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Hi all,

I haven't written on here for a while but was hoping to get some help with my situation.
I am a non EEA family member of a British/Danish national. We lived in Israel together and got married in January 2013. Straight after that we moved to the UK for a few months. Though I didn't quality for entry because of McCarthy I got a code 1A stamp when entering the country because of husband's Danish passport.
After four months he got a paid internship in Brussels and we moved there for 4.5 months. I studied French, he worked and we both obtained Belgian RCs. At this point he got a full time job offer in London so we moved to the UK exactly 4 years ago. I got another code1A stamp, applied for RC and received it.
Husband worked for most of this time, however he did spend 1 year as a student doing a PGCE and becoming a teacher. I had no idea I was supposed to have private health insurance during this time, I only read about it now!
I was going to apply for PR in a year. Does that fact that I didn't have CSI for one year mean I can't qualify for PR? In that case, what do I do when my RC expires in Nov 2018? I am so down and confused right now, I thought I could apply for PR in a year and my citizenship in 2 years, now I am starting to doubt if I want to live here at all, with Brexit and everything.
Would really appreciate your advice, this forum saved my life before, and I managed to get RC without any lawyer, and become an expert on SS thank to all of you wonderful people!

JulietSoul wrote: ↑

Sat Aug 26, 2017 4:33 pm

Husband worked for most of this time, however he did spend 1 year as a student doing a PGCE and becoming a teacher. I had no idea I was supposed to have private health insurance during this time, I only read about it now!

I was going to apply for PR in a year. Does that fact that I didn't have CSI for one year mean I can't qualify for PR?

If your husband is to be treated as having held permanent residence while studying, then there is no problem with CSI. The Eind judgement says that he was to be treated as holding permanent residence, but 2016 regulations contradict the judgement. I see three issues here:

(1) Do the 2016 regulations overrule Eind?
(2) If the answer to (1) is 'yes', does Eind still apply prior to the coming into force of the 2016 regulations?
(3) Does residence under the 2006 regulations that counted towards permanent residence still count towards permanent residence under the 2016 regulations?

I think the answer to (3) should be 'yes', but I can't justify my belief. Question 1 will be decided by the courts. I fear the same will apply to Question 2.

One worrying issue is that claims of permanent residence via SS appear to be being subjected to the 'centre of life' test. On the other hand, that might just be because the final period of qualifying residence would naturally come under the 2016 regulations.

Now, the requirement for the family members of a student to have CSI came in in 2015. It is possible that your husband may have ceased to be a student before they came in, in which case the requirement appears not to be an issue at all. In part this depends on the answer to question 3.

The UK government has proposed allowing settled status to family members of 'EU nationals' who have been resident for 5 years or more. The way the proposal is worded, 'EU nationals' would include such dual nationals as your husband (assuming he is still Danish), and you might even qualify in January 2018! Study the new regulations when and if they come out.

JulietSoul wrote: ↑

Sat Aug 26, 2017 4:33 pm

In that case, what do I do when my RC expires in Nov 2018?

If you don't qualify for settled status under the new rules, you apply for a new residence card. As it would be under the Surinder Singh rules, is it not at all clear how long it would be valid for.

JulietSoul wrote: ↑

Sat Aug 26, 2017 4:33 pm

I am so down and confused right now, I thought I could apply for PR in a year and my citizenship in 2 years, now I am starting to doubt if I want to live here at all, with Brexit and everything.

Actually, as soon as you have your permanent residence card, and the other requirements (English language, LitUK), you are eligible to apply for naturalisation on the basis of 3 years residence and being the spouse of a British citizen.

Indeed, as an Israeli citizen with an enforceable EEA right of entry, if you took a trip to the Republic of Ireland and came back without going anywhere else, you would in theory not need a residence card to apply for naturalisation. By virtue of the regulations for the common Travel Area, you would not be subject to any time limit on the length of your stay in the UK, and you would not be in breach of the immigration laws because of Surinder Singh. However, there may be a secret policy of refusing non-Irish nationals who only qualify for naturalisation because of the Common Travel Area arrangements, in particular the current version of Immigration (Control of Entry through Republic of Ireland) Order 1972, so you could lose your naturalisation fee if you tried this approach. (I expect this order to be revised before Brexit.) Note that the freedom from any time limit would be lost if you left the Common Travel Area.

Hi Richard,

Thanks so much for your response.
Unfortunately my husband was a student in 2016, so that doesn't technically excuse us from the new regulations. I just wonder how I was supposed to know about it!

As for the centre of life test - we were only in Brussels for 4 months, but we did not move there for the purpose of doing the SS route - my husband was applying for jobs in the UK as well as in other countries, and this was the only offer he had. The SS route was a bonus. We also had an intention of staying there for a while, it's just that a better offer came along. I hope that since I was already able to get an RC I would not fail to get PR just based on the length of time spent there.

I wasn't really able to understand your point about going to Ireland - what does that have to do with the amount of time I can stay? And you are saying that I wouldn't be able to then travel to Israel or other countries? That sadly would not work for me.

If the time passes and I see that I would fail to get PR because of the CSI issue, the Eind issue isn't resolved and new regulations don't help me, would I be able to apply for a spouse visa as the spouse of a British citizen? My husband is earning enough now. Or is that not a possibility? Would I then have to go back to Israel and apply?
We are thinking of having a child soon and this whole immigration thing is very stressful having that in mind. And of course we are both completely settled here and working!

