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Hello everyone,

In light of the recent poll for the UK to leave the EU, many of EU citizens and non-EEA family members might be wondering what would happen to EEA Family Permits and rights to live in the UK while exit negotiations take place.

My husband (EU citizen) and myself (non-EU) have been planning to apply for EEA Family permit to allow us to move from The Netherlands to the UK.

QUESTION: Can we still apply for the EEA family permit, and once in the UK apply for a residence permit while UK exit arrangements are being negotiated? To my understanding the EU-UK treaty on Freedom of Movement will still be valid and have to be honored up until the point that the treaty is ended. (After the UK actually leaves the EU).

Thank you in advance for your feedback!

Pilo wrote:Hello everyone,

In light of the recent poll for the UK to leave the EU, many of EU citizens and non-EEA family members might be wondering what would happen to EEA Family Permits and rights to live in the UK while exit negotiations take place.

My husband (EU citizen) and myself (non-EU) have been planning to apply for EEA Family permit to allow us to move from The Netherlands to the UK.

QUESTION: Can we still apply for the EEA family permit, and once in the UK apply for a residence permit while UK exit arrangements are being negotiated? To my understanding the EU-UK treaty on Freedom of Movement will still be valid and have to be honored up until the point that the treaty is ended. (After the UK actually leaves the EU).

Thank you in advance for your feedback!

As of today EU law as transposed into UK law still stands.

So, yes, go for it.
After all, you've got to be in it to win it.

Ofcourse noone starting their EU journey via UK now will have time to acquire PR (except perhaps retirement or invalidity and similar special cases).

Noone knows what they may be but, presumably, there will be transitional arrangements put in place for those still on an EU migration trajectory when the exit actually occurs.
Think of it as the British sense of fair play, if you will.

Thank you very much for your answer!!

Pilo wrote:Thank you very much for your answer!!

It's starting

'We may have to deal with that. There are a variety of possibilities. We may have to say that the right to indefinite leave to remain protection only applies before a certain date. But you have to make those judgments on reality, not speculation.'

However, he is quick to dispel the notion that EU migrants already here will not be treated fairly.
'We will get a generous settlement for EU migrants here now and a generous settlement for British citizens in the EU.'

[David Davis]

noajthan wrote:

Pilo wrote:Thank you very much for your answer!!

It's starting

'We may have to deal with that. There are a variety of possibilities. We may have to say that the right to indefinite leave to remain protection only applies before a certain date. But you have to make those judgments on reality, not speculation.'

However, he is quick to dispel the notion that EU migrants already here will not be treated fairly.
'We will get a generous settlement for EU migrants here now and a generous settlement for British citizens in the EU.'

[David Davis]

It started before that. From the new Prime Minister -

Theresa May refuses to rule out deportation of EU nationals
http://www.financialexpress.com/world-n ... ls/306279/

The UK are well aware that there will be a "huge influx" of EEA citizens trying to get into the UK before the doors are shut.

Petaltop wrote:It started before that. From the new Prime Minister -

Theresa May refuses to rule out deportation of EU nationals
http://www.financialexpress.com/world-n ... ls/306279/

The UK are well aware that there will be a "huge influx" from EEA citizens trying to get into the UK before the doors are shut.

You missed the point, I mean the discussion on the concept of transitional arrangements (overlooked in all the hullabaloo and lack of joined-up thinking during campaigning) is evidently starting. Anything else would not be cricket.

noajthan wrote:

Petaltop wrote:It started before that. From the new Prime Minister -

Theresa May refuses to rule out deportation of EU nationals
http://www.financialexpress.com/world-n ... ls/306279/

The UK are well aware that there will be a "huge influx" from EEA citizens trying to get into the UK before the doors are shut.

You missed the point, I mean the discussion on the concept of transitional arrangements (overlooked in all the hullabaloo and lack of joined-up thinking during campaigning) is evidently starting. Anything else would not be cricket.

What people seem to be missing is that "British fair play" and things "not being cricket" has to be fair to both sides. This means it has to be fair to the British in the UK as well as the British living in EEA countries as well. It won't be just one sided, even though in the past us EEA citizens have had it one sided (in our favour) in the UK. "Fair play" will take into account both sides.

Right from the start they said they would not rule out EU citizen deportations and that they were very aware there would be a rush to the UK before the EU door shut.

Petaltop wrote:What people seem to be missing is that "British fair play" and things "not being cricket" has to be fair to both sides: this means it has to be fair to the British as well.

Right from the start they said they would not rule out deportations and that they were aware there would be a rush to the UK before the EU door shut.

It certainly takes two to tango.
But the EU is not a democracy or meritocracy (nor 'communist') and it hasn't achieved anything like democratic confederalism yet.

Not sure how its all going to play out. Pity this wasn't thought through upfront before the referendum (and bridges were burned); what we seem to have now is a bad divorce with no concrete plans for the kids (never mind the dog or the Star Wars memorabilia).

If I was a betting person than I would bet that those who were thrown of the UK and then returned using EU rules, won't be the ones staying.

For the others, services in the UK are already at breaking point due to hundreds of thousands arriving every year and a mass influx before the EU door shuts, won't help that problem. TBF, they have already made it clear that they won't rule out EU deportations.

