:Its the circumstances at the time of the decision that matter and not at time of the application, so if by the time the decision was made the marriage broken down she wouldn't qualify for ilr on the basis of their relationship. However clearly the fact that she has two British children means that she should not be removed and should e granted some form of leave. Who are the children living with? She needs to obtain a copy of the police report and evidence of the non molestation order etc.

article 8 right to family life is invoked here.
however she shoudl apply with SET(DV)

I think set(DV) is intended for those who came to the UK as a spouse, cp or partner of a British citizen or settled person. However, there may be exceptional and compassionate reasons to grant discretionary leave and potential ilr.

sh1981 wrote:

Greenie wrote:Its the circumstances at the time of the decision that matter and not at time of the application, so if by the time the decision was made the marriage broken down she wouldn't qualify for ilr on the basis of their relationship. However clearly the fact that she has two British children means that she should not be removed and should e granted some form of leave. Who are the children living with? She needs to obtain a copy of the police report and evidence of the non molestation order etc.

having children does NOT mean you cannot be removed.

let me say it like this. she came here to uk for him. he didnt want to be with her, their relationship broke down, and rightfully she should have then no reason to stay here in uk any more.

she can technically go and take care of her kids in her own country.

she has to take custody first.

HOWEVER if she was abused, thats a different thing. Then she deserves to stay.

if she has made a life for herself and wants her kids to see their father too then she should apply for SET(DV) and say she was abused.

Thanks for your replies guys...

She was married to him in their home country ever before he applied to come to the UK, so I think its wrong to say that she came to the country for him.

I dont think that because she was on a dependant visa, she should have less rights than him (though it appears to be so at the moment). They had the kids here and she is an active carer for her kids as well as been a full time employed professional.

Why should the man have rights to settle here, and she denied the rights???? I'm not asking any of you, but I think the UKBA needs to have a good look at this. Spouses are not luggages that can be brought and removed at will, they're humans and they do not have to endure abuse because they need to be on their spouses visa!

My question now is, can she go and apply under Set DV now, seeing that her stay had expired since June 2012? Does she not have to be on a current visa to do that?

you said the sponsor was abusive. this changes EVERYTHING.

use SET(DV) http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas ... t%28dv%29/

also contact southall black sisters.

read this too http://www.londonelegance.com/transpond ... c-violence

about the registration of birth, i thought only mother could register and if father is present, the mother has to be present as well.[/quote]

Sorry, not registration of birth, but registration of the kids as British citizens..

sanjacs wrote:

sh1981 wrote:

Greenie wrote:Its the circumstances at the time of the decision that matter and not at time of the application, so if by the time the decision was made the marriage broken down she wouldn't qualify for ilr on the basis of their relationship. However clearly the fact that she has two British children means that she should not be removed and should e granted some form of leave. Who are the children living with? She needs to obtain a copy of the police report and evidence of the non molestation order etc.

having children does NOT mean you cannot be removed.

let me say it like this. she came here to uk for him. he didnt want to be with her, their relationship broke down, and rightfully she should have then no reason to stay here in uk any more.

she can technically go and take care of her kids in her own country.

she has to take custody first.

HOWEVER if she was abused, thats a different thing. Then she deserves to stay.

if she has made a life for herself and wants her kids to see their father too then she should apply for SET(DV) and say she was abused.

Thanks for your replies guys...

She was married to him in their home country ever before he applied to come to the UK, so I think its wrong to say that she came to the country for him.

I dont think that because she was on a dependant visa, she should have less rights than him (though it appears to be so at the moment). They had the kids here and she is an active carer for her kids as well as been a full time employed professional.

Why should the man have rights to settle here, and she denied the rights???? I'm not asking any of you, but I think the UKBA needs to have a good look at this. Spouses are not luggages that can be brought and removed at will, they're humans and they do not have to endure abuse because they need to be on their spouses visa!

My question now is, can she go and apply under Set DV now, seeing that her stay had expired since June 2012? Does she not have to be on a current visa to do that?

so she doesnt have a visa currently? here illegally at the moment?

sanjacs wrote:you said the sponsor was abusive. this changes EVERYTHING.

use SET(DV) http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas ... t%28dv%29/

also contact southall black sisters.

read this too http://www.londonelegance.com/transpond ... c-violence

about the registration of birth, i thought only mother could register and if father is present, the mother has to be present as well.

Sorry, not registration of birth, but registration of the kids as British citizens..[/quote]

if the father was on ilr and mother was on limited leave, only the father can rgister them as british citizens. so nothing wrong there.