This CSI issue is so ridiculous. The whole time I have been living here I have been working, contributing to the economy, and never claimed benefits or tax credits. They could have at least notified people about this requirement...

JulietSoul wrote: ↑

Sun Aug 27, 2017 7:49 pm

I wasn't really able to understand your point about going to Ireland - what does that have to do with the amount of time I can stay? And you are saying that I wouldn't be able to then travel to Israel or other countries? That sadly would not work for me.

The basic principle is that the Immigration Act 1971 does not affect travel from the Republic of Ireland to the UK. This is how the Irish come to be automatically settled on arrival in the UK from the Republic. Originally this privilege was restricted to the Irish, and non-visa nationals without visas got an automatic 3 months leave. The government doesn't like EEA nationals and their family members getting leave to remain, so in 2014 the privilege was extended to any unexcluded person with an enforceable EEA right of entry who was a non-visa nationals or a visa national with a visa valid for the UK. (Some Irish tourist visas are valid for entry to the UK.)

JulietSoul wrote: ↑

Sun Aug 27, 2017 7:49 pm

If the time passes and I see that I would fail to get PR because of the CSI issue, the Eind issue isn't resolved and new regulations don't help me, would I be able to apply for a spouse visa as the spouse of a British citizen? My husband is earning enough now. Or is that not a possibility? Would I then have to go back to Israel and apply?

Last time I looked, for an in-country application it sufficed that you did not have a short-term visa and were not in breach of the immigration laws. You should check the requirements in Appendix FM closer to the time, as this part of the rules changes frequently.

JulietSoul wrote: ↑

Sun Aug 27, 2017 7:49 pm

If the time passes
We are thinking of having a child soon and this whole immigration thing is very stressful having that in mind. And of course we are both completely settled here and working!

The government regards you as a temporary resident.

JulietSoul wrote: ↑

Sun Aug 27, 2017 7:49 pm

If the time passes
This CSI issue is so ridiculous. The whole time I have been living here I have been working, contributing to the economy, and never claimed benefits or tax credits. They could have at least notified people about this requirement...

Tut tut. If you did that nowadays you'd be committing a criminal offence. In fact, that law may have come in while your husband was a student...

Richard W wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 28, 2017 3:24 am

JulietSoul wrote: ↑

Sun Aug 27, 2017 7:49 pm

If the time passes
This CSI issue is so ridiculous. The whole time I have been living here I have been working, contributing to the economy, and never claimed benefits or tax credits. They could have at least notified people about this requirement...

Tut tut. If you did that nowadays you'd be committing a criminal offence. In fact, that law may have come in while your husband was a student...

As far as I can see, the new regulations which say that British people who did Surinder Singh need to be qualified persons (and therefore that what they do after moving to the UK matters at all) came in on November 2016 (link), which is after my husband became a student (and after he was a job seeker for over 6 months which I imagine is the same situation of a student, i.e. me needing CSI) - meaning there is no way I could have fulfilled these guidelines before they even existed! This situation is paradoxical. It used to be that to prove Surinder Singh all you needed to prove is regarding life in the other EU country, how can they change it retroactively for people who are already resident in the UK having completed the route?

Well it appears that the updated Surinder Singh guidelines, with their transitional arrangements, completely fix my problem!
Because my RC was issued prior to November 2016 my husband will be considered qualified up until that period - after which he has had a job, so I didn't need to have CSI at all!

Feeling very happy and relieved.

JulietSoul wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:25 pm

Well it appears that the updated Surinder Singh guidelines, with their transitional arrangements, completely fix my problem!
Because my RC was issued prior to November 2016 my husband will be considered qualified up until that period - after which he has had a job, so I didn't need to have CSI at all!

Feeling very happy and relieved.

Hi, can you provide a link to the government's updated SS guidlines, thanks

greatscott wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 13, 2017 6:14 pm

JulietSoul wrote: ↑

Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:25 pm

Well it appears that the updated Surinder Singh guidelines, with their transitional arrangements, completely fix my problem!
Because my RC was issued prior to November 2016 my husband will be considered qualified up until that period - after which he has had a job, so I didn't need to have CSI at all!

Feeling very happy and relieved.

Hi, can you provide a link to the government's updated SS guidlines, thanks

Guidelines link

Any update Juliet ?
Does claiming tax credit and child benefits have any negative impact on applying for PR with BC being self sufficiency ?
There is a gap of 3 months without CSI , will this also affect my application

Lenddeer wrote: ↑

Tue Sep 25, 2018 12:40 am

Any update Juliet ?
Does claiming tax credit and child benefits have any negative impact on applying for PR with BC being self sufficiency ?
There is a gap of 3 months without CSI , will this also affect my application

Hey, I have actually not yet applied for the PR though I will soon.
I don't know the answer to your question because those are very different circumstances from my own - the BC was not self sufficient and did not claim tax credit or child benefits.
I don't know about your CSI gap - this depends on whether you held RC before the specific date, as mentioned in the new guidelines.

Thank you for linking this thread in another post.

I am in the same situation as you but luckily, thanks to you, I just realised that the need for CSI coverage only begins to take effect from Nov 2016 onward (as we received RC before Dec 13). My husband had a job by then which is a relief! I am going to apply again soon and hopefully won't get refused this time! Did you find anywhere on the application that you had to add your partner's work data from Nov 2016 onward? If not did you just include their P60s with your application and supporting documents?

Thank you

So happy to hear this thread helped someone!
I officially gained PR in December
I did indeed add some of my husband's payslips since Nov 2016 as well as a letter from his employer (where he's been working since then).
Good luck!