Those who have made the UK their life over the past few years as a qualified person and who are of good character, will be able to get BC before Brexit. It's only those recently arrived or those who plan to arrive before Brexit, who will not know if they can stay, and there are 27 other countries in the EEA.

noajthan wrote:Pity this wasn't thought through upfront before the referendum (and bridges were burned); what we seem to have now is a bad divorce with no concrete plans for the kids (never mind the dog or the Star Wars memorabilia).

A great many people think that the UK won't actually leave the UK; to Juncker and Farage's disappointment, the bridges haven't been burned yet.

Richard W wrote:A great many people think that the UK won't actually leave the UK; to Juncker and Farage's disappointment, the bridges haven't been burned yet.

Indeed.
And I have not said I believed Britain will leave.

Have you not heard about the potential 'false flag' operations going on north of the border.

However, come what may, in the meantime what we seem to have got is the national equivalent of rampant teenagers hosting a weekend house party of the sort posted on Facebook when the adults are away;
by the time the 'grownups' wake up and return the 'house' has been trashed. By now those teenagers from outside the 'family' have run off.

Whether or not anyone else now leaves for anywhere there's still (figuratively speaking) a stinking mess of white cider, funny fags, congealed latex goods, Pringles and vomit to clean up. Oh and a pair of rabbit ears (where do they get them from).

My tuppence'orth.

I think the relevant date that people like David Davis are referring to would be the date of the Brexit referendum. So, people who had come to the UK before the EU referendum in the good faith that the UK will remain will likely get to stay, but people who come after the results of the Brexit referendum were known but putting their foot in the door before it shuts firm, will not be allowed to stay.

Again, I believe that that will be subject to negotiations, but I believe that that would be the "fair play" line that David Davis and others will take.

Richard W wrote:A great many people think that the UK won't actually leave the UK; to Juncker and Farage's disappointment, the bridges haven't been burned yet.

I am one of those who believes that the UK won't actually leave the EU, but that there will be significant curbs on EU migration. There are elections/referendums in Austria, Hungary and Italy in the first week of October. They may be more determinitive of EU policy than the Brexit referendum. There are also suggestions that the Italian banks situation may be more disruptive to the EU than a potential Brexit. It is not improbable that by December this year, the EU may be much weaker than it is now. Elections in France and Germany next year could also change the EU negotiation position considerably.

secret.simon wrote:My tuppence'orth.

I think the relevant date that people like David Davis are referring to would be the date of the Brexit referendum. So, people who had come to the UK before the EU referendum in the good faith that the UK will remain will likely get to stay, but people who come after the results of the Brexit referendum were known but putting their foot in the door before it shuts firm, will not be allowed to stay.

I was thinking about the same as you before but here is why I think it wouldn't be. EU has already said that the freedom of movement would remain until UK remains in the EU and David Davis has already said that any agreement would have to be within the EU rules. If you go by the EU rule logic, then the cutoff date would be the date UK formally leaves the EU.

We still don't know what UK wants. If UK agrees to have single access with the freedom of movement then the whole argument of David is null and void.

He also mentions it would only be introduced if they noticed a surge in the migration.

I think if it goes through then the cutoff date would be the date UK formally invokes Article 50 or after that subject to EU negotiations.

secret.simon wrote:
There are elections/referendums in Austria, Hungary and Italy in the first week of October. They may be more determinitive of EU policy than the Brexit referendum. There are also suggestions that the Italian banks situation may be more disruptive to the EU than a potential Brexit.

Ireland now say they will leave the EU if Germany and France go after their low rate corporation tax, as they threatened last year that they would do.

http://www.msn.com/en-ie/money/news/eu- ... ar-AAhErX0

But Fine Gael MEP Brian Hayes told the Irish Independent: "That is the absolute red line issue. Any attempt made to cajole us [on corporation tax], as far as I'm concerned, we're out the door.

"We cannot be tied into an anti-business, anti-growth pact while the Brits are allowed to move on.

secret.simon wrote:
There are elections/referendums in Austria, Hungary and Italy in the first week of October. They may be more determinitive of EU policy than the Brexit referendum. There are also suggestions that the Italian banks situation may be more disruptive to the EU than a potential Brexit.

Ireland now say they will leave the EU if Germany and France go after their low rate corporation tax, as those two countries said last year that they would do.

http://www.msn.com/en-ie/money/news/eu- ... ar-AAhErX0

But Fine Gael MEP Brian Hayes told the Irish Independent: "That is the absolute red line issue. Any attempt made to cajole us [on corporation tax], as far as I'm concerned, we're out the door.

"We cannot be tied into an anti-business, anti-growth pact while the Brits are allowed to move on.

gillacious_505 wrote: We still don't know what UK wants. If UK agrees to have single access with the freedom of movement then the whole argument of David is null and void.

Like some other EEA countries, the UK is creaking under the strain of floods of immigrants.The UK will have control of immigration numbers and will control what they can have from the UK. It will not continue as it has been as it is not in British interests to let this carry on anymore.

As for some of the European Court rulings that allow criminals to live in the UK under EU laws...... I think you can say goodbye to those too. Germany already had studies carried out on free movement a few years ago, to look at deporting and banning criminals and to stop those who use free movement for better benefits.